# Hunting > The Magazine >  Deer numbers

## Nathan F

Is it just me or is there a heap of deer around at the moment ? Its the best I can remember it in the last 20 years. This is my fourth trip into this spot. I went in March , May, October and last night. I picked it off a topo map because it looked deery. Its on DOC land and 2 1/2 hours from the road end. 
Left the truck last night and hoofed it in with an overnight pack. Got up into where I wanted to be and started stalking into the wind. Third slip and theres a familiar shape. Sure enough a quick check through the scope confirmed a hind feeding. Took my pack off lined her up and drilled her. Suddenly theres a spiker running around not sure whats going on. Bang - miss. Bang - mmmm did I get it? 
Wandered over to the first deer and got my pack off and knife out. 

Went over to look for the spiker kind of hoping I had missed. But no here he was and the poor bugger needed a finishing shot. I tried to cut his throat and got a hefty kick in the upper thigh for my troubles. Dragged them together and got the knife to work. 

I butchered all the meat and packed up. It was only 8:30 pm. Bear in mind its not dark here til 10pm at the moment. Having an extra 30 kegs on board slowed me down. Contemplated walking out but didnt feel up for it in the dark. As I headed back down river I could have shot another two deer. Lucky for them and me I only took 4 rounds in.  Any way I had a flycamp set up by 10pm with the meat cooling properly. 


Woke up at first light and saw another deer from camp. Packed up and began the trudge out. Home by 12. Theres adventures still out there.

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## dannyb

I have been seeing plenty too, but I just thought maybe I was getting better at finding them  :Grin: 
certainly plenty of feed about which doesn't hurt, every animal I have taken in the last couple months has been in great condition

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## Nathan F

There’s certainly lots of grass down here. Summer hasn’t arrived and it has not stopped raining.

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## 223nut

Not seeing as many on the island as I have in the past. Although the animals were a month or so late is starting to move around on the cameras after winter so maybe things are just slow kicking off.

Or its backwards like the island....

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## Cigar

> Not seeing as many on the island as I have in the past. Although the animals were a month or so late is starting to move around on the cameras after winter so maybe things are just slow kicking off.
> 
> Or its backwards like the island*ers*....


Fixed it for you!  :Thumbsup: 

One of my rellies was mayor of the island decades ago.

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## deer243

Nice one Only thing i suggest esp for a overnight trip should of taken more rounds in.
 Yes, 4 plenty, but if a stuff up happens, ie one extra shot and have a wounded animal you cant finish off because you out of ammo thats just cruel and dumb. Also you may get a dud and mis fire etc, always pays to take more than you need, weight nothing.
I always have extra in the pack, could be useful if something happens and people looking for you as well if no plb or doesnt work etc (ie 3 shots evenly spaced apart etc  etc .
Enjoy the venison thou, they be fat as mud!

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## Tahr

Good adventure.The new gun is mowing them down.

Is it only me who can see a persons' face in your sleeping bag  @Nathan F ?

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## KiwiinSeattle

> . It’s on DOC land and 2 1/2 hours from the road end. 
> Left the truck last night and hoofed it in with an overnight pack. Got up into where I wanted to be and .


That is a LONG way to walk to find a deer on DOC land if you are in Southland !

 YES, there are a lot of deer around at the moment but the real challenge has been finding a weather window to get out.

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## Nathan F

> Good adventure.The new gun is mowing them down.
> 
> Is it only me who can see a persons' face in your sleeping bag  @Nathan F ?


Just noticed that. Random isn’t it.

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## Allizdog

Good on ya Nathan. You've got to be stoked with that. :Thumbsup:

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## tikka

A good haul of meat there, and yep plenty of deer around if one puts in the effort.

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## Hiawatha

One of the best times of year to see deer and when the weather comes right after a rough patch.... deadly! True test of numbers is finding the buggers in winter  :Grin:

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## Nathan F

> One of the best times of year to see deer and when the weather comes right after a rough patch.... deadly! True test of numbers is finding the buggers in winter


Yep meant to say in the report 4 trips March , may , October and last night for 5 deer.

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## craigc

Theres plenty of them alright Nathan. I drove 15 minutes from my house last night and walked for two hours in some public land. I saw over 20 deer; unfortunately most of them on a farm that backed onto the public land. 
This years not over yet, but Ive seen and shot more deer this year that ever before. 
Ive been hunting for over 30 years and these are the golden years alright. If this continues I might run out of A-Maxs! I thought I had a life times supply. 
:-)

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## Marty Henry

> Good adventure.The new gun is mowing them down.
> 
> Is it only me who can see a persons' face in your sleeping bag  @Nathan F ?


