# Firearms and Shooting > Shooting >  Farmlands

## Marty Henry

Not sure if this is the right place for this 

CHANGES TO AMMUNITION AND HUNTING SALES AT FARMLANDS




From 1st December 2020, new legislation states that any person managing a business which sells ammunition must have a current firearms licence*.**

Farmlands has made a tough decision to move away from selling ammunition and hunting supplies, due to:*

The ongoing cost of maintaining staff firearms licences*

Compliant storage facilities in-store and in the homes of license holders*

Risk of personal fines for non-compliance. **

To comply with this incoming legislation and clear our existing stock, there will be 25% off ammunition until 30th November.*

Farmlands understands the convenience of being able to purchase ammunition and hunting items when shopping and we thank you for your understanding and ongoing support of your co-operative. We will be in touch soon with how Farmlands can ensure your hunting and ammunition supplies are taken care of through our Farmlands Card Partners. **


John Campbell*
General Manager*Sales and Retail

Also note that ammunition sales and quantities are to be recorded along with the fal of the purchaser in the new ammendments.**

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## Kiwi Sapper

> ...............CHANGES TO AMMUNITION AND HUNTING SALES AT FARMLANDS....


Never ever purchased there, but if they bow down to the Show Pony and her stable boys, then I may as well toddle down and see if I can get some cheap stuff at a loss to them..............

Echos of H & F

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## widerange

Nutha nail.
CUNTS

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## bigbear

Gutted  cheap ammo there

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## Marty Henry

The link didn't copy I should have checked. It gets worse
Ammunition
New provisions relating to the sales, purchase and possession of ammunition become effective in December 2020.

Ammunition Possession
Ammunition Sellers


From December 2020 any person who is managing a business that includes the sale or supply of ammunition and who is not the holder of a dealer’s licence needs to be recognised by Police as an ammunition seller.

That means the person must have a current firearms licence, and apply to Police if they wish to start or continue a business as an ammunition seller. This is so Police can verify the person’s security – such as appropriate facilities to ensure the secure storage of the ammunition – and record keeping arrangements are satisfactory.

An ammunition book must be kept by the seller / supplier of ammunition to record the name and licence number of the purchaser / receiver and the quantity and type of ammunition (s22D). Records must be retained for 10 years after the last transaction in the book (be it physical or electronic).

An ammunition seller’s records and stock can be inspected at any reasonable time subject to Police giving seven days’ notice (s22D).

 So if you belong to a club that buys in bulk to pass the savings  on to its members your committee just got a shit more work to do

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## Marty Henry

The link didn't copy I should have checked. It gets worse
Ammunition
New provisions relating to the sales, purchase and possession of ammunition become effective in December 2020.

Ammunition Possession
Ammunition Sellers


From December 2020 any person who is managing a business that includes the sale or supply of ammunition and who is not the holder of a dealer’s licence needs to be recognised by Police as an ammunition seller.

That means the person must have a current firearms licence, and apply to Police if they wish to start or continue a business as an ammunition seller. This is so Police can verify the person’s security – such as appropriate facilities to ensure the secure storage of the ammunition – and record keeping arrangements are satisfactory.

An ammunition book must be kept by the seller / supplier of ammunition to record the name and licence number of the purchaser / receiver and the quantity and type of ammunition (s22D). Records must be retained for 10 years after the last transaction in the book (be it physical or electronic).

An ammunition seller’s records and stock can be inspected at any reasonable time subject to Police giving seven days’ notice (s22D).

 So if you belong to a club that buys in bulk to pass the savings  on to its members your committee just got a shit more work to do.

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## trapperjohn

Well I just can not like that.

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## TeRei

Who were the drongos who voted for Labour. Dont cry. Did you seriously think the PM embraced principles in her political outlook.

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## Ben Waimata

Farmlands will stop selling ammo to farmers to use on their farms. Why am I not surprised. When they stopped selling cyanide they at least had a good reason (someone almost died). This is just Govt BS interference for no logical reason.

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## Danger Mouse

Wasn't it police that approved the sale of ammunition to Tarrant? So they fuck it up,  and we pay the price.

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## mikee

> Wasn't it police that approved the sale of ammunition to Tarrant? So they fuck it up,  and we pay the price.


AGAIN

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## widerange

All part of the plan boys

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## Rushy

The additional administrative burden to the businesses that sell ammunition will be a significant cost to business.  I would expect the cost of ammunition to increase accordingly as it is a user pays world we now live in.  The stupidity of the legislation that has brought this upon us does not escape me.  I predict that there will be some on line ammo supply businesses up for sale soon.  Watch this space.

