# Hunting > Firearm Safety >  Not getting shot or shooting someone by mistake

## CMe

I am keen to hear from other hunters who have had near misses with either being shot at or near to or have accidentally shot at or near to another hunter/person believing they were a deer/pig.
I have had 2 close calls, both with me being the shooter. One right hard on dark at absolutely minimal light on a heavily used deer track where I knew a good Sambar stag came out on dusk. Fortunately I held off when a tramper walked up the track so close to dark he was within 15 metres before I could tell him from a deer. Finger was on the trigger ready to go. Gave me a hell of a shock as had never seen anyone in there before.
Other time I missed the first shot and the animal ran 20 metres and stopped to look back. Fired second time and heard a yell as my mate had the projectile whiz over his head as he was fortunately behind but below the animal. Again, absolute shock on my part that I had come so close to dealing to someone.
 In both of my cases it was totally my fault the situation occurred. I accept that. I also know that this stuff happens and the longer you hunt the more likely it is to happen. What I also know is that if all of us were wearing something that allowed us to more readily differentiate us from the background I would not have been aiming in that direction.  So , I have been working on a cap with red flashing waterproof LED's on it-(deer don't see red ) and run off a rechargeable battery ( minute but lasts 60 hrs) . What I don't know is whether hunters will actually use them- other than me and my mates who would rather come home than worry about looking cool when no one is there to see anyway other than the guy that might shoot you or your kid. I am after feedback to decide whether to get them made in a commercial quantity or to just make a few for me and mine. So if you have had an "incident"  I am keen to hear about it as no one has any real idea of how often such things happen and any opinion on whether you think the target ( could be a deer on a hunters back) would not have been one if wearing a flashing red LED hat much appreciated.
Thanks

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## greghud

and while your at it, public admit to any other firearms related crimes you have been involved in. armed hold ups, robery etc..............
lets let everyone know just how dangerous ALL firearms owners are.  :36 1 5: 
greg

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## gimp

Reporting minor incidents raises awareness of safety and decreases major incidents.

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## stu#71

"Identify your target BEYOND ALL DOUBT" instantly springs to mind !!

Mate, your post makes you sounds like you are a walking disaster waiting to happen!

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## BRADS

Hunting from the track with your finger on the trigger what the fuck???

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## R93

Good on ya for posting your mistakes. We can all learn from them.
A deer run is different to a public track and I know plenty that I wouldn't expect to see someone either.
Been shot at a few times but that wasn't by mistake. Ha Ha 
 Only ever had one sort of a close call when hunting sika on public land in the NI. Wasn't that close to worth a mention. I genuinely feel sorry for what NI hunters have to deal with as far as area to hunt and too many hunters in an area.
I spose I am lucky to have areas to hunt that I can be reasonably sure no one else is there due to their access and location.
I also like to get a very good look at an animal before I consider shooting it.
Not just for a safety point of view but as value to me as meat or trophy.


Deer may not see colour but they will see a flashing LED no matter what the colour IMHO 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk. So please forgive my sausage fingers!!!

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## Maca49

I've to my knowledge have never had or caused a scary moment, unless theirs a body in the bush that know one knows about. Gimp your right, I think a lot of near misses ain't reported because of the embarrassment, looking bad, etc as bad as this sounds I hope Cme learns valuable lessons, reads more on safety or gets shit from this forum that he will take to heart and improve his skills. Head in the sand doesn't work, unless your hunting Ostriches

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## Munsey

Give him some credit , sure sounds less than ideal but a least he knows he's done bad . I've had numerous deer use tramping tracks as there path way to come to and investigate our roaring . I would shoot a deer off a track ,ie accros into bush or a slip on a face etc . Safer than being in the bush and not knowing the track was just below you and shoot at a deer .

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## gimp

He says it was a deer track, not that it was a tramping track.

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## Munsey

My bad

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## kimjon

Just as long as its not a wind up from an anti-gun person trying to get genuine hunters to state how ''unsafe they are'' on a public forum? I agree that we can always learn from our mistakes, but I have never personally felt in danger on public land from another hunter. I've been tricked a couple times during the roar, as too have I roared in a few hunters and we all made the correct desisions about target ID and had a chuckel about it when the penny dropped.

The only issues I've ever had with firearms safety was: 

1) with an American client overseas who discharged a firearm inside a vehicle (and blew my ear-drums) when I was guiding in the UK.
2) And (as luck would have it another American) an ex-boss of mine who was ''ex-army'' but I think he was just a con-artist and a total fuckwit with firearms, nearly shot me and another team mate on more than one occation. He was sacked from our team and police notified of his unsafe behavour.

kj

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## BRADS

Yes on reading again it says deer track.
But if I was that tramper and came round the corner to some dude pointing at gun at me with his finger on the trigger I would of kicked the shit out off him.
Just my opinion, but don't put your finger on the trigger until you NO it's a* DEER*

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## gimp

Yes, finger never on the trigger except when firing, is something that is not taught in NZ but definitely should be.


Edit: really hardly any safety is taught in NZ, the culture is not very safe in general, at least in my experience. It's considered 'soft' or 'gay'

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## Twoshotkill

"One right hard on dark at absolutely minimal light "???????

The red flashing light hat????? in daylight????

