# Hunting > Varminting and Small Game Hunting >  Best Subsonic 22LR Hunting Ammo ?

## Kiwi Greg

Haven't done much at all with the 22LR for years.

What are Guys using subsonic hunting ammo ?

I have my Lithgow which shoots really well with the SK ammo I have, but it sucks for hunting.

Haven't used my 10-22 in years, still have some Winchester Subs for it.

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## 223nut

My 10/22 prefers cci subs, as does the cz455. Though the 10/22 will need another test after losing half the barrel  :Thumbsup:

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## viper

CCI sub sonic is my favorite, very consistent and ood on game performance.

Using Winchester subs at the moment and they work fine also.

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## gonetropo

CCI subs, consistent accuracy

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## res

Cci subs are my go to as well, I put little plastic balls in the hollow point form time to time and it really helps the expansion

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## 223nut

> Cci subs are my go to as well, I put little plastic balls in the hollow point form time to time and it really helps the expansion


Have heard of this and wondered if it was worth the effort

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## res

> Have heard of this and wondered if it was worth the effort


I mainly do it when I'm using a bolt gun and trying to extend the range with subs as when the speed gets real low I find that don't open up otherwise, probably do about 5% of my cci subs as I'm to lazy to do it for all-may have to teach the kids to do it in a couple of years

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## veitnamcam

I find the winchester expand better than the cci (both 40 and 42 gr aussie)

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## 7mmwsm

I find cci performance absolute crap on game. Winchester and Kilwell(same bullet) very good.

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## SiB

I like the Winchester 42 gr subs cycle well in my 10/22.  I'll get maybe one miscycle per fifty

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## kidmac42

I use winchester 42g sub's in my 795 , they go fine.

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## quentin

CCI Subs and Eley match work really well through my CZ455. The rabbits, hares, and magpies really cannot tell the difference in price between the two makes.
Bullet expansion is pretty much zero with both of these rounds, but an accurately placed bullet with no expansion seems to do better, than a less accurate round that mushrooms out. Any head or chest shot has proven to do the job regardless of what make of 22lr ammo used.
The worst ammo I have ever used was the Remington bulk stuff. Split cases, inconsistent velocities. It shot groups more reminiscent of a shotgun blast than a rifle.
I ran a few makes over the chrony, and did 5 round groups to see what would work in my rifle. http://www.nzhuntingandshooting.co.n...tml#post433416

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## Solo

Does anyone have any experience with the Highland subsonics? I remember I used to fire them out of my Stirling in my early teens, but that was long before I knew enough to properly assess it.

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## 199p

Used cci but they dont kill that well i found. Switched back to winny and mint performance 

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## zimmer

> Haven't done much at all with the 22LR for years.
> 
> What are Guys using subsonic hunting ammo ?
> 
> I have my Lithgow which shoots really well with the SK ammo I have, but it sucks for hunting.
> 
> Haven't used my 10-22 in years, still have some Winchester Subs for it.


Heh Greg have you shot any more groups with yours lately. You did post a stunner some time ago.

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## zimmer

CCI solids kill just as well as CCI subs when head shooting. However, the problem I have is my property slopes away and the solids seem to rickoshit lot easier than HPs. Weeeeeeeeeee scary noise in a lifestyle block area. You shit yourself after 1 event!

The old Kilwell Whispers I found to be effective also SK subs.

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## viper

It's all about shot placement

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## 7mmwsm

> It's all about shot placement


No its not. Some projectiles perform a lot better than others when placed in the same spot. 
Enough projectile manufacturers have done heaps of research to prove that.

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## Boaraxa

Remmington 38grn subs float my boat good to about 35 meters on sheep...I don't have yards  :Grin:

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## Tommy

> I use winchester 42g sub's in my 795 , they go fine.


Mine loves them, pity they cost more than the Rolling Stones for a private New Years Eve party. Tried the cheaper 40gr equiv, no deal. If you ever see that orange/red box PMC zapper stuff, grab a box or two and give it a try, my 795ss likes them best (although yes supersonic). Got given a bunch a while back, tried it, liked it, and was running low recently, saw some at a gun show for $6/ box so grabbed it all

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## MassiveAttack

I think the best killing 22 ammo is the all lead (as opposed to copper washed) projectiles with the biggest hollow point possible.  This generally means subsonics which are also the most accurate admittedly at the cost of a little more drop.

