# Firearms and Shooting > Firearms, Optics and Accessories >  All joking aside,

## gimp

It's a shame that the Remington 700 isn't very good. They're quite a handsome rifle, good slim lines. Real pity that they're dreadful.

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## deer243

What a load of shit

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## gimp

> What a load of shit


I guess not everyone can agree that they're a good looking rifle.

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## Barefoot

Slow day on the Coast is it gimp?

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## gimp

> Slow day on the Coast is it gimp?


I was going to build some shelves but this seemed more productive

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## tui_man2

Should have come out the range amd ring some steel she was good morning for it

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## gimp

Yeah epic day for it, give us a yell next time you're going, shooting steel would have been an improvement from spilling brake fluid all over my kitchen floor

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## crnkin

Yeah, I agree. 

The 7 is almost as good as a Tikka IMHO.

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## madjon_

> Yeah epic day for it, give us a yell next time you're going, shooting steel would have been an improvement from spilling brake fluid all over my kitchen floor


Still using then? :Grin:

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## kimjon

What's not to like? For 1/3 the initial cost of a sako you can afford to buy one, and then add a perfect fitting stock and a match grade barrel and still have change left over to buy some reloading dies and brass and still come in cheaper than the sako's purchase price and you now have a lighter and more accurate rifle.

Kj

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## deer243

> I guess not everyone can agree that they're a good looking rifle.


Clearly is bored and put up a troll post but i take the bait  :Thumbsup: .  Its always good to know the "dreadful" rem 700 is very popular and is the best selling production hunting sporter in history. Still in use by some police and military snipers and for a simple, reasonable cheap rifle that been working for the last 53 years with the most calbres avaiable ,has one of the most dependable actions and is generally darn accurate not bad for something thats clearly "dreadful" for its low price :Thumbsup:  and the best after market parts avaliable

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## gimp

> Clearly is bored and put up a troll post but i take the bait .  Its always good to know the "dreadful" rem 700 is very popular and is the best selling production hunting sporter in history. Still in use by some police and military snipers and for a simple, reasonable cheap rifle that been working for the last 53 years with the most calbres avaiable ,has one of the most dependable actions and is generally darn accurate not bad for something thats clearly "dreadful" for its low price and the best after market parts avaliable


please don't troll

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## jakewire

I like mine.
Liked it enough to withdraw it from sale.

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## BRADS

> What's not to like? For 1/3 the initial cost of a sako you can afford to buy one, and then add a perfect fitting stock and a match grade barrel and still have change left over to buy some reloading dies and brass and still come in cheaper than the sako's purchase price and you now have a lighter and more accurate rifle.
> 
> Kj


Then you just have a Remington that owes you lots is still ugly and is now worthless cause it's custom

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## gimp

> Then you just have a Remington that owes you lots is still ugly and is now worthless cause it's custom


and the gunsmith fucked it up, so you have to pay an extra $1000 for another barrel. and it's never a sako.

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## crnkin

say-co or sar-co?

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## gimp

Socko

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## crnkin

ooohhhhhh


k

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## Beavis

I like mine.

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## Huk

> It's a shame that the Remington 700 isn't very good. They're quite a handsome rifle, good slim lines. Real pity that they're dreadful.


Like my rem model 7 never had any issues with it in over 20 years shot lots n lots of all kind of game

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## hunter308

nothing wrong with my remmy700 i like it and i don't care what people think

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## Monsterbishi

I like my 700, it's just like me - reliable, accurate but at the same time, rough, slightly ugly and a touch on the heavy side...

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## kimjon

I'm from the "don't tell me, show me" school of thought. To date I've been out shot by a few guys with standard sako rifles out to about 400 to maybe 500m. The reason for this is simple, I'm not the best shooter around and it's the man behind the rifle beating me every time... Aka Baghera 

Beyond 500m I can't think of anyone using a bog standard sako ever out shooting me. The reason for this is equally simple, my custom rem700 shoots better than a standard sako does, so I now have the advantage even though many others are much better shots than I am. Their equipment is now limiting them.

Now a custom sako is another story... Enter Gillie who will hand you a beating every time with his custom made sako, this is because it's now a level playing field again (both rifles are just as capable as each other) and it's the person who's simply better at shooting that wins.

