# Firearms and Shooting > Firearms, Optics and Accessories >  Silencer question

## Scottishkiwi

So, Been looking high and low at hundreds of guns and thanks to you lads I'm sold on getting a .308!

Anyway, I'm looking at a package and if spend pretty much 400 more It comes with a 3-9x40 scope and an over barrel detachable suppressor.. Is it worth the extra bit of saving? Do suppressors really make that much difference? I've never seen a firearm used with one in person and its bloody hard to tell on a video. I'm guessing that since a .308 is supersonic it would still create a loud snap from breaking the sound barrier.

Am I better off getting the rifle on its own and just getting a scope separately? The rifle in question is a savage axis.

(Sorry if I sound like an idiot for any reason, This will be my first firearm.. I'm only young!)

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## silentscope

surpressors are handy, i have been with mates that use them and when they have missed their first shot the deer usually dont spook and run away giving them another shot at them. personally i dont like using them cus they make my rifle awkward to carry but thats just me. as for the scope, get the best one you can afford, it pays for itself very quickly.

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## northdude

id read some reviews on an axis before youget one

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## SiB

I suppressed my .308 and would def encourage you to do it.

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## Tahr

Don’t end up a deaf old fart. 
Get a suppressor.

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## ebf

Hi scottishkiwi

Package deals generally tend to be a bit hit and miss. Shops sometimes use low end scopes that they would not be likely to sell otherwise, so you might not be getting such a good deal after all. Same for suppressor quality. Ask which specific model of suppressor is part of the deal, and most importantly, get the weight.

Have a look at DPT suppressors, they have a very good reputation. Most gunsmiths will thread and crown your barrel for around $ 80 - 100.

The Axis is the real "budget" model of the savage lineup. If you can save a bit more and look at the Savage International Trophy Hunter - you'd be buying a significantly better quality firearm. There are some very good package deals for this one as well, with a Weaver scope for around $ 999.

The axis does not use the same action as the rest of the Savage lineup (models 10/11/14/16).

Suppressors have several advantages. Less noise - good for you and good for any dogs you take bush. They reduce felt recoil - something quite important for first-time shooters. For hunting they are great, quite often animals can't figure out where the shot came from, and will stick around as opposed to un-suppressed shots.

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## SlimySquirrel

What he said ^ ...

Axis work as a real budget rifle. Not really that easy to upgrade.

The normal savage rifles are plenty accurate and there are some good deals to be had... I would go with DPT Also as they are well priced and do a fantastic job.... get the can... just do it... ears dont really like noise.

Save up and buy the best you can afford. There may be some that will suggest Remington also.. Heaps of upgrades and some great deals on Trademe if you are patient.

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## Breyt

is AIMSONIC suppressors  available?

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## Spook

If you are going for a cheap scope, then get a fixed power rather than a vari...there is nothing wrong with you choice of rifle as a budget model....308 don't have enough kick to warrant anything to reduce recoil...so far on this topic the use of suppressors is for when you miss your first shot that you get another chance, easily fixed by more practise at the range...as you will be hoping to only use one shot in the field for each trip I hardly find it necessary for ear protection...different story on the range.

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## Spudattack

Have a look at the Howa, slightly more than the axis but well worth it, a much more robust rifle that can be upgraded later very easily.

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## gadgetman

What they've said above. Go the Savage International Trophy Hunter or Howa, not much more than you are looking at spending on the Axis but better quality. If you're around Chch I'd be happy to take you to the range for a play with suppressor on and off.

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## JoshC

Yep I'd go a Howa, and if it's your first centre fire rifle, then you should suppress it.

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## Luke.S

Wouldn't have a gun without a suppressor, they are pretty good

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## JoshC

Whats your budget for a start?? Presuming its the Savage Axis H&F package at $700 + $400 for suppressor, so ~ $1000-$1100??