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## northdude

Or it means that instead of being able to buy 1 pack of ammo as you can just go get another packet when you need it you will have a bulk lot on the property. Then you get broken into instead of getting one pack they end up with.....

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## zimmer

Had great hopes for Farmlands when I became a shareholder 10 or more years ago. Overall, they have lost the plot though, probably around the time of amalgamation. 

A farm supply outfit not selling ammo, sheez.

FarmSource is my go to supplier nowadays, despite me not being a Fonterra fan.

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## tetawa

> Had great hopes for Farmlands when I became a shareholder 10 or more years ago. Overall, they have lost the plot though, probably around the time of amalgamation. 
> 
> A farm supply outfit not selling ammo, sheez.
> 
> FarmSource is my go to supplier nowadays, despite me not being a Fonterra fan.


+1

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## tetawa

Have supported Farmlands for my farming requirements plus they would receive firearms on my behalf and their ammo prices were good, especially shotgun. Don't blame the local branch staff for the decision but it will be them that doesn't receive my trade.

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## Percy Jones

Its a bit shortsighted and unfair for everyone to shit on farmlands and not support them now they are not selling ammo. The regulatory shit they have thrust on them is large. Would people still buy the ammo if the price increased say 40% to cover the implementation of all the storage and admin they will now have to deal with?

Its a simple business decision they made, however its more of the death by 1000 cuts we are getting.

Lastly, Do you know that from the 24th of December the possesion of any gun part at all by an unlicenced person could cost them 5 years in prision or a 10K fine. Thats anything at all.

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## Kiwi Sapper

> Its a bit shortsighted and unfair for everyone to shit on farmlands and not support them now they are not selling ammo..............


I always understood that if a seller did not provide a service their customer's wanted, then the customer was justified in walking away.

Am I wrong?





> ............Lastly, Do you know that from the 24th of December the possesion of any gun part at all by an unlicenced person could cost them 5 years in prision or a 10K fine. Thats anything at all.


Have you forgotten the idiocies of NZ Customs when climbing aboard Constable Plod's wagon which was being pulled by the Show Pony and deeming that "parts" included slings, scopes, and other non essential parts? 

So could you please be a little more precise and define "parts" before spreading what appears to be "false news?" Further, by "define", I mean a link to the Statute /  regulation / order in council/ /whatever that defines "Parts", NOT a throw away line like " the local arms officer said" because that is meaningless.

Thank You.

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## tetawa

> Its a bit shortsighted and unfair for everyone to shit on farmlands and not support them now they are not selling ammo. The regulatory shit they have thrust on them is large. Would people still buy the ammo if the price increased say 40% to cover the implementation of all the storage and admin they will now have to deal with?
> 
> Its a simple business decision they made, however its more of the death by 1000 cuts we are getting.
> 
> Lastly, Do you know that from the 24th of December the possesion of any gun part at all by an unlicenced person could cost them 5 years in prision or a 10K fine. Thats anything at all.


This world isn't fair, thought their stores would have their ammo storage up to scratch. When storage of chemicals etc had to be upgraded, they didn't stop selling them. Maybe the profit margin on ammo is not as good as other farming requirements?

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## caberslash

> Lastly, Do you know that from the 24th of December the possesion of any gun part at all by an unlicenced person could cost them 5 years in prision or a 10K fine. Thats anything at all.


Holy shit that is a silly law.

Springs go in guns, so it is a part, so if someone owns a spring shop and it just so happens that some of those springs are the same dimensions, say as one for an AR buffer or a long recoil semi shotgun, they own gun parts.

If someone carves a 1:1 functional stock out of a block of wood, they have made a gun part?

Book burning bonfire when?

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## csmiffy

I always thought the license thing was mandatory? you had to have a license to buy it for years now. GC have been running the book thing for ammo for a while.
It would be nice if farmlands did the right thing, but i do get it. If they only have a couple of people with licenses, and they are off, does that mean they cant sell it and put up a sign for no sales today?
This sort of thing will stuff up my gun club, and probably all the other gun clubs around. in our case not so much as it isnt stored on site, but it is more paperwork to fill out.
only a small club though. A big NZCTA club would have a PITA with this.

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## Cigar

> This world isn't fair, thought their stores would have their ammo storage up to scratch. When storage of chemicals etc had to be upgraded, they didn't stop selling them. Maybe the profit margin on ammo is not as good as other farming requirements?