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## CMe

Good to see the discussion on it. Yep it was a deer only track leading into a bedding area and I had only found it by following the stag I was after back from his feeding areas so I knew the area very well having hunted it a lot. Like most deer, it was well away from any tracks used by humans. The tramper walked past at 3 metres and did not even see me. I was just thankful that I was actively looking for a sign it was not a deer as I am lead to believe most shootings occur when the hunter is already believing the approaching "thing" IS a deer.  
When it comes to shooting over my mate. He had moved position out of my line of sight. The animal had run at an angle across and onto a slightly elevated position. 
I have been peppered many times by duck shooters when I am hunting ducks so I know incidents happen far more often than the media gets to hear about. 
On the issue of red being seen. Sorry, if you don;t have the receptors for red you don;t see it no matter whether it is flashing or not. The new wildlife cameras are fitted with "black flashes" which humans do not see.   These are just further into the infra red zone where we don't see but the ccd's in the cameras do. X rays are the same. They see through you but we don't see them because we don't have receptors for them. X ray film does.
With the red lights in day light. Most people shot are shot under poor light in the bush. The fact is that as many hunters are shot in the US now that they use blaze orange as when they didn't. That is because in the bush blaze orange is not blaze orange any more. It can only reflect light that hits it. Trees absorb much of the red into their leaves. ( Chlorophyll is green because it absorbs the red part of the white light from the sun but not green. so if there is not much red under the forest canopy, blaze orange becomes a murky yellow compared to what it is in the open. Ask any diver about it. A torch transforms the sea floor into a colourful wonderland instead of dull green/yellow simply because all the red light gets filtered out by the water first.
While I don't think people should have to protect themselves by wearing a flashing red hat. I do know that less accidents happen when people drive with their headlights on in the daytime. The earlier you see someone in the bush the less likely they are to be either targeted or in line with a target. Have a good one

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## Rock river arms hunter

A handy hint: wear blue in the bush,not super extravagent and super bright but a darkish aqua always does the trick.nothing else looks like it and in no way can be mistaken otherwise.

was at work and had to find one of the other guys to help set traps, i had a blaze orange fleece on with blue kathmandu l/s thermals on underneath, in realitively dense bush. my colleague said the blue stuck out like dogs !@#$% and the blaze orange not so much.

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## Toby

Got told same thing from msc guy. Blue better then blaze

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## 30calterry

not sayn its impossible to accidently shot someone, accidents happen,butif you r aiming at a spot on a deer to humanely and quicky kill it (so you dont have to walk to far cause walkn is overated) . and assuming most hunters can shot under lets say 2 inch at 100 and most deer r taken at less than 100 in nz 80% was last figure i was told , how would this ever happen? .as for shotn ur buddy it should neva happen with my shotn mate the last person that shot one follows with  rifle  on back and made safe watchn and spotting (thats unless the mrs goes though with that get half the insurance money deal HAPPY   hahaha)

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## Spanners

I believe HOT PINK is the colour - seriously
We were rabbit shooting the other week - everyone wearing blaze to some degree. My bro was wearing the Mrs Hot Pink lay vest and it was alot more obvious than the orange was

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## big_foot

Yea as gay as it sounds hot pink or "dazzle melon" as it has been refered to seems to be the brightest in the bush.

We also use blue paint because as earlier mentioned nothing else in the bush is similar.

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## Rock river arms hunter

one thing i know for certain is when i finally get a puppy,I'll be making a bright blue vest for it! I'd like to see a push for more research into alternative safety colours

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## big_foot

Id be keen to see how blue stands out compared to the blaze colours.

Highlighter yellow is still common in the forestry and is absolute rubbish, after a couple of months its more camo than anything else, the orange isn't much better.

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## dogmatix

> Id be keen to see how blue stands out compared to the blaze colours.
> 
> Highlighter yellow is still common in the forestry and is absolute rubbish, after a couple of months its more camo than anything else, the orange isn't much better.


Highlighter yellow is useless even when clean in the bush.
Looks just like bright sunlight on light coloured leaves.

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## sakokid

i do wot R 93 does, have a dam good look first, i want to see head legs arse all moving together as part of an animal, not just bits! And another thing, just on dark thats where BLAZE orange comes into its own.  quite simply.... you glow!

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## Maca49

> I believe HOT PINK is the colour - seriously
> We were rabbit shooting the other week - everyone wearing blaze to some degree. My bro was wearing the Mrs Hot Pink lay vest and it was alot more obvious than the orange was


Bunch of horny bastards oh ah pink

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## Dead is better

I like you're idea of a light flashing hat (the light on the start of the "Loaded Gun" came to mind haha) 

Just make sure it doesn't look like deers eyes to a spot-lighter. Just as likely to get shot. Maybe more so

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## 30calterry

isnt this whole bright coloured clothing thing like covering a boil with a band aid the green puss always ozzes out round the side , the problem isnt the clothing its the way people are shooting , i dont know the answer but think we need to address the main cause and not just try prevent the result! identify your target and its back round

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## Andrew46826

After working in the bush with a lot of different coloured markers (even a very dark red) I have to say pink stands out a lot more than either yellow, orange, red or blue.

I have been side by side with a mate in tight bush where it was quite dark and thought that could easily be mistaken for a deer. I don't understand why blaze orange was ever thought to be a good idea. We all know what a red deer looks like at this time of year. And in the bush it's very similar to blaze orange under a dark canopy.

I refuse to wear blaze orange personally, I'd rather not be seen at all.

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## Happy

> isnt this whole bright coloured clothing thing like covering a boil with a band aid the green puss always ozzes out round the side , the problem isnt the clothing its the way people are shooting , i dont know the answer but think we need to address the main cause and not just try prevent the result! identify your target and its back round


Nah I reckon I d like to get some pics of you in the bush dressed up in Pink as the revolutionary trialist of a great idea.. 

Then Id post them on this and every other forum in the world that I could find...

David Rabbitborough would be over to suss out NZ s new species... Plus it would be fuckin funny as ....

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## Ryan

Yup, that's what I mentioned in another thread where "best colours" were discussed. Can't remember the thread but some people recommended wearing blue. I disagree with this colour due its propensity to appear grey in lowlight conditions (even light / powder / peace keeper blue).