Ruger American .308win Suppressed/scoped package | Trade Me

7-08 SS Tikka T3 Lite | Trade Me

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## Scottishkiwi

Thanks for the info guys!  :Have A Nice Day:  Sorry been at uni, Yeah my budget is around 1000ish, I really don't know too much when it comes to hunting rifles as i'm from an army family and most of my knowledge revolves around ww1-ww2 and some modern military firearms. Believe it or not I'm yet to even fire a gun! Being from the UK tends to hold ya back when it comes to hunting and shooting  :Sad:  

I asked on another thread about the howas and they seem to be quite good, I was unsure because 1. i've never heard of them and 2. They are japanese, I didn't even know they still made firearms for civvy use!

I was aiming for a proven american or eastern block brand(Like CZ), Would love a ruger or remmington but they seem to be out my budget, So I think it will be the howa 1500 and get a suppressor after I throw some shots downrange to get a feel for the rifle.

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## Scottishkiwi

> What they've said above. Go the Savage International Trophy Hunter or Howa, not much more than you are looking at spending on the Axis but better quality. If you're around Chch I'd be happy to take you to the range for a play with suppressor on and off.


Would love to, But I live in Welly>< Ty man!  :Grin:

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## Nick-D

The Howas in 308 also come factory threaded so you will not have the extra fuss/expense of threading/recrowning when you come to getting a supressor. Much better finish and build quality than the axis or ruger american. The scope it comes with is pretty average, but will get you by until you can afford better.

Also dont forget to factor in some cash for some cleaning and maintenance bits and bobs, the little hidden extras add up.

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## Spudattack

If you want something proven like a cz, @garyp has a nice Brno 308 he is selling for around 7 hundy, spend the rest on a scope.

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## ChrisF

Donot want to put a spanner in your works , BUT , if you have never fired a firearm before , then your 1st rifle should maybe be a rimfire bolt action , along the lines of a cheap chinese bruno , ie norinco etc , or a 2nd hand CZ452 etc .
You also need some  training before being let loose .

Yours  Chris

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## dirtyhabit

Ruger American with SSRNZ (Scott Traill) supprsessor...light and accurate and very economical

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## Scottishkiwi

> Donot want to put a spanner in your works , BUT , if you have never fired a firearm before , then your 1st rifle should maybe be a rimfire bolt action , along the lines of a cheap chinese bruno , ie norinco etc , or a 2nd hand CZ452 etc .
> You also need some  training before being let loose .
> 
> Yours  Chris


I agree I'd probably need a bit of coaching at first, But I don't see much point in getting a .22 if I'm planning on hunting, Especially deer and goats. I'd imagine it would be like when I started riding a motorcycle I had a 250 then a couple months later I was desperate for something bigger, Been on a 750 ever since  :Psmiley:  I may get a .22 at some point for indoor shoots but that isn't what I'm wanting to do right now and seems like i'd be wasting money.

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## Scottishkiwi

> The Howas in 308 also come factory threaded so you will not have the extra fuss/expense of threading/recrowning when you come to getting a supressor. Much better finish and build quality than the axis or ruger american. The scope it comes with is pretty average, but will get you by until you can afford better.
> 
> Also dont forget to factor in some cash for some cleaning and maintenance bits and bobs, the little hidden extras add up.


That does indeed sound good, I already factored in cleaning kits, I bought a set already + some oil  :Have A Nice Day:  got the set cheap, was an unissued surplus one

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## Pengy

Indoor shoots  :Wtfsmilie:

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## Scottishkiwi

> Indoor shoots


 Indoor range here in welly for 22 rifles  :Have A Nice Day:

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## Pengy

You are spoilt  :Sad:

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## Scottishkiwi

> You are spoilt


Wellington Central Smallbore Rifle Club

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## JoshC

No offence but Chris is right. Learn to walk before you run. If you haven't shot a firearm before and plan to 'go hunting' you need practice. You need to learn to shoot. Learn where to shoot an animal to achieve a clean kill. The animals deserve it. Practicing with a centre fire is costly if you are buying ammo. I'd recommend taking a step back, buying a rimfire and practicing. Then joining local deerstalkers club and tagging along on hunts will be far more productive than just buying a 308 and expecting to go shoot stuff.

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## Banana

> I may get a .22 at some point for indoor shoots but that isn't what I'm wanting to do right now and seems like i'd be wasting money.


Learning to shoot with only a .308 will be a bigger waste of money.