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## gonetropo

> Remmington 38grn subs float my boat good to about 35 meters on sheep...I don't have yards


remington (dupont powder)  ammo is dirtier than a manchester st hooker

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## viper

> No its not. Some projectiles perform a lot better than others when placed in the same spot. 
> Enough projectile manufacturers have done heaps of research to prove that.


Still about shot placement mate, you can gut shoot rabbits all day long and the results won't be much different between brands. I find a head or shoulder shot no matter what brand of subs used works.
However some "brands" kill better than others with marginal shots. 
Confidence in the ammo you use is another factor, especially as the distance opens up.

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## Tommy

> remington (dupont powder)  ammo is dirtier than a manchester st hooker


Is it what! My 795 goes from clean to jammed in two mags with that utter shit. Anything else will do a brick or two and get then get cleaned with little or no effect on cycling

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## Kiwi Greg

> Heh Greg have you shot any more groups with yours lately. You did post a stunner some time ago.


I haven't even taken it out of the safe since then.....

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## rockland

> Mine loves them, pity they cost more than the Rolling Stones for a private New Years Eve party. Tried the cheaper 40gr equiv, no deal. If you ever see that orange/red box PMC zapper stuff, grab a box or two and give it a try, my 795ss likes them best (although yes supersonic). Got given a bunch a while back, tried it, liked it, and was running low recently, saw some at a gun show for $6/ box so grabbed it all


Yep my .22 likes the Aussie Win 42 subsonic too.

I remember using PMC Zappers after that big advertising promo they did here in the late 1980's and it was widely available for a few years after that but have not seen it for a long time. They did the standard velocity solid, HV solids and hollow points and Moderator subsonic hollow points. Takes me back...

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## Ultimitsu

> *CCI Subs* and Eley match work really well through my CZ455. ....
> Bullet expansion is pretty much zero with both of these rounds...


I have done a lot of possum shooting using CCI SV and CCI Subs. they are both subsonic at about the same speed, the only difference is one is solid and the other is hollow point. CCI Subs clearly does better than CCI SV in killing power. Since the weight is the same and speed is the same, it must mean Subs does expand.

Some people use a tool to tap/press a hollow point out of the SV. how well that makes the solid expand is actually an interesting question. People who do it seem to live it so it must work to some degree.

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## Krameranzac

Sadly we dropped in choice of  subsonic loads when Aguila subsonic and PMC moderator disappeared off the market. That Aguila load shot well and was very quiet.

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## Ultimitsu

> What are Guys using subsonic hunting ammo ?
> 
> I have my Lithgow which shoots really well with the SK ammo I have, but it sucks for hunting.


IMHO, there is a trade off each person must decide for themselves. Best killing power and best accuracy are mutually exclusive. The question is how far you would pursue killing power and accept the loss of accuracy. That question should nto be determined in a vacuum. It depends on the inherent accuracy in the rifle, the shooting style ( freehand or bipod), type of game, the purpose of shooting, and whether a few losses is acceptable. It is a complex mental algebra. Most people seem to settle on CCI subs, myself included.

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## zimmer

> Sadly we dropped in choice of  subsonic loads when Aguila subsonic and PMC moderator disappeared off the market. That Aguila load shot well and was very quiet.


The Aguila may be equivalent in the Mex made Fiocchi subs but that too has gone at present.

SK have also discontinued SK Subs - yeah I know, no loss as not effective but I find them excrutiatingly accurate for paper punching.

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## MassiveAttack

I can confirm that when you gut shoot a rabbit with a 223 and a vmax it's dead.  Not saying anybody should gut shoot rabbits but it's more insurance for when you don't hit it in the right place.  There is no replacement for displacement.

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## viper

Rabbit shooting at central

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## zimmer

SK ammo availability - just been into Belmont Ammo and they advise they have a good selection of SK arriving @ the end of Jan. Seemingly no SK Subs though.

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## rambo-6mmrem

Winchester 42gn or even just the standard 40gn cci subsonic hp gets 3rd

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## smidey

Winchester 40 or 42 gr subs is all I've ever shot and been successful for the intended task. Lately they have had the odd (1 in 50) sonic boom and some have what appears to be some wax on the shells which makes them a little difficult to retract. Other than that I've always found them very accurate


Sent from my workbench

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## viper

> Winchester 40 or 42 gr subs is all I've ever shot and been successful for the intended task. Lately they have had the odd (1 in 50) sonic boom and some have what appears to be some wax on the shells which makes them a little difficult to retract. Other than that I've always found them very accurate
> Attachment 61986
> 
> Sent from my workbench


was the projectile taken from a shot animal ? If so that's great expansion from a .22 round.