> I believe HOT PINK is the colour - seriously
> We were rabbit shooting the other week - everyone wearing blaze to some degree. My bro was wearing the Mrs Hot Pink lay vest and it was alot more obvious than the orange was

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## Dundee

Blaze matches NZ bush sun up or sun down

Courtesy too Lethal this last pic

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## Dundee

Yah might be fooled that theres a guy with a rifle in blaze in the centre but nope just pines.

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## Dundee

I've been shot at! Thats why i'm putting these pics up again they did appear in another thread but who cares safety first!!

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## veitnamcam

Not a common right in nz NATIVE bush.
Pine tree bark is red any way. Colours in my bush is black or green. Regardless of light.
In open country blaze is upbeatable. Iv picked out our forum beanie in blaze at first glance over 2 k away without even needing binos.

In my bush i usually wear black pants green top.

I won't argue that old dirty or faded blaze cant look the same colour as a deer cos it sure can.

Sent from my GT-S5360T using Tapatalk 2

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## Lentil

I'm still gonna wear blaze - the more the better, and as bright as I can get it. Stands out like Rushy at a "One Direction" concert. Just a faded blaze beanie is dangerous. Besides - we need to think about how the deer perceive the colour blue.

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## Lentil

> I believe HOT PINK is the colour - seriously
> We were rabbit shooting the other week - everyone wearing blaze to some degree. My bro was wearing the Mrs Hot Pink lay vest and it was alot more obvious than the orange was


Thats cos everyone was looking at him in his pink "vest"  - he woulda stood out alright!

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## Spanners

> Thats cos everyone was looking at him in his pink "vest"  - he woulda stood out alright!


'*Clay* Vest'  :Grin: 
What stands out is something thats completely out of place
As Cam said, blaze in tussock is unmistakable, as is blaze on a riverbed, but in the bush, we need a colour thats COMPLETELY out of place, and I think Hot Fluro Pink is it.
Get past the whole 'I'm a man and cant wear pink' mentality and I think we are onto a winner safety wise.
When I'm home and next out, I might take out some diff colours for pics

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## Lentil

> '*Clay* Vest' 
> What stands out is something thats completely out of place
> As Cam said, blaze in tussock is unmistakable, as is blaze on a riverbed, but in the bush, we need a colour thats COMPLETELY out of place, and I think Hot Fluro Pink is it.
> Get past the whole 'I'm a man and cant wear pink' mentality and I think we are onto a winner safety wise.
> When I'm home and next out, I might take out some diff colours for pics


Hey - I will wear any colour to make me safer. I get enough ribbing now for my glowing orange appearance. As long as it doesnt glow to the deer, I will wear pink if thats wot is safest.

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## Lentil

> '*Clay* Vest'


I was wondering how I could get the mrs one of those Lay Vests. :Pacman:

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## Spanners

> I was wondering how I could get the mrs one of those Lay Vests.


They are usually expensive and involve diamonds  :Grin:

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## Andrew46826

How many people have been shot wearing blaze orange? I believe the last guy was wearing a blaze orange cap. And from what I remember there were others too. 

I personally refuse to wear it. I am currently in the process of looking at these - Pink BlazeMost Wanted Vintage | Fresh vintage clothing from Wellington, New Zealand

 :Wtfsmilie:

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## Lentil

> How many people have been shot wearing blaze orange? I believe the last guy was wearing a blaze orange cap. And from what I remember there were others too. 
> 
> I personally refuse to wear it.


I agree that a blaze orange cap alone is not good, particularly the dull beanie type. Full dazzle blaze orange really does stand out in the bush, even in low light. If some fuckwit is going to shoot me in the amount of blaze I wear, then I fear he would shoot anyone in any colour - probably shooting at sound and movement. Anyhow, I am more likely to die in my car heading to my hunting spot.

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## CMe

So this thread died with my last post. In the gap in time I have been busy designing and making the flashing red lighted cap as I really believe it will make the difference in the excitement of the moment. It also has down lights in white for following tracks but without losing your peripheral night vision. I have tested them by putting them beside deer trails and had the deer walk past without even looking at them. Hoping to get some marketing out very soon as hopefully they will stop someone shooting you while you are carrying your deer out or roaring for your mate. Won;t stop the guy getting shot while crossing the fence though!! If it will take testing it yourself to prove the deer don;t see it and you don;t want to mess up your roar if I am wrong, just have the guy roaring wear it. That way some other guy won't shoot him or her! Stoney Creek will have them under the logo CMe. What else! Rechargeable too so you won;t have to much about with expensive tiny batteries. Keen to get any feedback on how easy it is to keep an eye on your mates position with it as any chance to improve it or know where it does/does not help will help the design. Safe hunting and good luck for the roar.

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## Bavarian_Hunter

You're actually thinking of infrared (different wavelength to red), deer aren't fully colourblind as lots of people believe and actually research has shown the colour they're most easily able to distinguish is blue (i know some people here won't like or believe it). Red, green, orange and yellow appear as shades of grey to deer.
By all means try your flashing light, but to a deer its going to look like, well, a flashing light.
Do some research on it its all out there, many studies have been done on deer vision (mostly in North America) and a simple google search will fill you in on it. 

Blaze is tried and tested and works. but as its a shade of grey they still see it so a simple blaze camo will break up the monotony of a single colour and blend you in a bit better. The one that you get from say ridgeline with a blaze hat is what I have mostly used. Though I've just moved to this Australian shirt thats bottom half camo, top half blaze looks and works great. 

I have read thats its recommended not to wash hunting clothes with those colour enhancing washing liquids. They're full of UV which, though we cant see will shimmer to a deer. There is no concrete evidence on that though, its just a theory going around.

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## JoshC

Sorted. Boys in gear that's tight, bright and pink...just how you North Islanders like it...