Well i missed it till it was pointed out, i was more interested in the aparrent lack of flies!

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## 10-Ring

Plenty around in the Kaimanawa and Kaweka DOC areas too and fat. Only downside this time of year is a fawn will die if mum gets a bullet. Not that it would worry DOC at all.

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## Ben Waimata

Deer numbers are up in Hawkes Bay too, one of the HBRC biosecurity guys told me numbers are likely to exceed the previous highs of the 50's/60's soon. 5 years ago I never saw a deer here, now I have resident population. And if no one can eat them due to the brodifacoum risk, I can't see it getting any better.

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## Nathan F

> Theres plenty of them alright Nathan. I drove 15 minutes from my house last night and walked for two hours in some public land. I saw over 20 deer; unfortunately most of them on a farm that backed onto the public land. 
> This years not over yet, but Ive seen and shot more deer this year that ever before. 
> Ive been hunting for over 30 years and these are the golden years alright. If this continues I might run out of A-Maxs! I thought I had a life times supply. 
> :-)


Amen and long may it continue 👍

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## Nathan F

> Well i missed it till it was pointed out, i was more interested in the aparrent lack of flies!


Honestly we have not had summer. The wx has been absolutely dogshit. Temp wouldn’t have got over 21 yet since last summer and has not stopped raining. I left some meat out for eeling on Xmas day for the boys and that didn’t even get blown.

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## Hiawatha

> Theres plenty of them alright Nathan. I drove 15 minutes from my house last night and walked for two hours in some public land. I saw over 20 deer; unfortunately most of them on a farm that backed onto the public land. 
> This years not over yet, but Ive seen and shot more deer this year that ever before. 
> Ive been hunting for over 30 years and these are the golden years alright. If this continues I might run out of A-Maxs! I thought I had a life times supply. 
> :-)


Craig you are obviously not trying hard enough if you still have some bullets left. You need to dig deeper and unleash your dark side.  :Wink:

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## oneshot

> Theres plenty of them alright Nathan. I drove 15 minutes from my house last night and walked for two hours in some public land. I saw over 20 deer; unfortunately most of them on a farm that backed onto the public land. 
> This years not over yet, but Ive seen and shot more deer this year that ever before. 
> Ive been hunting for over 30 years and these are the golden years alright. If this continues I might run out of A-Maxs! I thought I had a life times supply. 
> :-)


I don't know if its like this across the country but I am also seeing more red deer than I ever have, and would know what to do with if I shot all I see, and I'm not even hunting properly due to an ACL reconstruction in my knee. My friends that own land are also seeing a decent increase in public land animals coming into their paddocks. Some areas they are as common as seeing rabbits.

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## Hiawatha

Deer are safe as houses in the bush. All (or at least most of) the hunters these days are sitting in the open waiting for them to come out.  :Wink:  I find all the shit/ kit we carry now, along with big range finding binos, spotting scopes, large scabbard housing packs, assorted knives, water bladder pouches with the sippy tubes etc etc so hard to get around in the bush quietly with.............. :Grin:  They sit in the bush safe and breed away quietly. Occasionally one sticks a toe out and 11 guns from a km away go off simultaneously. So it goes back in and stays there breeding for another year or two.

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## Moa Hunter

I am surprised by the numbers visible this year. The feral venison processing plant in ChCh has closed and now there are now no flying machines chasing deer, doing their regular cream skimming runs taking all the easy ones. Without hunting, numbers will double every three years but the visible increase is out of step with this

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## Russian 22.

> Plenty around in the Kaimanawa and Kaweka DOC areas too and fat. Only downside this time of year is a fawn will die if mum gets a bullet. Not that it would worry DOC at all.


Which parts? I usually put up a deer a trip in the kawekas but never see them. Just hear them running away.

I am yet to check out ngapuketurua or even clements Mill Road. Kiko Road etc.

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## Nathan F

> Deer are safe as houses in the bush. All (or at least most of) the hunters these days are sitting in the open waiting for them to come out.  I find all the shit/ kit we carry now, along with big range finding binos, spotting scopes, large scabbard housing packs, assorted knives, water bladder pouches with the sippy tubes etc etc so hard to get around in the bush quietly with.............. They sit in the bush safe and breed away quietly. Occasionally one sticks a toe out and 11 guns from a km away go off simultaneously. So it goes back in and stays there breeding for another year or two.