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## smidey

> was the projectile taken from a shot animal ? If so that's great expansion from a .22 round.


yes, retrieved from a hare. Was under the skin on the opposing side

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## 7mmwsm

> was the projectile taken from a shot animal ? If so that's great expansion from a .22 round.


Pretty standard for winchester.

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## Feather or Shoot

Winchester hands down perform better on game, but price and accuracy see me shooting cci. Agree that Winchester subs aren't always subsonic in my rifle and I really don't get the point of shooting hv in a 22. Mine is always suppressed.

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## viper

Well I had to go to Winchester as local shop out off CCI subs. Brought a brick three weeks ago and I have got to say I am impressed. I lost no accuracy and performance equal to if not better that CCI on game.
I will buy them again.

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## Feather or Shoot

Winchester don't feed as reliably in my marlin model 60. 
Out of interest @viper, how much for your brick of Winchester? 

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## 7mmwsm

> Well I had to go to Winchester as local shop out off CCI subs. Brought a brick three weeks ago and I have got to say I am impressed. I lost no accuracy and performance equal to if not better that CCI on game.
> I will buy them again.


HaHa I told you so!!!! (Just stirring)
Try Kilwell Whisper. It's the same bullet, Winchester head stamp and all. But usually cheaper.

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## viper

I think it was $89

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## 300_BLK

Power point orange box, CCI stinger are my go to.

Bulk Winchester 555 HP works well.

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## tetawa

Had a few sonic booms in the last brick of Winchester subs, store recons that the factories sorting an't what it used to be. Had the same with Remington subs.

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## 300_BLK

> Had a few sonic booms in the last brick of Winchester subs, store recons that the factories sorting an't what it used to be. Had the same with Remington subs.


A sports store owner gave me 6 boxes of the rem subs, he couldn't sell the stuff. Sonic booms, dirty as and some were not loaded with much powder. Had a few doing 500fps...

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## quentin

> Winchester 40 or 42 gr subs is all I've ever shot and been successful for the intended task. Lately they have had the odd (1 in 50) sonic boom and some have what appears to be some wax on the shells which makes them a little difficult to retract. Other than that I've always found them very accurate
> Attachment 61986
> 
> Sent from my workbench


CCI sub almost looks the same when retrieved from a hare. Very rarely ever get one back from a rabbit.


But they do leave big holes in rabbits. This was one of last nights efforts.

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## 300_BLK

> Power point orange box, CCI stinger are my go to.
> 
> Bulk Winchester 555 HP works well.


HAHA retard...

Should have re-read the thread title. Need a coffee...

 :Thumbsup:

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## Markgibsonr25

cci subs but the 45 grn stuff

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## Markgibsonr25

cz 452 thius stuff works and groups well.

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## Kiwi Greg

> cz 452 thius stuff works and groups well.


Cool, thanks, I have a couple of bricks to try it out  :Have A Nice Day:

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## tetawa

> A sports store owner gave me 6 boxes of the rem subs, he couldn't sell the stuff. Sonic booms, dirty as and some were not loaded with much powder. Had a few doing 500fps...


Haven't had the problem with low velocities as I use it in a Kidd 10-22 and don't think it will cycle, but had more than my share of sonic booms with the Remington.

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## kotuku

> I find the winchester expand better than the cci (both 40 and 42 gr aussie)


been a winchester user for 30+yrs now and swear by em .the old rabbitammo&cuzzie dynapoint were extremely bloody effective ,and the modern subs just the same.its actually suprising the hole they leave when they trip th bunny or possum up!

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## gonetropo

ok years back while young and silly (now old and silly) i opened up the tips on some 22 sub hollowpoint and added a drop of mercury sealed it off with candle wax. you have to use it pretty much the same day as the mercury eats lead fast. the effects on small furry bunnies is rather interesting and to say the least theres bugga all meat left as it tends to blow huge holes in poor mr bugs

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## 223nut

> ok years back while young and silly (now old and silly) i opened up the tips on some 22 sub hollowpoint and added a drop of mercury sealed it off with candle wax. you have to use it pretty much the same day as the mercury eats lead fast. the effects on small furry bunnies is rather interesting and to say the least theres bugga all meat left as it tends to blow huge holes in poor mr bugs


Can't say I'd be keen on the meat after being injected with mercury... Sounds like fun though

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## zimmer

> Can't say I'd be keen on the meat after being injected with mercury... Sounds like fun though


Probably OK for vampires though, oh sorry, isn't that a silver bullet? Or a stake thru the heart??