I expect that because the staff need to have a FAL, to get that FAL they require secure storage at home (like the rest of us). So who pays for that? If I was the staff member I would be asking the company to pay.

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## Percy Jones

> So could you please be a little more precise and define "parts" before spreading what appears to be "false news?" Further, by "define", I mean a link to the Statute /  regulation / order in council/ /whatever that defines "Parts", NOT a throw away line like " the local arms officer said" because that is meaningless.
> 
> Thank You.


This sufficient for you?

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## outlander

> I expect that because the staff need to have a FAL, to get that FAL they require secure storage at home (like the rest of us). So who pays for that? If I was the staff member I would be asking the company to pay.


Just a thought. If you had a FAL, but no gun, would you still be required to have secure storage?

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## Percy Jones

> Holy shit that is a silly law.
> 
> Springs go in guns, so it is a part, so if someone owns a spring shop and it just so happens that some of those springs are the same dimensions, say as one for an AR buffer or a long recoil semi shotgun, they own gun parts.
> 
> If someone carves a 1:1 functional stock out of a block of wood, they have made a gun part?
> 
> Book burning bonfire when?


You are correct is is an utterly stupid law to bring in, but then again its what you get when you implement complex law in a week.  The onus of proof will probably fall to the spring shop owner to prove its not a gun part, but its an easy one to disprove.

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## Percy Jones

> Just a thought. If you had a FAL, but no gun, would you still be required to have secure storage?


currently yes, because you could buy a gun at any time.

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## Kiwi Sapper

> This sufficient for you?


No.

I don't know how I can be any clearer in asking you to define a "part" of a fire arm, but I'll make one last attempt.

1...You have drawn our attention to an extract from a copy of something.  Whatever is the extracted copy from?

2...That copy uses the words "non prohibited part." Give us credit for understanding that if a part was  a "prohibited" part, then because they have been defined, there is an issue.

But what parts of a firearm are "non prohibited".

 I have already pointed out the earlier stupid use of classifying scopes and slings as part of a firearm and if the definition of a "non prohibited part" is to be considered as "it is not named as a prohibited part" , we are right back to where we were with the earlier lunacy.

To make something illegal, the obvious first step is to identify it. Nowhere do I see any such identification, but, as you saw cause to  create a post on this matter, could you please either

3  list ;the "non prohibited parts" of a fire arm;
 or 
4...provide a link to a list of "non prohibited parts". 

This would assist our members and we would be most grateful and I for one, would not accept Constable Plod making a decision on what is a "non prohibited part " whenever the mood or situation may happen to suit him. 

Thank You.

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## outlander

> currently yes, because you could buy a gun at any time.


 True, but wouldn't that be the time to acquire secure storage? Hypothetically, you could have the firearm within your control 24/7 and not need secure storage at all. The question becomes relevant once again, when the inspector person interviews and checks on storage for said non existent firearm. Perhaps then, one is required by law to own a firearm once the license is issued, which in turn, makes the secure storage necessary, but not if it's under your immediate care.

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## Nugget connaisseur

> So if you belong to a club that buys in bulk to pass the savings  on to its members your committee just got a shit more work to do


A club is not a business. So I wonder if they have to comply. Depends on the legal wording and if they are selling at cost or for profit to go back to the club.

Also not many clubs be willing to be test subject in court I bet.

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## Marty Henry

Apart from anything else there is another element to consider. I have always brought falcon and or fiocchi ammunition for duck shooting and vI club and Olympic for clay target. 
All are made in nz by target products, and their main national distributor were farmlands. Now they will be left with small independent sports goods retailers  increasing the amount of work to make multiple small sales, so it is possible that those brands will dissapear.
I rang 3 h n f stores about fiocchi no they don't stock it but have other brands they want to sell. Pretty sure the same will apply to gun city,
Hnf and gun city are what farmlands calls brand partners and are promising that good deals for card holders after ammunition and hunting supplies  will be announced shortly

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## Marty Henry

> A club is not a business. So I wonder if they have to comply. Depends on the legal wording and if they are selling at cost or for profit to go back to the club.
> 
> Also not many clubs be willing to be test subject in court I bet.


NZCTA has just put out a newsletter regarding range officers and range certification
which appears to show that they are well advanced on both fronts. Including the suggestion that their range safety template be applied nationally.
I expect there will be an update re clubs but many already record fal with purchase so it might not mean much extra effort. How they go about purchasing in bulk will need some thinking possibly someone will have to  nominated and their license used.
Then when plod sees Marty Henry brought 20,000 rounds last year they might come visiting sirens flashing.