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## ebf

> That does indeed sound good, I already factored in cleaning kits, I bought a set already + some oil  got the set cheap, was an unissued surplus one


There was a cleaning thread recently. You might want to read that and get something other than a cheap multi-piece rod to stick down a nice new rifle...

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## Gunzrrr

You will only ever need one .308 in your life. Save the pennies, borrow from family, do layby ...  What ever it takes ...but get the rifle you want. 
Keep safe in the hills ... Gunzrrrr

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## Scottishkiwi

> No offence but Chris is right. Learn to walk before you run. If you haven't shot a firearm before and plan to 'go hunting' you need practice. You need to learn to shoot. Learn where to shoot an animal to achieve a clean kill. The animals deserve it. Practicing with a centre fire is costly if you are buying ammo. I'd recommend taking a step back, buying a rimfire and practicing. Then joining local deerstalkers club and tagging along on hunts will be far more productive than just buying a 308 and expecting to go shoot stuff.


My plan was to get a couple hundred rounds (I've put money aside for some cheap FMJ stuff) and just spend a few days at the range over this way to get my bearings and zero the rifle, Most 22 clubs here don't shoot further than 25 yards. I've had plenty of practice with air rifles, pre charged rifles, crossbows in the past and when it comes to shot placement I know the basics of where to shoot on a deer, High shoulder to attempt to cause the spine to break or Behind the lower part of the shoulder blade to attempt double lung/heart shots and usually avoid headshots at longer distances due to the brain being a small target and you risk shooting its jaw and causing it to not be able to eat and slowly starve to death.  I also intend on joining the deerstalkers and taking a wee course to learn stuff first hand as I really don't know any hunters personally, Restricted to watching tutorials and informational videos online!

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## Scottishkiwi

> There was a cleaning thread recently. You might want to read that and get something other than a cheap multi-piece rod to stick down a nice new rifle...


It was originally for a heckler and koch, Says made in germany on it. If I need another one oh well I guess i gotta get it  :Psmiley:  I will also give that a read  :Wink:  Wanna get as much know-how as I can.

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## Nick-D

22, is never a bad idea. 

They are a hell of a lot of cheap fun, and you will very likely end up a better shot if you start out and move up.

I shoot mine way more than my 6.5x55 or 7.62x39

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## Spoon

1; I think everyone should use a .22lr (or rimfire of some sort) to get some general gun use experience before a centrefire. That would be my recommendation, however that's obviously entirely up to you. And seeing as you've had plenty of practice with air rifles I guess that would suffice  :Have A Nice Day: 
2; I would NOT buy the Savage Axis. Save a little longer and go for the Savage Trophy Hunter or similar priced guns (Howa for example are good guns for the money, as multiple people have already stated).

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## Gibo

> You are spoilt


Shit mate we even have one in Te Puke  :Grin:

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## Shamus

> I agree I'd probably need a bit of coaching at first, *But I don't see much point in getting a .22 if I'm planning on hunting, Especially deer and goats*. I'd imagine it would be like when I started riding a motorcycle I had a 250 then a couple months later I was desperate for something bigger, Been on a 750 ever since  I may get a .22 at some point for indoor shoots but that isn't what I'm wanting to do right now and seems like i'd be wasting money.


I think you are missing the point completely ...

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## l1ft

If he doesn't want to start on a .22 that's fine, he's a student, probably isn't earning that much money and more importantly it is more likely he can find and use peoples .22s who are willing to let him pop off 100s of rounds for free or for very cheap at indoor clubs with club guns. I agree he should get his practice in, but with limited funds and the end goal being goats and deer a .308 is the ticket. 

Just make sure you get plenty of range time with the rifle before you take it hunting, go with someone who knows what they are doing, even shooting 'cheap fmj' before you zero with hunting loads will give you a feel for the rifle. Go down to a club or a mates farm and practice fundamentals with the .22. 

People will spend your money quickly on this forum. Take their advice as it is sound in principle, but get the rifle you want, and get practice with a .22 without buying one.

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## KiwiinSeattle

> I asked on another thread about the howas and they seem to be quite good, I was unsure because 1. i've never heard of them and 2. They are japanese, I didn't even know they still made firearms for civvy use!


Yes, the Japanese make civilian firearms - Browning X Bolt, Howa and some Weatherby rifles.