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## MassiveAttack

You have to spike them through the head if they are a zombie.  That or shoot them with a Z Max projectile.

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## 7mmwsm

Was in Gun City in Hamilton today. They have Aquila(?) 60 grain subs. $199 a slab

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## tetawa

> Was in Gun City in Hamilton today. They have Aquila(?) 60 grain subs. $199 a slab


Will they stabilise with the .22 twist rate?

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## 300_BLK

> Cci subs are my go to as well, I put little plastic balls in the hollow point form time to time and it really helps the expansion


 @res can you explain? Where do you source your balls?

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## 7mmwsm

> Will they stabilise with the .22 twist rate?


Don't know sorry. Didn't buy any. I think they are a solid so cant imagine their performance being that good.

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## viper

Funny Thread this.
Over 1000 veiws
Over 60 replys.................

Only basically two brands of ammo

CCI or Winchester............

End result , both brands work well.

Observation...... as shooters we aren't exactly spoilt for choice are we :Sad:

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## 7mmwsm

> Don't know sorry. Didn't buy any. I think they are a solid so cant imagine their performance being that good.


Unless they do the yawing thing. Then they may be ok.

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## 7mmwsm

> Funny Thread this.
> Over 1000 veiws
> Over 60 replys.................
> 
> Only basically two brands of ammo
> 
> CCI or Winchester............
> 
> End result , both brands work well.
> ...


Bit like beer. We have Waikato, which is great. So don't need to experiment with inferior products.

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## 223nut

> Where do you source your balls?


Ummm in usually in my underwear

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## 300_BLK

> Ummm in usually in my underwear


I was waiting for that

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## 223nut

> I was waiting for that


Someone had to go there

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## i41do2

good discussion,
Yep I'd go for the winchester or killwell 40 or 42.  Have been happy with these.
I've tried the rems and would never go back.  Absolutely rubbish consistency.

Need to source another brick soon and will go again with kilwell or Winchester.

Haven't tried the CCI.

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## Ben-tard

> Unless they do the yawing thing. Then they may be ok.


In my 10/22 the Aquila 60gr go through paper side ways at 20mtrs, they would do a bit of damage if I could actually manage a hit with them. In my JW15 they at least travel pointing in the right direction but very poor accuracy.

My brothers 10/22 loves the Remington subs, handy as everywhere usually has them in stock  :Have A Nice Day:

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## Ben-tard

My brothers 10/22 loves the Remington subs, handy as everywhere usually has them in stock  :Have A Nice Day: [/QUOTE]

- 'Cause no one else wants 'em LOL

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## Martin358

> @res can you explain? Where do you source your balls?


Mine are in the wifes handbag

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## Gunzrrr

I have a couple of mates who work in different gunshops and they both choose to shoot Winchester 42's. I use them too in both my bolt action and 10/22. I think the 42's cycle better in the 10/22 than CCI 40's. But then I could be full of it.

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## Chilli_Dog

> In my 10/22 the Aquila 60gr go through paper side ways at 20mtrs, they would do a bit of damage if I could actually manage a hit with them. In my JW15 they at least travel pointing in the right direction but very poor accuracy.
> 
> My brothers 10/22 loves the Remington subs, handy as everywhere usually has them in stock


My Jw15 actually grouped the 60gr ones pretty well, to expensive to really consider for more than novelty factor though

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## Gunzrrr

I believe Remington subs made under contract by CCI.

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## dogmatix

My .22 being an AR upper is quite fussy. Really only likes the CCI 'Suppressor' stuff designed for semis. 
Of course it's one of the more expensive .22 ammo out there. Shoots okay with CCI Minimags within 50m, but out to 100m they are transonic and groups spread.
Need to try some Federal stuff, as it hates Winchester.

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## Mintie

I picked up Eley HP Subs and love them, More accurate and way quieter than anything else I tried in my CZ452, even quieter than the CCI Suppressor rounds which were $29 for 50!