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## Danger Mouse

> Its a bit shortsighted and unfair for everyone to shit on farmlands and not support them now they are not selling ammo. The regulatory shit they have thrust on them is large. Would people still buy the ammo if the price increased say 40% to cover the implementation of all the storage and admin they will now have to deal with?
> 
> Its a simple business decision they made, however its more of the death by 1000 cuts we are getting.
> 
> Lastly, Do you know that from the 24th of December the possesion of any gun part at all by an unlicenced person could cost them 5 years in prision or a 10K fine. Thats anything at all.


Can you post a link or source regarding the 24th? I'd like to read it.

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## NZShoota

> Apart from anything else there is another element to consider. I have always brought falcon and or fiocchi ammunition for duck shooting and vI club and Olympic for clay target. 
> All are made in nz by target products, and their main national distributor were farmlands. Now they will be left with small independent sports goods retailers  increasing the amount of work to make multiple small sales, so it is possible that those brands will dissapear.
> I rang 3 h n f stores about fiocchi no they don't stock it but have other brands they want to sell. Pretty sure the same will apply to gun city,
> Hnf and gun city are what farmlands calls brand partners and are promising that good deals for card holders after ammunition and hunting supplies  will be announced shortly


Gun City are no longer brand partners. They dropped out earlier this year.

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## Beavis

Can hardly blame them. If you aren't a gun shop that's an awful lot of extra fucking around and liability.

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## Percy Jones

> No.
> 
> I don't know how I can be any clearer in asking you to define a "part" of a fire arm, but I'll make one last attempt.
> 
> 1...You have drawn our attention to an extract from a copy of something.  Whatever is the extracted copy from?
> 
> 2...That copy uses the words "non prohibited part." Give us credit for understanding that if a part was  a "prohibited" part, then because they have been defined, there is an issue.
> 
> But what parts of a firearm are "non prohibited".
> ...


Where have you been living for the past 6 months, as you seem unaware of the new laws that have been written and will be implemented into legislation 6 months from date of signing. The best bit is police also cant quantify what a prohibited or non prohibited part is. So we just have to wait till some poor sap get pinged for possesing something untill it is clarified. My guess is a non prohibited part is a non MSSA part.  As for links, well you can look at the legislation on the govt website, I dont need to bother posting links. Perhaps on the 24th police will define exactly what parts are referred to. Did you know that after the 24th, possesion of ammo by a non licence holder is also good for jail time, and to put the icing on the cake, possesion is deemed to be in the same location as the ammo (for a non LFO person) eg house sitting for an LFO and there is some ammo stached in a drawer.

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## Percy Jones

> Can you post a link or source regarding the 24th? I'd like to read it.


Read the legislation on the govt website. I think its also on the police website.

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## Ben Waimata

Dropped into Farmlands Hastings and Napier looking for ammo today, no 22lr supersonic at all, but I grabbed a slab (250rds) of 12g winchester super X 4 shot for $150.

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## northdude

More like a wet bus ticket

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## mikee

> Where have you been living for the past 6 months, as you seem unaware of the new laws that have been written and will be implemented into legislation 6 months from date of signing. The best bit is police also cant quantify what a prohibited or non prohibited part is. So we just have to wait till some poor sap get pinged for possesing something untill it is clarified. My guess is a non prohibited part is a non MSSA part.  As for links, well you can look at the legislation on the govt website, I dont need to bother posting links. Perhaps on the 24th police will define exactly what parts are referred to. Did you know that after the 24th, possesion of ammo by a non licence holder is also good for jail time, and to put the icing on the cake, possesion is deemed to be in the same location as the ammo (for a non LFO person) eg house sitting for an LFO and there is some ammo stached in a drawer.


Great except MSSA's such as they were no longer exist in law. Really what it is is the Po Po mking shit up ("policy") om the hoof,  as they go and then it effectively being rubber stamped by the pony's mob and we who are actually effected left to try and figure out wht we have to do to keep ourselves on the right side of the rules. Its all getting a bit hard and eventually most will give it away for that reason.........................which I believe is the ultimate end game anyway.

I mean if you look in my truck I am sure if you looked hard enough you could find a live round or 2 rolling around in the dash or under the seats and that would mean my wife could effectively be in possetion of ammo as a non licence holder WTF

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## Kiwi Sapper

> Where have you been living for the past 6 months, ..........


Had you been contributing to this site "for the past 6 months,"  then you would know.