Yep some of what you say is correct. I’m seeing deer in the bush, on slips , in the open , on the tops and in the scrub. 10% of the hunters get 90% of the deer. That will generally stay about the same. Your right about technology too. Keep it simple. Minimal gear and get the wind right. Yes bush stalking is an art in its own right. I’ve lucked onto deer over the years in the bush but generally by being Johnny on the spot and no great skill on my part. 
The days are here fellas get out and enjoy it.

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## Tahr

> Yep some of what you say is correct. I’m seeing deer in the bush, on slips , in the open , on the tops and in the scrub. 10% of the hunters get 90% of the deer. That will generally stay about the same. Your right about technology too. Keep it simple. Minimal gear and get the wind right. Yes bush stalking is an art in its own right. I’ve lucked onto deer over the years in the bush but generally by being Johnny on the spot and no great skill on my part. 
> The days are here fellas get out and enjoy it.


Exactly. And now @Nathan F through the generosity of the forum you know to take more ammo and not to walk so far.  :Have A Nice Day:  Always learning, eh  :Thumbsup:

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## Nathan F

> Exactly. And now @Nathan F through the generosity of the forum you know to take more ammo and not to walk so far.  Always learning, eh


LOL never too old to learn Mr C  :Thumbsup: 

I hope I never lose the fire to put a pack on and walk . Something about being well away from others strikes a chord  :Grin:

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## Bos

Definitely more deer around now than even 5 years ago, well here in Marlborough anyway.
And admittedly I hunt private land, but anything from half a dozen to 15's and 20's isn't uncommon. On some properties they are becoming a serious problem, and even more so now with all the fawns runnin around

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## Tahr

I'm cool about knocking the numbers back so long as we maintain our respect for what are a magnificent animal. Clean kills for the particular purpose of controlling numbers and not just for the sake of it. I would have no qualms about shooting a hind right now so long as I could get the fawn too and velvet stags so long as they aren't special in some way. I prefer to recover the meat but some areas are getting to where just a pack full of backstraps might be the result from a day's hunting. 55 years of recreational and commercial hunting and I never thought I would be saying that.

And like it or not the land owners hold the trump access card, so the natural consequences are that the gates aren't going to be thrown open, which will mean a lucky minority will be shooting a heap of animals.

The big numbers are on private land but no matter where they are we just have to control them or we will have a Tahr situation without the backstop of Memo of Understanding with DOC.

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## Nathan F

> I'm cool about knocking the numbers back so long as we maintain our respect for what are a magnificent animal. Clean kills for the particular purpose of controlling numbers and not just for the sake of it. I would have no qualms about shooting a hind right now so long as I could get the fawn too and velvet stags so long as they aren't special in some way. I prefer to recover the meat but some areas are getting to where just a pack full of backstraps might be the result from a day's hunting. 55 years of recreational and commercial hunting and I never thought I would be saying that.
> 
> And like it or not the land owners hold the trump access card, so the natural consequences are that the gates aren't going to be thrown open, which will mean a lucky minority will be shooting a heap of animals.
> 
> The big numbers are on private land but no matter where they are we just have to control them or we will have a Tahr situation without the backstop of Memo of Understanding with DOC.


Im with you. The only thing I wouldnt shoot at this time of the year would be a thumping stag. Everything else is fair game.

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## Brian

A friend saw 40 stags on his lucerne paddock yesterday morning.

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## Fred Fisherman

Certainly way more deer around these days which is great, and like others before me, something I never thought I would see. In my early days of hunting, hinds were worth 4k a piece on the hoof, so they were targeted by deer traps, helicopters and anyone with a dart gun. It means great opportunities for all of us, but with a responsibility to manage the resource. Great for new and young hunters too, being able to see and get animals, without the disapointment of many trips with no animals sighted. Easier to be selective and leave those potential trophies to grow their head gear out too. So blessed these days! Enjoy it while it lasts, as it won't be long before the greens, doc and the government object.

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## Russian 22.

> Certainly way more deer around these days which is great, and like others before me, something I never thought I would see. In my early days of hunting, hinds were worth 4k a piece on the hoof, so they were targeted by deer traps, helicopters and anyone with a dart gun. It means great opportunities for all of us, but with a responsibility to manage the resource. Great for new and young hunters too, being able to see and get animals, without the disapointment of many trips with no animals sighted. Easier to be selective and leave those potential trophies to grow their head gear out too. So blessed these days! Enjoy it while it lasts, as it won't be long before the greens, doc and the government object.


They'll only have grounds for their objections if we let them.

We have shoot way more hinds.

This whole shoot the spiker and stags should switch to shooting hinds.

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## Nathan F

> They'll only have grounds for their objections if we let them.
> 
> We have shoot way more hinds.
> 
> This whole shoot the spiker and stags should switch to shooting hinds.