Kj

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## Kiwi Greg

> and the gunsmith fucked it up, so you have to pay an extra $1000 for another barrel. and it's never a sako.


You really did have some bad experiences  :Oh Noes:

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## Bugger That

I agree with Gimp. My Rem 700 6 x 47 is absolute crap! Just look at this pathetic .3 group. I've had enough. Tried everything and not once has it got in the .1. Ive chucked it to the back of the cabinet and it can stay there for all I care.

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## MSL

I'd be gutted also, it's not even in the centre


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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## Gillie

> I'm from the "don't tell me, show me" school of thought. To date I've been out shot by a few guys with standard sako rifles out to about 400 to maybe 500m. The reason for this is simple, I'm not the best shooter around and it's the man behind the rifle beating me every time... Aka Baghera
> 
> Beyond 500m I can't think of anyone using a bog standard sako ever out shooting me. The reason for this is equally simple, my custom rem700 shoots better than a standard sako does, so I now have the advantage even though many others are much better shots than I am. Their equipment is now limiting them.
> 
> Now a custom sako is another story... Enter Gillie who will hand you a beating every time with his custom made sako, this is because it's now a level playing field again (both rifles are just as capable as each other) and it's the person who's simply better at shooting that wins.
> 
> Kj


 :Have A Nice Day:  This is hardly a fair comparison Kim! There are so many variables at play that to limit your comparison to rifle brand is simply unrealistic. In my experience it is almost always the shooter that makes the difference and not the rifle. There are a couple of games that the rifle has a big influence on e.g. benchrest and F-class, but they still need a good shooter to drive them well.

To me it is simple - if you want a dirty, crappy Remington with their quality control so good that you're just as likely to be able to fire a 270 in your so called 308 - get one then. If you want a blaser with its plastic washer, stupid slam shut action and drop out mag that also drops out the trigger - then get one. If you want a savage with its god ugly bolt - then get one. If you want a plastic fantastic tikka or a kimber with their horrible stock design - then go ahead and get one. But if you want a elegant, beautifully made, practical, reliable, accurate rifle out of the box with a great, user adjustable trigger and a flush fitting, drop out, double stack mag that you can also feed through the action in a rifle that will hold it value - then get a sako cause you can garun-fu#kin-tee it will do all this, make you look cool, cook you dinner, walk your dog and still find the time to magically hit the target every time you wave it generally in the right direction. Just don't take them in the hills - you might scratch it and forever after every time you look at it, you will feel it judging you!  :Thumbsup: 


Bottom line, as long as you are comfortable with your rifle, you shoot it well, and it does what you want it to then who cares what it is and what others think about it!  :Grin:  

BTW, this post might be slightly bias because just as Kim is a Remington fan, I might be a slight sako fan

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## gimp

> Just don't take them in the hills - you might scratch it and forever after every time you look at it, you will feel it judging you!


aw

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## outdoorlad

That's probably the only fault of the finnlight, the stocks aren't super durable.

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## Gillie

Don't worry gimp, you get used to it. I have about 5 of them - all with various scratches and dings. They all judge me but i didn't buy them to look at - they all get a fair amount of use!

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## gimp

Yeah that rubber ST coating is garbage but I also don't really care if it rubs off because it doesn't actually do anything much

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## PerazziSC3

I was thinking about the resale thing the other day. Talking round rrp figures and then what I see on trademe and also talking rifles sold in good condition.
Sako 85 new $3000, will be had for $2000 on trademe = 33% loss
Tikka t3 new $1200, will be had for $900 on trademe = 25% loss

You can actually get a 2nd hand sako for cheaper than that usually as well...

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## gadgetman

> I was thinking about the resale thing the other day. Talking round rrp figures and then what I see on trademe and also talking rifles sold in good condition.
> Sako 85 new $3000, will be had for $2000 on trademe = 33% loss
> Tikka t3 new $1200, will be had for $900 on trademe = 25% loss
> 
> You can actually get a 2nd hand sako for cheaper than that usually as well...


And when you buy second hand and sell second hand it makes no difference.