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## Percy Jones

> I mean if you look in my truck I am sure if you looked hard enough you could find a live round or 2 rolling around in the dash or under the seats and that would mean my wife could effectively be in possetion of ammo as a non licence holder WTF


Yes you are correct, and that is the danger we face after the 24th.

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## The bomb

Got Winchester .22 subs for $8 a packet from them this morning.

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## XR500

> This world isn't fair, thought their stores would have their ammo storage up to scratch. When storage of chemicals etc had to be upgraded, they didn't stop selling them. Maybe the profit margin on ammo is not as good as other farming requirements?


Its not just their store having to be up to scratch. each store needed to have three firearms licence holders, and each had to have a compliant safe in their home, even if they owned no firearms. So its as you would expect from the powers that not be, death by a thousand cuts is their modus operandi.

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## Woody

Are Horsewhips legal?

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## Danger Mouse

> Read the legislation on the govt website. I think its also on the police website.


Yeah ok, I'm not gonna take you seriously now. You wont post a link (not only have I read the legislation, I made submissions on it) 

Mikees  post describes why I wont take you seriously.  Too bad, could have been an interesting conversation

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## JaSa

> Hnf and gun city are what farmlands calls brand partners and are promising that good deals for card holders after ammunition and hunting supplies  will be announced shortly


No discounts / deals on ammo and firearms for brand partners - you can't even use Farmlands vouchers to purchase them! Apparently not enough margin in it to give permanent discounts. Other hunting supplies is a different story.

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## Percy Jones

> Yeah ok, I'm not gonna take you seriously now. You wont post a link (not only have I read the legislation, I made submissions on it) 
> 
> Mikees  post describes why I wont take you seriously.  Too bad, could have been an interesting conversation


So you are too lazy to search the govt and police websites to check what i am telling you, (even after i posted a snip from the regulations), and since i didnt post a link to the snip i posted, therefore what i am saying must be incorrect. Words fail me.

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## Kiwi Sapper

> Are Horsewhips legal?


 @Woody Having been a Pony Club Instructor, a Rider to Hounds and a Senior Show Jumping judge for many years,  I can authoritatively tell you, yes.
HOWEVER, (there is always a however,) conditions apply as to the type and, dare I say it, method and location of their application.

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## tetawa

> Its not just their store having to be up to scratch. each store needed to have three firearms licence holders, and each had to have a compliant safe in their home, even if they owned no firearms. So its as you would expect from the powers that not be, death by a thousand cuts is their modus operandi.


Well if that's the case I see the end of ammo etc in stores who only have a small section handling it, local appliance store is in that situation.

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## StrikerNZ

Back on topic - popped in to local Farmlands  this morning to grab a few boxes of 223. Fiocchi USA 55sp 50-packs at 78c/round at the clearance prices. Hard to beat that anywhere else..

Shelves were emptying pretty quick, so dont waste time if youre after anything.

Still had a bit of 222, 308, 7-08, 22mag, 22, plenty of shotgun, various other stuff..

Staffer agreed with my comment of strangulation by red tape and described the situation as ridiculous.

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## Ryan_Songhurst

I was pleasantly surprised when we moved down here to discover you can buy ammunition at the wee local Postshop but even he's knocking it on the head soon as he did it pretty much as a favour to locals and being the closest shop to the blue mountains blocks.

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## Finnwolf

> Its not just their store having to be up to scratch. each store needed to have three firearms licence holders, and each had to have a compliant safe in their home, even if they owned no firearms. So its as you would expect from the powers that not be, death by a thousand cuts is their modus operandi.


WHO made up that rule that they have to have a compliant safe at their home? - and why??

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## Maca49

> The link didn't copy I should have checked. It gets worse
> Ammunition
> New provisions relating to the sales, purchase and possession of ammunition become effective in December 2020.
> 
> Ammunition Possession
> Ammunition Sellers
> 
> 
> From December 2020 any person who is managing a business that includes the sale or supply of ammunition and who is not the holder of a dealers licence needs to be recognised by Police as an ammunition seller.
> ...


Records to be kept for 10 yrs? Thats worse than the IRD, and manually FFS, everything else is on the cloud!!

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## MAC

Just popped down to local Farmlands store picked some ammo ..
Going fast at a good price

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## Kiwi Sapper

Farmlands WANGANUI

No stock as they say they have never sold ammunition.

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## NZShoota

My two local Farmlands branches have never had much of a selection of ammo, usually just some .22lr (which has been out of stock for months), a bit of 12g turns up in April and a couple of packets of Winchester 7mm08.