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## Happy

Handsome boy friend you have there Josh...   :Grin:   :Thumbsup:

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## Toby

I thought about a small box type thing that beeps when it's within a certain range of any other box and that it is required by law to have and caught without one means a nice time in jail to think about what you've done wrong

Or identify your target or whatever  :Have A Nice Day:

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## JoshC

> Handsome boy friend you have there Josh...


I knew you'd be jealous Happy

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## Rushy

> I knew you'd be jealous Happy


He's not jealous Josh. He is just pissed that the bitch left him. Ha ha ha ha

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## Happy

> He's not jealous Josh. He is just pissed that the bitch left him. Ha ha ha ha


He was dribbling.  Must have been Full Up ....   :Thumbsup: 

Seriously I not that gay but I reckon my boyfriend may be ...

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## Rushy

> He was dribbling.  Must have been Full Up ....  
> 
> Seriously I not that gay but I reckon my boyfriend may be ...


Ha ha ha ha I am cackling like a brooding hen after that.

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## Mick666

Seems a USAir employee with the last name of Gay was flying on a company pass. Mr. Gay found a man in his seat and sat elsewhere. Since the plane turned out to be overbooked, a ticket agent approached the man in Mr. Gay's assigned seat and asked "Are you Gay?" When the bewildered man nodded that he was gay, the agent said, "Well, get your things, you'll have to get off. 

The real Mr. Gay overheard and quickly interrupted, "I'm Gay." The agent told him he'd have to leave the plane at which another passenger, observing this whole scene, announced defiantly, "I'm gay, too. Heck, you can't throw us all off."

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## Bavarian_Hunter

I can't help but feel the integrity has been lost in this thread....Rushy!!!  :Grin:

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## Rushy

Wasn't me.  JoshC ad Happy ought to know by now that if they post stuff like that then I am going to take the piss.  OK back on track now.

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## Rushy

> Seems a USAir employee with the last name of Gay was flying on a company pass. Mr. Gay found a man in his seat and sat elsewhere. Since the plane turned out to be overbooked, a ticket agent approached the man in Mr. Gay's assigned seat and asked "Are you Gay?" When the bewildered man nodded that he was gay, the agent said, "Well, get your things, you'll have to get off. 
> 
> The real Mr. Gay overheard and quickly interrupted, "I'm Gay." The agent told him he'd have to leave the plane at which another passenger, observing this whole scene, announced defiantly, "I'm gay, too. Heck, you can't throw us all off."


Mick I have to say it has been hilarious having you aboard so far.  Keep it up man. Er sorry BH.

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## Mick666

> Mick I have to say it has been hilarious having you aboard so far.  Keep it up man. Er sorry BH.


Thanks @Rushy, I'm enjoying being involved, I think this is a quite special place  :Have A Nice Day:  no offence but both meanings apply! I won't hijack this thread anymore, but soon I will try to articulate on my own thread what it is that makes this forum and it's members so great. Thanks to everyone for the welcoming messages so far  :Thumbsup: 

Cheers Michael

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## Gibo

> Sorted. Boys in gear that's tight, bright and pink...just how you North Islanders like it...
> 
> Attachment 22064


You bet ya!! Just cause you cast aways like it white, wooly and baggy  :Wink:   :Psmiley:

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## JoshC

> You bet ya!! Just cause you cast aways like it white, wooly and baggy


Hahaha. Sounds like the description of your grandma  :Yarr:

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## Rushy

> You bet ya!! Just cause you cast aways like it white, wooly and baggy


That is why they have Velcro on the palms of their gloves Gibo. Oh shit that didn't last long.  Back of track again.

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## Gibo

> Hahaha. Sounds like the description of your grandma


Bwah hahaha!! She did mention a cute little bloke named Josh from down there, said you loved unfolding her creases with your tounge, I said stop it grannie thats gross!

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## Happy

> Bwah hahaha!! She did mention a cute little bloke named Josh from down there, said you loved unfolding her creases with your tounge, I said stop it grannie thats gross!


And that's it.. Its just gone further down hill !!

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## Gibo

> And that's it.. Its just gone further down hill !!


No point messing about, rolled straight to the bottom  :Grin:

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## Mick666

> Bwah hahaha!! She did mention a cute little bloke named Josh from down there, said you loved unfolding her creases with your tounge, I said stop it grannie thats gross!


Umm, very sorry but I couldn't resist, all this licking you speak of made me think of a photo I unfortunately set eyes on the other day. I hoped to never see it again but I felt it was necessary to share so I've taken one for the team to dredge it up, took me a while to find it again, but I prevailed and here it is for you you to revel in mutual disgust!

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## Gibo

> Umm, very sorry but I couldn't resist, all this licking you speak of made me think of a photo I unfortunately set eyes on the other day. I hoped to never see it again but I felt it was necessary to share so I've taken one for the team to dredge it up, took me a while to find it again, but I prevailed and here it is for you you to revel in mutual disgust!
> 
> Attachment 22087


You wont fit in for long if you keep lying! That was your screen saver aye :Psmiley:

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## veitnamcam

Bloody Hell can't even tell what gender it is!

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## Mick666

> You wont fit in for long if you keep lying! That was your screen saver aye


 :Sick:  Fuck .... ok, I alternate

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## Gibo

> Fuck .... ok, I alternate
> 
> 
> Attachment 22090



 :XD:

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## Mick666

> Bloody Hell can't even tell what gender it is!


haha obviously male, there's no boobies. I looked ...

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## Mick666

> haha obviously male, there's no boobies. I looked ...


Geez, did I say that out loud  :Wtfsmilie:

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## Gibo

> haha obviously male, there's no boobies. I looked ...