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## Gunzrrr

I use Winchester 40gr with my 10/22 and accuracy and cycling very good. I hear the. 42gr is the way to go but I bought an outer so still chewing through the 40's. A mate does professional pest control with a 10/22 and he literally "swears" by Winchester.

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## headcase

They hit well. I like them too but the neck and action must be kept clean or they are poor recyclers.

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## Dublin

> A sports store owner gave me 6 boxes of the rem subs, he couldn't sell the stuff. Sonic booms, dirty as and some were not loaded with much powder. Had a few doing 500fps...


Last time i had that stuff out in the field the majority of the rounds were just bouncing off Possoms and they were just staring at me. At first i thought i was missing and the rifle was out. However i thought to bring along some CCI subs just in case. Starting using them and the coons were doing back flips out the trees with only one round.

Will never use Remmington .22 subs again, stuffs useless!!! Still have that same box sitting at home.

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## Feather or Shoot

> I picked up Eley HP Subs and love them, More accurate and way quieter than anything else I tried in my CZ452, even quieter than the CCI Suppressor rounds which were $29 for 50!


Where'd you get eley rounds from? 

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## Mintie

> Where'd you get eley rounds from? 
> 
> Sent from my GT-I8190T using Tapatalk


https://shootingstuff.co.nz/eley-sub...-rounds-1.html

More expensive than CCI standard but performs better and cheaper than CCI Suppressor.

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## quentin

At that price they are worth a try. A little slower than the CCI subs, so hopefully that will keep the number that go supersonic to a minimum.

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## Tommy

> Last time i had that stuff out in the field the majority of the rounds were just bouncing off Possoms and they were just staring at me. At first i thought i was missing and the rifle was out. However i thought to bring along some CCI subs just in case. Starting using them and the coons were doing back flips out the trees with only one round.
> 
> Will never use Remmington .22 subs again, stuffs useless!!! Still have that same box sitting at home.


The dirtiest filthiest ammo known to man.

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## Dublin

> The dirtiest filthiest ammo known to man.


And that!!!! Bloody filthy alright, makes clean up a bit of a pain afterwards. And if i understand it correctly its very corrosive so if it is left is not so flash for your barrel.

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## csmiffy

spent 10 years in OZ so cant comment from recent experience but tried various subsonics-Eley, PMC. Not really a lot around and cost was a factor so stayed away from CCI ammo. Always found the Winchester and also kilwell hushpower (I think they were Winchester anyway) worked better than anything else

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## RUMPY

> Ummm in usually in my underwear



Sometimes not in underwear but always in a sack.

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## Micky Duck

my norinco bolt actions have all hated winchester power point supersonic in that they are a turd to feed...both the 40 and 42grn subsonic feed well and shoot very well in them. strangly enough using the subsonics in long barreled norinco they not much noiser than with suppressor,well quiet enough to not bother anyone anyhow.

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## systolic

Holy thread resurrection Batman!

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## 223nut

> Holy thread resurrection Batman!


And it's comes back to list few wih my dirty undies....

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## Cordite

> Cci subs are my go to as well, I put little plastic balls in the hollow point form time to time and it really helps the expansion





> I mainly do it when I'm using a bolt gun and trying to extend the range with subs as when the speed gets real low I find that don't open up otherwise, probably do about 5% of my cci subs as I'm to lazy to do it for all-may have to teach the kids to do it in a couple of years


Pray, tell me more.  Any pictures?  Where do you get the plastic round things from?

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## RUMPY

> Holy thread resurrection Batman!


I was just posting to get my post count up to put some pics on another thread. :Grin:

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## muzza

Years ago I got a new JW15 , fitted a Silent Kill suppressor and fed it solely Winchester subsonics , and never had a problem with it feeding . Click WOP every time if I did my bit right .

If your rifle likes Australian Winchester ammo you best stock up large because you are only going to get American made stuff soon and it is on a par with Remington for poor quality.

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## johnd

SK Magazine is pretty good. You have to buy a 500 rd can of it though.

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## Russian 22.

> SK Magazine is pretty good. You have to buy a 500 rd can of it though.


And cheap. I got it for 65 bucks on special. Never used it apart from plonking though

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## muzza

a few plonkers around here that you could plink at ....

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## 308

Another vote here for CCI subs - my 10/22 likes them

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