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## kimjon

> This is hardly a fair comparison Kim! There are so many variables at play that to limit your comparison to rifle brand is simply unrealistic. In my experience it is almost always the shooter that makes the difference and not the rifle. There are a couple of games that the rifle has a big influence on e.g. benchrest and F-class, but they still need a good shooter to drive them well.
> 
> To me it is simple - if you want a dirty, crappy Remington with their quality control so good that you're just as likely to be able to fire a 270 in your so called 308 - get one then. If you want a blaser with its plastic washer, stupid slam shut action and drop out mag that also drops out the trigger - then get one. If you want a savage with its god ugly bolt - then get one. If you want a plastic fantastic tikka or a kimber with their horrible stock design - then go ahead and get one. But if you want a elegant, beautifully made, practical, reliable, accurate rifle out of the box with a great, user adjustable trigger and a flush fitting, drop out, double stack mag that you can also feed through the action in a rifle that will hold it value - then get a sako cause you can garun-fu#kin-tee it will do all this, make you look cool, cook you dinner, walk your dog and still find the time to magically hit the target every time you wave it generally in the right direction. Just don't take them in the hills - you might scratch it and forever after every time you look at it, you will feel it judging you! 
> 
> 
> Bottom line, as long as you are comfortable with your rifle, you shoot it well, and it does what you want it to then who cares what it is and what others think about it!  
> 
> BTW, this post might be slightly bias because just as Kim is a Remington fan, I might be a slight sako fan


I reckon it's a fair comparison if comparing cost of the two rifles. You can have a standard sako or a better shooting modified Remington for the same cost. A standard Remington is a pretty hit and miss affair in regards to accuracy, but throw on a shillen barrel and true the action, pick a stock of your choice and your still under $3k.

I totally agree it's always the shooter that is the biggest variable, no arguments there.

And yes I'm totally bias on this, but it not that I don't own any sako's as I do... I just never use them as they rust like fuck and weigh 2lb more than my Remington does, so my bias is based on experience.

Kj

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## kimjon

One of the skeletons in my closet  



Sako in .308.... Yes I'm not proud, but we all have dirty secretes

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## veitnamcam

> One of the skeletons in my closet �� 
> 
> 
> 
> Sako in .308.... Yes I'm not proud, but we all have dirty secretes��


You can get s/s ones that dont "rust like fuck"  :Wink:

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## madjon_

> One of the skeletons in my closet 😀 
> 
> 
> 
> Sako in .308.... Yes I'm not proud, but we all have dirty secretes😉


You don't see wood like that on a remington but. :Grin:

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## moonhunt

I have been wanting a sako since I was 16

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## jakewire

> aw


It's Fucked, you'd better get a new one.

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## Blaser

> I reckon it's a fair comparison if comparing cost of the two rifles. You can have a standard sako or a better shooting modified Remington for the same cost. A standard Remington is a pretty hit and miss affair in regards to accuracy, but throw on a shillen barrel and true the action, pick a stock of your choice and your still under $3k.
> 
> I totally agree it's always the shooter that is the biggest variable, no arguments there.
> 
> And yes I'm totally bias on this, but it not that I don't own any sako's as I do... I just never use them as they rust like fuck and weigh 2lb more than my Remington does, so my bias is based on experience.
> 
> Kj


so after the custom work ditching the remington parts you only have 1/3 of a remington, thats why it shoots better!!!!

LOL

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## kimjon

> so after the custom work ditching the remington parts you only have 1/3 of a remington, thats why it shoots better!!!!
> 
> LOL


Yes, that's what's so great about them as just like an ar15 they are big boys Lego. Now if I were to get a sako to fit and shoot as well with the same treatment you be out of pocket by >$5K plus.

Kj

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## kimjon

> You don't see wood like that on a remington but.


You won't find walnut like that on a standard sako either, my brother made that stock for me, as the sako stocks are really short. In LOP. I must say I did a nice job of it too! At least it fits me now unlike before

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## veitnamcam

> You won't find walnut like that on a standard sako either, my brother made that stock for me, *as the sako stocks are really short. In LOP. I must say I did a nice job of it too! At least it fits me now unlike before*��


Really? most people find them long. I dont know the measurements but whenever I pick up a rem or kimber especially they feel really short,almost kids rifle short.