 :XD:

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## Rushy

Gibo stop leading new members astray. Consider yourself warned mister. Ha ha ha ha

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## Happy

> Fuck .... ok, I alternate
> 
> 
> Attachment 22090


Far out I don't know if even @Neckshot would have enough baby oil for that "little" beauty

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## Rushy

> Far out I don't know if even @Neckshot would have enough baby oil for that "little" beauty


He is busy on the Olive press as we speak Happy.

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## Neckshot

> Fuck .... ok, I alternate
> 
> 
> Attachment 22090


..................................................  ............ :Zomg: nothing a 44 gallon drum of baby oil couldn't help overcome the daunting task of tipping that up..............................nah id give up baby oil looking at that.

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## mutton gun

one of the key bits of training that the wider shooting community misses out on is keep that bloody trigger finger pointing down the frame or stock of the weapon/firearm until you have made the conshious decision to fire. this final safety is in pratice in military and police throughout the world. while the cogs are turning in your brain theres milseconds of extra thinking going on. you will never see aline of sas stg  who ever in an entry drill with there fingers on the trigger cause there woudnt be any left by now. 
I guess we will never know how many lives may have been saved by more training.
Theres an interesting study done by the us army and fbi on uds on ranges and the training that was changed and the affects. key areas to address was fingers off triggers , weapons always pointing in safe direction, unload drills and checks. cheers

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## 6mm ackley

> ..................................................  ............nothing a 44 gallon drum of baby oil couldn't help overcome the daunting task of tipping that up..............................nah id give up baby oil looking at that.


Fark
youd need a BIG bin of flour and a picture on her back :Sick:

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## Rushy

> one of the key bits of training that the wider shooting community misses out on is keep that bloody trigger finger pointing down the frame or stock of the weapon/firearm until you have made the conshious decision to fire. this final safety is in pratice in military and police throughout the world. while the cogs are turning in your brain theres milseconds of extra thinking going on. you will never see aline of sas stg  who ever in an entry drill with there fingers on the trigger cause there woudnt be any left by now. 
> I guess we will never know how many lives may have been saved by more training.
> Theres an interesting study done by the us army and fbi on uds on ranges and the training that was changed and the affects. key areas to address was fingers off triggers , weapons always pointing in safe direction, unload drills and checks. cheers


Welcome to the forum mutton gun

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## mutton gun

cheers rushy :Have A Nice Day:

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## Neckshot

> cheers rushy


Don't thank him yet :Grin:  he is just lubing you up mutton chops!!.How did the pins pull up after the Hihitahi gig?.good to have you on here mate.

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## Rushy

> Don't thank him yet he is just lubing you up


How rude.  You are the man for the baby oil Neckshot.

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## mutton gun

that was a bloody great day out all credit to the organisers, I love the terrain up there ( Im still shit at guessing range) I haven't had baby oil on my Barbie reckon it would taste mighty strange. Being pestering a mate to come up to your shoot in may, could be" team townie."

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## Neckshot

I will pass you the relevant info then :Thumbsup:

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## kawekakid

Don't come hunting with me ,My rules apply at all times ,you don't F up at all , you are better to leave your shot and let the animal walk away  Safety first

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## Dynastar27

> How rude.  You are the man for the baby oil Neckshot.


i heard some where KY jelly is better  :Thumbsup:

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## Dynastar27

> Don't come hunting with me ,My rules apply at all times ,you don't F up at all , you are better to leave your shot and let the animal walk away  Safety first


thats what hunting with Rushy , AndrewH & moonhunt is like safty First  :Thumbsup:

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## Spook

curious to see what 'mutton gun' puts up as an avatar

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## mutton gun

Thanks for that neckshot Ill look forward to it. 
Yes Spook I sometimes wonder why I picked that name, it was a constant joke between an mate and i for years sort of like the saying " this is my rifle this is my gun, This is for fighting and this is for fun.
Soooo their wont be a photo of me and a sheep. and I guess in the future Ill make sure any photos that involve animals I will be atleast 5 feet away. :Have A Nice Day:

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## 303Guy

> Red, green, orange and yellow appear as shades of grey to deer.


Not so.  Deer see green and blue but not red.  Pink is blue and red so it will stick out like a beacon to a deer - not sure that matters. Red appears green to deer as does orange and yellow.  That's the thing, they cannot distinguish between red, green, yellow and orange.  It's all green to them.  Red would be darker as they see it with their green cones which are less sensitive to red.  Beyond 625 nm red they can't see at all.  We can see beyond 650 nm.  Deer see blue very well - in fact, they see ultraviolet (as blue).  But deer do not see in shades of grey.  They have the same ratio of cones and rods in their 'central vision' as we have in out near peripheral vision and more colour cones than we have in a extreme peripheral vision yet we see colour perfectly well.  Deer perceive things pretty much the same as a colour blind person would (red blind) but without the acuity we have.

This is something like how a deer would see a blaze orange top.

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## KiwiinSeattle

If any colour helps prevent you being accidentally shot . . . I would not be too concerned at what colours a deer can identify.

There are some very good safety reminders buried in this thread.