Heaps of good advice on this thread.

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## Pengy

> Shit mate we even have one in Te Puke


The only official range up here is open just the second sunday of the month, and caters for black powder,pistols, rimfire and  centrefire all on the same day. It is outdoor, so a bit weather dependant, and it is just much easier to go a to a mates farm and use his setup. It only gets out to 100 safely, but that is fine. The only other restriction of course is stock in nearby paddocks

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## Scottishkiwi

> I think you are missing the point completely ...


I get the point, But I simply don't make much money,I'm a student and 90% of my money is gone after paying for rent, gas, food and other essentials. If money was no issue i'd get a .22lr like a 10/22 or something no questions asked, But I have one end goal to start with and it took me long enough to save up what I have already(Almost a year). No doubt i'd buy one for plinking at some point but I want more versatility. At the end of the day getting a .308 or something makes no real difference except it kicks harder and the ammo costs more, Practice is practice.

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## Scottishkiwi

> If he doesn't want to start on a .22 that's fine, he's a student, probably isn't earning that much money and more importantly it is more likely he can find and use peoples .22s who are willing to let him pop off 100s of rounds for free or for very cheap at indoor clubs with club guns. I agree he should get his practice in, but with limited funds and the end goal being goats and deer a .308 is the ticket. 
> 
> Just make sure you get plenty of range time with the rifle before you take it hunting, go with someone who knows what they are doing, even shooting 'cheap fmj' before you zero with hunting loads will give you a feel for the rifle. Go down to a club or a mates farm and practice fundamentals with the .22. 
> 
> People will spend your money quickly on this forum. Take their advice as it is sound in principle, but get the rifle you want, and get practice with a .22 without buying one.


Pretty much what you said is dead on what my thoughts are. I'm trying to do this on a budget and not to mention I know pretty much no one in the hunting and shooting scene here so I'm starting literally from the bottom. Been saving what little i get left over after paying for essentials, I also don't know anyone in my region who owns a farm, only a couple people up north from when I worked up there for a bit and i'm not driving 8 or so hours to shoot a .22! I was even considering getting an SKS and buying an old surplus spam can. But I'd rather get a good bolt gun, good scope like a leupold 3-9x40 and some low grain fmj rounds and heavier hollow hunting rounds and getting a feel for each by spending a whole lotta time at the range and learning that way. (I still may get an SKS one day because I love milsurps :Wink:  )

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## JoshC

You don't need to buy a new rifle to get into hunting. I would say the vast majority started with a 2nd hand rifle or  a hand me down rifle.

For your budget of $1000 you could quite easily find a reasonable condition common calibre scoped centre fire (243/308/270) and reasonable condition .22. Have you considered that?

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## Spudattack

> You don't need to buy a new rifle to get into hunting. I would say the vast majority started with a 2nd hand rifle or  a hand me down rifle.
> 
> For your budget of $1000 you could quite easily find a reasonable condition common calibre scoped centre fire (243/308/270) and reasonable condition .22. Have you considered that?


This is good advice, as I said earlier if you are patient you can find good second hand quality rifles, scoped and ready to go, for less than a new budget rifle.
PM garyp, the Brno he has is scoped for $700 and is the equivalent of a CZ550 which are $1700 odd new as a bare rifle.
I have just paid $700 for a Brno zkk600 that has fired 20 rounds and is like new, they are there if you look for them and ths would leave some cash for a cheap .22.

Choice is yours though, I went new rifle to start and ended up selling them and replacing them with old premium rifles!

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## Scottishkiwi

> You don't need to buy a new rifle to get into hunting. I would say the vast majority started with a 2nd hand rifle or  a hand me down rifle.
> 
> For your budget of $1000 you could quite easily find a reasonable condition common calibre scoped centre fire (243/308/270) and reasonable condition .22. Have you considered that?


 I have, But I've been told 1/2 of your money should go towards the rifle, the other half should go towards the scope. I mean if i could find a couple for that price i'd go for it though. They say guns are like tattoos, once you get one, you'll get another.  What are your opinions on getting a mosin nagant and a cheap .22? the 7.62x54R is a great hunting round and plenty cheap and the mosins run for about 300-400 dollars unissued and are easily sporterized.