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## gimp

Sako stocks are the same length as everything else, 13.5 inch ish LOP


Blaser is long as hell, like 14.5"

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## BRADS

I here your problem kimjon sakos are very inaccurate in fact on Saturday one of mine only put 3 shots into one hole at 490yards I mean seriously that's just shit a!

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## gimp

> yards


Ah, found your problem

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## Blaser

> I here your problem kimjon sakos are very inaccurate in fact on Saturday one of mine only put 3 shots into one hole at 490yards I mean seriously that's just shit a!


Nah, there was only one hole because, the other 2 shots missed the target all together!!!!

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## veitnamcam

A quick google puts the Sako lop at 14.5- 14.25" R700 at 13 and 3/8" model 7 12.5"  kimber 84m 13.64"

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## gimp

google is wrong. I don't have a 700 to measure (because they're bad) but it's much the same. Model 7 number is for a youth model I'd guess, the adult ones are normal sized - mid 13 inch.

https://www.google.co.nz/search?clie...7TGcru8wfTu4Bw

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## veitnamcam

OK THEY FEEL SHORTER TO ME  :Grin:

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## gimp

The 75 is fractionally longer.

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## Gillie

> Beyond 500m I can't think of anyone using a bog standard sako ever out shooting me. The reason for this is equally simple, my custom rem700 shoots better than a standard sako does, so I now have the advantage even though many others are much better shots than I am. Their equipment is now limiting them.


It isn't a fair comparison because you can't know this - all you know is you are better with your rifle than they are with theirs on that day. By your own admission that is less a measure of the rifle than it is the shooter. The shoots you are talking about 1MOA accuracy is about all you need as long as your wind call is up to the task. An off the shelf sako is guaranteed to go MOA or less...

...

You know what? I wrote big reply rebutting a bunch of things you said and then deleted it because it simply doesn't matter to me if you think your Remington is more accurate for the money than my Sako... i like my Sako, i am comfortable with it and with what i paid for it, i shoot it ok and it does what i want it to - as i said above, once you get there you stop caring what others think. I do think you are basing your argument on some fuzzy logic but hey, sweetas. 

 :Thumbsup:

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## Gillie

BTW the sako stocks vary in length a bit by as much as about an inch. Of course i can only speak for their wood stocks i haven't measured their synthetic ones.

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## Munsey

> Sako stocks are the same length as everything else, 13.5 inch ish LOP
> 
> 
> Blaser is long as hell, like 14.5"


That's because you need deep pockets to own one

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## Barefoot

> Blaser is long as hell, like 14.5"


Hacksaw sorted that out week 2  :Grin: 

It's adding LOP that's a bitch.

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## Nick-D

Think the old remmy 700 is a good design, just a pity it is now being put together by a company that prioritises cost over quality. You will still get good ones, but QC is expensive and hence buying a remmy 700 has become somwhat of a lottery. Just buy a tikka or a savage for the same dosh that has a much higher chance of being a proper shooter and nowa days the aftermarket support is getting pretty damn good. Expecially as the yanks have latched onto the T3's

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## gadgetman

> Think the old remmy 700 is a good design, just a pity it is now being put together by a company that prioritises cost over quality. You will still get good ones, but QC is expensive and hence buying a remmy 700 has become somwhat of a lottery. Just buy a tikka or a savage for the same dosh that has a much higher chance of being a proper shooter and nowa days the aftermarket support is getting pretty damn good. Expecially as the yanks have latched onto the T3's


But those Savages are ugly.



Savage weather warrior 243 Win, Mueller ATP scope, Gunworks suppressor, 100m. Factory barrel, factory trigger, factory stock, ... The ragged hole is three shots after adjusting zero.

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## stub

You adjusted it the wrong way

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## gadgetman

I adjusted it a little further the wrong way. Don't want to risk damaging my dots.

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## steven

tika's are far better looking and better made

</troll>

 :XD:

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## marky123

I'd put my howa 3006 up against a remington any day.
If anyone in Hawkes Bay has a large farm with gongs going back to 1000 m, a remington,a kettle,comfy shooting positions,a quad,maybe some goats,a wind meter,a chronograph,lots of food then I'd gladly meet them and have a shoot off.
MARK

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