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## kawekakid

Maybe the 6 people that have been shot in New Zealand ,would still be alive if they hadn't bought blaze orange . Believe the B/S people tell you. I hunt in camo and you wont know im there ,unless I want you to know

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## Gibo

> Maybe the 6 people that have been shot in New Zealand ,would still be alive if they hadn't bought blaze orange . Believe the B/S people tell you. I hunt in camo and you wont know im there ,unless I want you to know


Maybe they would be alive if people identified their target

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## Mick666

> Maybe the 6 people that have been shot in New Zealand ,would still be alive if they hadn't bought blaze orange . Believe the B/S people tell you. I hunt in camo and you wont know im there ,unless I want you to know


Um ... Really? Perhaps people wouldn't be dead if shooters identified their target? And I'm sorry but I've got a mate who also thinks he's clever coz he says the same thing about only being seen when he wants to, quite frankly it gives me the shits going with him, because I DON'T know where HE is. I don't want to offend anyone but sorry kawekakid I think that's a very cavalier attitude 😟



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## Dynastar27

yea i agree with you mick666
would rather be able to see others in the bush and leaves less margin for error when identifying your target 
there are to meny people out there with itchy trigger fingers the shoot first and ask questions latter

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## Gillie

> I hunt in camo and you wont know im there ,unless I want you to know


Mate, what camo gear do you use cause it must be freaking awesome if it stops you making noise... or casting a shadow... or shaking any brush around you. Does it also stop you moving?  :Grin:  

To some people being a successfull hunter means a lot to them. To the point where the first shot is simply to slow the animal down enough that they can get a second shot in there to anchor it. This is how they shoot at movement or sound. 

ID of the target is paramount.

My father and i have hunted together for a long time, we both wear blaze and have for quite a few years. I don't really know the technical side of what deer see and don't see but i have had them walk up to me wearing blaze in the bush. Dad and i wear it because it makes it really easy for us to see each other through the trees and out in the tussock.

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## ChrisF

Just saw a post about " fingers off triggers " , and about the SAS & STG , always doing this , and being safe etc .

All good stuff , BUT just because you donot hear about things , dosn;t mean they donot happen .

My mate who was in a NZSAS , said when he was in , they had 1-2 accidents a year , mostly to do with the guys speed drawing the old Browning Hi-powers from holsters , usually grazes or shots thru the leg etc , and they where NEVER on the News or reported to the outside world , if it could be patched up and no one was dead , NOTHING happened .

Also , when the glocks 1st came in , one of the outside instructors on the Glocks ( he was not NZ Police ) , said they had a female cop , think the Glock was unloaded ? , and fired the action , it was pointed close to the side of the Police Sergeant inside the station , shot jsut missed his head to the side .
Female cop crys , and thats IT ,  nothing done , not reported to NZ Public , they donot need to know ?

Stuff happens all the time , in Police & Military circles , and unless some one dies , most if not all , stays in house .

Later  Chris

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## veitnamcam

And then there is the u tube Vid of an American cop shooting himself in the leg while teaching a school class about gun safety.

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## Ryan

> And then there is the u tube Vid of an American cop shooting himself in the leg while teaching a school class about gun safety.


That clip is so lol, especially when after blasting himself in the foot, he thwn attempts to demo a rifle. Committed.

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## mutton gun

this think about fingers off triggers doesn't mean that they are safe, just safer than your average un trained punter. It dosent matter what tool you use accidents happen.
How many builders do you know with bits missing or scares.
at the end of the day 99.9 firearms fire cause someone pulled the trigger.  
cheers

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## Roy Lehndorf

> this think about fingers off triggers doesn't mean that they are safe, just safer than your average un trained punter. It dosent matter what tool you use accidents happen.
> How many builders do you know with bits missing or scares.
> at the end of the day 99.9 firearms fire cause someone pulled the trigger.  
> cheers


In short it comes down to identifying the target beyond any doubt....... I can only hope a tragedy never ever happens to myself or anyone on this forum, or anyone at all fornthat ,matter - as cheesy as it sounds ,,,, No meat is better than no mate.......

All the best fellas - safe travels & safe but happy hunting......

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## 303Guy

I'm undecided on whether to be unseen or mistaken for a deer.  Being unseen means a very small chance of being hit by a stray bullet while being seen and misidentified and shot at means a good chance of being hit.  Pink would surely trigger 'woman' in any man's head - I thought of this ten years ago.  Apparently one can actually get pink cammo. Anyway, I don't know what is best, to be very visible or very invisible.  Blaze orange would make one look like grass or leaves to a deer.  But does it make one look like a deer to other hunters?  It did to at least one hunter who reportedly says he thought he saw deer hair so he shot at it and hit the other hunter in the head.  I've always wondered what part of the deer he thought he could see.

There's an word used in some parts of the world - sounder.  I know the word to mean a mob of pigs but to some folks a sounder is an sound in the bush that they shoot at!

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## Rushy

No body should be shooting at sound in the bush

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## Gillie

> I'm undecided on whether to be unseen or mistaken for a deer.  Being unseen means a very small chance of being hit by a stray bullet while being seen and misidentified and shot at means a good chance of being hit.  Pink would surely trigger 'woman' in any man's head - I thought of this ten years ago.  Apparently one can actually get pink cammo. Anyway, I don't know what is best, to be very visible or very invisible.  Blaze orange would make one look like grass or leaves to a deer.  But does it make one look like a deer to other hunters?  It did to at least one hunter who reportedly says he thought he saw deer hair so he shot at it and hit the other hunter in the head.  I've always wondered what part of the deer he thought he could see.


I cant say I understand the Ill wear camouflage so no one will see me idea. 