Shoot everything. Just have respect for the game and utilise what you harvest.

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## Ben Waimata

> A friend saw 40 stags on his lucerne paddock yesterday morning.


Is he applying for a P? If ever a man needed a SLR....

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## Tahr

> Is he applying for a P? If ever a man needed a SLR....


Nah. He's got_ us_  :Thumbsup:

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## Marty Henry

> Nah. He's got_ us_


I think you meant "Nah. He's got us and tilly"

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## Moa Hunter

If we shoot a hind and leave a little fawn to starve, dehydrate and die a miserable suffering death, no one will see it or punish us for our actions but that does not make such a thing right.
We are answerable to ourselves for such actions and it reflects on how we conduct ourselves in the other areas of our lives. It is a test of character.
Two weeks ago a friend and I shot a 2yr old hind that was heavily pregnant. We had some discussion over the ethics of taking such an animal prior to the shot with my own position at the time being that she would have been pregnant in April just as she is now, but not visibly so. We saw two older hinds with the one we took which obviously both had fawns hidden nearby, these we would not shoot now but they become shootable again in March when the fawn is big enough to wean.

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## Tahr

Aldo Leupold: "Ethical behavior is doing the right thing when no one else is watching—even when doing the wrong thing is legal.”

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## stevodog

Is weaning around late february?

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## Moa Hunter

> Is weaning around late february?


Natural weaning does not take place till July. On a farm fawns are weaned either pre-rut in the first - second week in March or later post rut last week of May or 1st week of June.
If a wild hind is shot in March the fawn will get a 'check' but will be OK. The later in March the better.

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## 10-Ring

> Which parts? I usually put up a deer a trip in the kawekas but never see them. Just hear them running away.
> 
> I am yet to check out ngapuketurua or even clements Mill Road. Kiko Road etc.


I seldom hunt Clements; don't know the area very well, but there's plenty of sika living in the monowai and small tee tree grasslands all over the southern Kaimanawas and Kaweks. They don't generally stick their noses out until last light though.

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## Russian 22.

> I seldom hunt Clements; don't know the area very well, but there's plenty of sika living in the monowai and small tee tree grasslands all over the southern Kaimanawas and Kaweks. They don't generally stick their noses out until last light though.


Cheers. Will give it a nudge.

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## TeRei

> Deer numbers are up in Hawkes Bay too, one of the HBRC biosecurity guys told me numbers are likely to exceed the previous highs of the 50's/60's soon. 5 years ago I never saw a deer here, now I have resident population. And if no one can eat them due to the brodifacoum risk, I can't see it getting any better.


That is true but it helps to keep them in a job.Got home this morning at 4.30am. Possum numbers are up on the back country roads.

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## Tahr

> That is true but it helps to keep them in a job.Got home this morning at 4.30am. Possum numbers are up on the back country roads.


Yes, Ive noticed that 'possum numbers are on the increase in Sth HB/Nth Wairarapa. Not big numbers, but for the last few years there haven't been any on the roads or in the scrub, but I'm starting to see a few now each night I'm out.

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## TeRei

However more alarming was the huge numbers of cats. Just about crashed trying to bowl a big one. Went over edge of road and floored it to get momentum back onto lip. Scary.

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## A-Bolt

Definitely plenty about. A couple of weeks ago I was watching a mob of 20 in the Canterbury high country, almost all hinds with fawns plus the yearling hinds hanging around too. Also a couple of velvet stags sitting above the main mob but they had too much potential to shoot now.

Took ages to ensure I had confirmed the yearling hinds before pulling the trigger on one.

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## Flyblown

> I'm cool about knocking the numbers back so long as we maintain our respect for what are a magnificent animal. Clean kills for the particular purpose of controlling numbers and not just for the sake of it. I would have no qualms about shooting a hind right now so long as I could get the fawn too and velvet stags so long as they aren't special in some way. I prefer to recover the meat but some areas are getting to where just a pack full of backstraps might be the result from a day's hunting. 55 years of recreational and commercial hunting and I never thought I would be saying that.


The red deer numbers in the western CNI are out of control and a fairly serious problem on private land. There's so much politics involved in game animals though, and so many divergent opinions as to how much is too much, and what to do about it, that the likelihood of a consistent control approach is remote.

The grass this year is exceptional and the deer numbers are way up - what is causing this I ask myself? There's a shit load of capital being spent on fertiliser to take advantage of high meat prices, and it shows, but what strikes me the most is the much lower number of hard frost days in the winter, followed by wet springs, and long hot spells in early summer. The growth season feels markedly different to me, but I was away between 2010-2016, and after an absence any changes are amplified. Whereas if you live through them, you hardly notice. The lamb numbers and weights are well up though, a good indicator. If you're a sheep cockie and setup right, you're in for a good season even with the reduction in Chinese buying.