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## gadgetman

This is damned good value for a basically new rifle with a reasonably reasonable scope.

Savage Trophy Hunter .270 win | Trade Me

I'm sure if you wanted to go second hand a few of the guys on here would be happy to check it out for you. Rifles are a bit like cars. The first 5m driven, from the car yard the the road, costs about 25% of the purchase value. I did buy a new centrefire but have bought a few second hand that have been excellent bargains.

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## ONYVA

I have found that a quality 2nd hand firearm is better than a budjet new one

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## Spudattack

I have just found a Sako A2 in .308 with a Bushnell Elite 3200 3-9x40 for $700, it has been used and bluing is a little worn but is an awesome rifle for the money.





Pictures are average

Work mate of mine has it for sale

PM me if you want his contact details.

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## JoshC

Now you'd be mad not to jump at that! Easy to tidy up to look new again too!! Open sights too!

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## Scouser

+1 thats a corker.....

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## Danny

I should buy that.

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## Spudattack

Well, if he doesn't want it then I suppose it would be fair game! Has your licence arrived yet Scottishkiwi?

I nearly bought it but decided on my Brno instead. Doubt it will hang around long at that price.

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## Shamus

> Well, if he doesn't want it then I suppose it would be fair game! Has your licence arrived yet Scottishkiwi?
> 
> I nearly bought it but decided on my Brno instead. Doubt it will hang around long at that price.


Could be very keen on that for the young feller if and when it becomes fair game. Can you PM me if it does?

Cheers

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## gadgetman

> Now you'd be mad not to jump at that! Easy to tidy up to look new again too!! Open sights too!


+2

Jump on that one!

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## Pengy

Scottishkiwi doesn't have his FAL yet so he is a tad gutted to miss out on that fine bargain

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## gadgetman

> Scottishkiwi doesn't have his FAL yet so he is a tad gutted to miss out on that fine bargain


I'm sure I could just squeeze it in about, .... Bugger, all full at the inn.

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## veitnamcam

But it goes to show the deals that come up on here from time to time :Have A Nice Day: 
Just need licence and cash in hand - I struggle with the latter .

Sent from my GT-S5360T using Tapatalk 2

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## Spudattack

> I'm sure I could just squeeze it in about, .... Bugger, all full at the inn.


Crikey GM, looks a bit like my safe, i reckon i can get 2 more in mine though!  :Thumbsup:

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## Toby

You know those times where you wish you had $700? this is one of those times

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## Spudattack

Scottishkiwi has contacted me, i have passed on details, have suggested asking to hold it for him until licence is through, maybe paying a deposit.
If it falls through i will let you guys know.

Thought there might be a few interested!  :Grin:

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## gadgetman

> Crikey GM, looks a bit like my safe, i reckon i can get 2 more in mine though!


As it is I had to lend out four items (243, Rem 870, and a couple of air rifles) so I could get what I have in there.  :Grin:

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## Spudattack

> As it is I had to lend out four items (243, Rem 870, and a couple of air rifles) so I could get what I have in there.


Pisses you off when they sell you a 10 gun safe and you get to 7 and the bloody thing is full, just because you cut 10 notches in the foam rack doesn't mean 10 rifles will fit in there!

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## gadgetman

> Pisses you off when they sell you a 10 gun safe and you get to 7 and the bloody thing is full, just because you cut 10 notches in the foam rack doesn't mean 10 rifles will fit in there!


Mine is an 8 gun but I have 11 in there. Top and tailing works.

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## GravelBen

Had a laugh when the local AO was inspecting mine and filling out the form to say how many guns would fit... "It might look a bit suspect if I write 50, so I'm gonna say 15..."

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## PERRISCICABA

I will seek you a Tikka T3 Lite 7mm-08, 140~ rounds thru it with suppressor for $1300, but no scope yet.

PM me.





> Whats your budget for a start?? Presuming its the Savage Axis H&F package at $700 + $400 for suppressor, so ~ $1000-$1100??
> 
> Ruger American .308win Suppressed/scoped package | Trade Me
> 
> 7-08 SS Tikka T3 Lite | Trade Me

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