Camouflage clothing does not make you invisible. If you are moving the human eye will still see you. If you make noise the human ear will still hear you. If you move a bush it will still be seen. Camouflage clothing would only be an advantage if you stopped moving i.e. you thought something / someone else was there. Planning for this to be the case out in the bush means you are putting your faith more in your ability to silently hunt and detect another hunter in the bush before they detect you. Chances are if they hear you moving or see you brush by a bush they will stop moving until they know what you are chances are if they dont know what you are they will try and ID you through their scope

Rather than simply rely on my stalking ability I try to stack the odds in my favour by wearing blaze clothing. Not just a hat but a full blaze orange shirt with a black camo pattern. Yes, people have been shot wearing blaze. I remember reading somewhere that in the excitement of the moment the brain can see what it wants to see or see what it expects to see. I wonder if it is more or less likely to do this with blaze or camouflage clothing or simply at darker shade skin or the hair on someones head

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## Mick666

> I cant say I understand the Ill wear camouflage so no one will see me idea. 
> 
> Camouflage clothing does not make you invisible. If you are moving the human eye will still see you. If you make noise the human ear will still hear you. If you move a bush it will still be seen. Camouflage clothing would only be an advantage if you stopped moving i.e. you thought something / someone else was there. Planning for this to be the case out in the bush means you are putting your faith more in your ability to silently hunt and detect another hunter in the bush before they detect you. Chances are if they hear you moving or see you brush by a bush they will stop moving until they know what you are chances are if they dont know what you are they will try and ID you through their scope
> 
> Rather than simply rely on my stalking ability I try to stack the odds in my favour by wearing blaze clothing. Not just a hat but a full blaze orange shirt with a black camo pattern. Yes, people have been shot wearing blaze. I remember reading somewhere that in the excitement of the moment the brain can see what it wants to see or see what it expects to see. I wonder if it is more or less likely to do this with blaze or camouflage clothing or simply at darker shade skin or the hair on someones head


Excellent post 👍


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## 303Guy

Well said, *Gillie*.  

I plan on heading into the bush sometime fairly soon, hopefully this winter.  I have to decide which way to go.  It has been allegedly proven that Blaze orange reduces the chances of being mistaken for a deer and shot, yet this wasn't the case in that one particular incident that I know of.  So we have folk shot because they were wearing blaze but would they still have been shot if they were wearing cammo?  All I've got for now is our standard olive green - mind you, I do have a blaze safety vest I could  wear over it.  And I could get a blaze hat I should think.  I do like the idea of blaze orange with black cammo pattern.




> I don't really know the technical side of what deer see and don't see but i have had them walk up to me wearing blaze in the bush.


I have an article that the author has given me permission to share, about just that sort of thing.  When they stomp in front of you you should stomp back or they get agitated and could get nasty.  I should post the article under hunting or I could email it to anyone interested.

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## big_foot

I see this whole blaze situation similair to wearing a seat belt, 9 times out of 10 its guna help you out but on that very odd occaision its the very thing that fucks you up.

I wear a bloody bright orange cap and frankly I couldnt care if the deer cant see it or sees it as a flashing beacon thats not the point. Most of the deer you take in the scrub will not have seen you or will only just have seen you when you pull the trigger. Do you think a deers guna sit there for 5 min while you rustle round in the bushes just because your wearing camo an not burn off because it cant see you?

It doesnt matter if you look like any of these guys-


If they can smell you or hear you they're gone

In my opinion wear what you need to to make sure its you going home to your family not a couple of cops, and to bring the venison with you work on your technique, being quiet, and knowing the animal.

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## Mick666

> I see this whole blaze situation similair to wearing a seat belt, 9 times out of 10 its guna help you out but on that very odd occaision its the very thing that fucks you up.
> 
> I wear a bloody bright orange cap and frankly I couldnt care if the deer cant see it or sees it as a flashing beacon thats not the point. Most of the deer you take in the scrub will not have seen you or will only just have seen you when you pull the trigger. Do you think a deers guna sit there for 5 min while you rustle round in the bushes just because your wearing camo an not burn off because it cant see you?
> 
> It doesnt matter if you look like any of these guys-
> Attachment 22378
> 
> If they can smell you or hear you they're gone
> 
> In my opinion wear what you need to to make sure its you going home to your family not a couple of cops, and to bring the venison with you work on your technique, being quiet, and knowing the animal.


Great post 👍


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## Toby

Should of got a blue forum shirt  :Have A Nice Day:  Deer don't wear blue

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## veitnamcam

> Should of got a blue forum shirt  Deer don't wear blue


Because wasps love it.

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## Toby

Wasp have attacked me in camos as well. They are nasty fuckers all round

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## Kscott

The news tonight.




> A 22-year-old man was shot in the chest by another member of his hunting party today in a remote area of bush near Motu in Bay of Plenty.
> 
> A spokesman for the Greenlea Rescue Helicopter said it took the hunting party four hours to send the message for help.
> 
> "They got to a place where they bumped in to another person who had an emergency beacon, then one guy carried on to get to a phone,'' he said.
> 
> The man was hunting with three other men when the shooting happened this morning.
> 
> The Personal Locator Beacon signal was picked up at 1.30pm by the Rescue Coordination Centre NZ, and the Greenlea Rescue Helicopter was deployed from Taupo.
> ...

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## sako75

Last few years when I have been walking out (with blaze top on) with part of a deer on my back, I have made human noises such as whistling a tune, humming etc. except when I'm out of breath and talk to myself. Might sound like a nut case but sure as he'll won't be mistaken for a deer

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## Dundee

> Last few years when I have been walking out (with blaze top on) with part of a deer on my back, I have made human noises such as whistling a tune, humming etc. except when I'm out of breath and talk to myself. Might sound like a nut case but sure as he'll won't be mistaken for a deer


You gotta get a shepherds whistle,the long range shooters won't hear you at 1000 yards :Wink:

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## Gillie

Probably better to wrap his blaze top around the animal while carrying it out... those light weight blaze vests are good for that.

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## sako75

:Grin:  well said Dundee.
Your right Gibo. Always carry a spare for that

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## Pengy

You can buy a cheapo Hi-vis vest from any two dollar store. Wrapped around the deer it will stand out like dogs balls, specially the green ones

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## 303Guy

> Wasp have attacked me in camos as well. They are nasty fuckers all round


This could mean your cammo is not cammo at all.  Not to wasps and deer anyway.  Washed with fabric brightener perhaps?  Fabric brightener has a UV reflective component which wasps and deer alike can see like a beacon.  Most household washing powders have this fabric brightener stuff in them.  They say to wash hunting clothes in bicarb only.