It's become normal for me to walk over a saddle and look into the next watershed and see 50+ reds munching their way through the pasture. I can think of three such places where I'll see more way deer and goats than sheep in the paddock. These places are always the same - back blocks, quite high up, with a long, easily accessible bush boundary. Go into the bush and there's _nothing_ in there under the canopy. Pretty much impossible for a goat or a deer to get a feed in there now.

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## muka88

I have noticed a lot more deer also, saw about 30 in 3 hours last week spotlighting

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## Moa Hunter

Last week Wednesday and Thurs were smoked out. On Thursday I went with a friend and her son for a hunting /glassing session in a good spot curious if anything would be out with all the smoke round the hills, result nothing seen not even a hare. Friday rain. Saturday eve clear with gentle southerly, I went to another spot close to Thursdays spot, result deer everywhere. Saw 11 hinds plus fawns and 3 stags all from one glassing spot all spread around on different knobs and spurs. This is significant because I have glassed this area for 25 years and that is the most deer I have ever seen.

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## Russian 22.

> The red deer numbers in the western CNI are out of control and a fairly serious problem on private land. There's so much politics involved in game animals though, and so many divergent opinions as to how much is too much, and what to do about it, that the likelihood of a consistent control approach is remote.
> 
> The grass this year is exceptional and the deer numbers are way up - what is causing this I ask myself? There's a shit load of capital being spent on fertiliser to take advantage of high meat prices, and it shows, but what strikes me the most is the much lower number of hard frost days in the winter, followed by wet springs, and long hot spells in early summer. The growth season feels markedly different to me, but I was away between 2010-2016, and after an absence any changes are amplified. Whereas if you live through them, you hardly notice. The lamb numbers and weights are well up though, a good indicator. If you're a sheep cockie and setup right, you're in for a good season even with the reduction in Chinese buying.
> 
> It's become normal for me to walk over a saddle and look into the next watershed and see 50+ reds munching their way through the pasture. I can think of three such places where I'll see more way deer and goats than sheep in the paddock. These places are always the same - back blocks, quite high up, with a long, easily accessible bush boundary. Go into the bush and there's _nothing_ in there under the canopy. Pretty much impossible for a goat or a deer to get a feed in there now.


You're right. Hard to get people who don't have access to the private land to care about the numbers and the ramifications of the deer. 

Public land will probably be getting more pressure as hunting seems to be getting ever more popular but as we know pressure doesn't equal deer shot. 

I was under the impression that because of the swine flu the Chinese are buying up a hell of a lot of meat. Bulls were worth 2500 at one point the cockie was saying.

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## Ben Waimata

> I was under the impression that because of the swine flu the Chinese are buying up a hell of a lot of meat. Bulls were worth 2500 at one point the cockie was saying.



The Chinese are getting a lot of red meat out of Australia, it's great for the Aussie farmers needing to destock due to catastrophic drought. My wifes grandfather lost his farm in 1974 due to drought, it was not too bad where they are in NE NSW but the entire East coast was in drought and the prices for everything crashed. Once the Aussie drought finishes the demand for NZ meat should be higher, until the Chinese pork industry gets itself going again. Farmers are all hoping the Chinese consumer will have developed a taste for beef/lamb by then!

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## Sarvo

> Yes, Ive noticed that 'possum numbers are on the increase in Sth HB/Nth Wairarapa. Not big numbers, but for the last few years there haven't been any on the roads or in the scrub, but I'm starting to see a few now each night I'm out.


Possum - that surprises me !!
Rabbits (as already Threaded here - yes)
My Deer # down this year - not lack of feed - not that I have shot more than reproduction (far from it) neighbour -mm ???
Only last evening right on dark saw my 1st Fawn - 2 actually - with Hinds of course and 1 yearling Hind and a 2yr Stag with them playing with the Fawns - very odd I thought.
Even Trail Cams not picked up a Fawn yet - thats 5 weeks later than normal here - usually always by end of 1st week in Dec I see 1st.

Shot a pig - which made my day as I shoot every one I see when can
I have deff got their # down counter reproduction level  :-)

Deer - more looksy than shootsy
Next Spiker in range will cop it though - freezer almost empty of Veni

Look at this silly bitch (Fawn prob just out of shot and b on Vid when I clear SD card)
She wont last long walking around down low that time of day :-(

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