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## 303Guy

*Rusky* nailed it! * ''Assume everything that moves is a human before identifying as otherwise''*

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## Munsey

Wet day at home and too much time on my hands , am away tomorrow so made this up 
Hunting public land , likely access is through a narrow creek , will place this on a rock below our fly camp . We are a fair way back but you never know who's about .

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## Dundee

I also liked @Scousers thread in the magazine section as he thought it was his mates roaring at him...what a great way of thinking. :Cool: 

http://www.nzhuntingandshooting.co.n...-heaven-13186/

When me and my boy come out of the bush last weekend he was wearing blaze blue and I had a yellow t shirt on we went different ways but i caught up with three hunters on the way out and only saw the glimpse of the orange blaze as they crossed the ridge. My boy was seen by these hunters roaring with a caller from Josh James.Bright clothing will help but the thinking of everything is human is a true measure of a hunters safety.

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## Scouser

Yeah guys, to my way of thinking, for safetys sake, always regard every movement as your mate, or another hunter in the bush........'better to lose meat, than a mate'........no one wants a lifetime of regret.......we do this fantastic activity for the enrichment of our souls!!!!!!

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## ScottEdvin12

It is important gun should not to be given to person who don't have knowldge of shooting and gun safety rules. There are many cases that person accidentally shot to himself or to other person. Good firearm training should be required to get gun safety rules and to improve shooting skills.

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## 300winmag

I was in a flyin block recently (6 days)
Two of us were walking thru bush along a trail, wind in our favour when we heard a mew to the left, we got into semi stealth mode and investigated about 75m off the track. I reckon that mew was close and no more than that distance, we came across a heap of bush lawyer so gave up and continued on with our plan for the day.
We walked along the track for approx another 500m until we broke out into the tussock, found a nice spot to sit down and have a breather and snack. We must of been there 20 mins we behind us we heard branch's breaking, shit we instantly thought STAG, turned around with rifle pointing in direction of some young guy bush bashing thru our block. 
Transpired that he was on the other side of the mew that we heard and was hunting hard, about the only time I can thank the good old bush lawyer.
Thats one story on our hunt told.

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## The Bloke

Thought I would just throw this in here - Blaze Camouflage - Safety while hunting - I did a little reading into how deer see, what we see, and then took a pile of camo out into the bush, and took a pile of photos.

Personally, blue disappears with the light quicker than orange.

If you are wearing old blaze, you might as well not bother.

Not of this is relevant if the person behind the rifle lets his ego overwhelm the basic requirements of firearm safety. However, I am going to to do all I can do to ensure my personal safety.

It's been interesting how many older hunters I have run into over the last couple of weeks who refuse to hunt during the roar anymore.

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## Steveh054

When I was 14 carrying a deer out of the bush, some clown shot the deer on my back, I didn't realise wha had happened for a few seconds and then dived behind a tree and yelled out, my father on hearing the shot thought I had shot another deer and was coming in from another direction to help carry them out. He was in time to see the shooter lining up on the deer again for another shot.....for fuck sake! It seems when I jumped behind the tree, the deer on my back was still visible. The old man smashed the Guy and then wrapped his Browning Bar around a tree and took it to the cop shop telling the owner to pick it up from there.( to my knowledge it was never picked up from the cop shop). The cop of the Town being a very endearing kind of arse was gonna charge the Old Man with assault.

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## Dundee

> When I was 14 carrying a deer out of the bush, some clown shot the deer on my back, I didn't realise wha had happened for a few seconds and then dived behind a tree and yelled out, my father on hearing the shot thought I had shot another deer and was coming in from another direction to help carry them out. He was in time to see the shooter lining up on the deer again for another shot.....for fuck sake! It seems when I jumped behind the tree, the deer on my back was still visible. The old man smashed the Guy and then wrapped his Browning Bar around a tree and took it to the cop shop telling the owner to pick it up from there.( to my knowledge it was never picked up from the cop shop). The cop of the Town being a very endearing kind of arse was gonna charge the Old Man with assault.


Far Canal that is scary!!

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## Scouser

> When I was 14 carrying a deer out of the bush, some clown shot the deer on my back, I didn't realise wha had happened for a few seconds and then dived behind a tree and yelled out, my father on hearing the shot thought I had shot another deer and was coming in from another direction to help carry them out. He was in time to see the shooter lining up on the deer again for another shot.....for fuck sake! It seems when I jumped behind the tree, the deer on my back was still visible. The old man smashed the Guy and then wrapped his Browning Bar around a tree and took it to the cop shop telling the owner to pick it up from there.( to my knowledge it was never picked up from the cop shop). The cop of the Town being a very endearing kind of arse was gonna charge the Old Man with assault.


Fuk Steve, thats horrendous, worst story ive heard yet........even though i have only been hunting for a year, i made the concious decision to not go over the 4 days easter breaks....too many once a year hunters with their mates fukin Yeharring with buck fever!!!!!

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## Rushy

> When I was 14 carrying a deer out of the bush, some clown shot the deer on my back, I didn't realise wha had happened for a few seconds and then dived behind a tree and yelled out, my father on hearing the shot thought I had shot another deer and was coming in from another direction to help carry them out. He was in time to see the shooter lining up on the deer again for another shot.....for fuck sake! It seems when I jumped behind the tree, the deer on my back was still visible. The old man smashed the Guy and then wrapped his Browning Bar around a tree and took it to the cop shop telling the owner to pick it up from there.( to my knowledge it was never picked up from the cop shop). The cop of the Town being a very endearing kind of arse was gonna charge the Old Man with assault.


Bloody hell Steve.  Another reason why there should be. "Fuck me dead" emoticon in the line up.

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