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## bigbear

OK i was in gisborne farmlands today and there was still  a bit of 7mm08,308,270,243,a few 22-250 and 223. Also shotgun ammo.

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## buzzman

Farmland taihape has got about 10 tubs of 2208 if anyone keen cheers


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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## Finnwolf

> Farmland taihape has got about 10 tubs of 2208 if anyone keen cheers
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



2208???

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## buzzman

> 2208???


Adi powder


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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## Kiwi Sapper

> 2208???


Eight minutes past 10 pm.........NEXT please.

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## Sideshow

So lady's and gentlemen!

There you have it! This governments commitment to our environment and pedator free NZ.

Let me cross off the environment thing first!

An extra trip for farmers in there wagons to there nearest gun store to pick up ammo. Where as before they could have covered that in a trip to Farmlands. Nice one, more pollution!

So we all know that time is what most of us don`t have and that extra trip will get knocked off of the list simple as that.

Them predators ain't going to just up and shoot them selves. Trapping takes a lot of time......Dick move gov and police dick move!


As a knock on effect we will now have bulk buy of ammo. Not so bad...but wait!

The next time there is some round up of a low life drug nob with a little more ammo than usual. You will see the press saying HEY whys he go so much.......

Yep that will be the next move cutting down to only what you can justify.....(they do this here for rifle ammo in the UK) But it will be worse for you in NZ because shotguns are not a right.

So you will get this across all ammo.


Knock on hey Framers land owners why are you not controlling your pests? We better come in and take care of that for you.....OH by the way here's the bill!

Good gov

And good one any twat who voted for this lot you poor ignorant fools!

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## bigbear

I cant agree cause half the the time you go to farmlands they haven't got shit in stock so you have to order it in and make another trip in to town.

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## NZShoota

> I cant agree cause half the the time you go to farmlands they haven't got shit in stock so you have to order it in and make another trip in to town.


So its not just my local store then.  :Pissed Off:

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## XR500

And Central North Island too. Used to be fine a decade ago,,. but have slowly gone downhill. Try to order fert or seed is an absolute nightmare. Fert and seed merchants won't let you order direct "go through farmlands". Try that and orders get stuffed up.  it takes them half a dozen more calls to intermediates to get the job done.  Far far more difficult than it needs to be. :Omg:

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## 7mmwsm

> So lady's and gentlemen!
> 
> There you have it! This governments commitment to our environment and pedator free NZ.
> 
> Let me cross off the environment thing first!
> 
> An extra trip for farmers in there wagons to there nearest gun store to pick up ammo. Where as before they could have covered that in a trip to Farmlands. Nice one, more pollution!
> 
> So we all know that time is what most of us don`t have and that extra trip will get knocked off of the list simple as that.
> ...


Don't stress about this extra time factor. It's something we all have plenty of apparently. 
We have just been told all our rural roads (nationwide) without a median barrier are to be reduced to 80 km an hour. Side roads to 60km. 
"It will only add a few minutes to our journey" is the spiel from our council muppets who are pushing this(in fairness to them though, it has been passed by parliament and councils have been told to "sell" the policy). 
What I want to know is who is providing all these few extra minutes?
Travel costs on every service we get from town have just gone up by twenty percent.
Another law/policy passed without consultation because they changed the rules to enable them to do it.
Bit off original topic sorry but all sort of related.

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## Dundee

Should do me for a while.

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## Kiwi Sapper

@Sideshow      One of your paragraphs caused me to seek further information

Yep that will be the next move cutting down to only what you can justify.....(they do this here for rifle ammo in the UK) But it will be worse for you in NZ because shotguns are not a right.

What are the "limits" and how are they justified? A link will be fine if it is a lengthy matter.

What is the reasoning to exclude shotguns from those limitations" Again, a link will be fine if it is a lengthy matter.

Finally, whatever do you mean when you say "in NZ shotguns are not a right"?  i ask 'cos no firearms of any sort are a "right" here in Middle Earth.

Thank You

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## Sideshow

@Kiwi Sapper what I was talking about is that in the UK there is no limit on shotgun ammo. Having a shotgun certificate in the uk is a right. Was the same in NZ untill just recently when they passed a law to change this. Why else would they put it into law? Answer becasue if it had gone to court they would have lost.

The further information that you are asking for is my comparsion between the NZ firearms system and the UK one. I can see that this will come next to NZ a limit on the ammount of ammo that you may hold. It will come with the register. In the UK we have to write this on the back of our firearms ticket. (Mines quite full :Wink: ).

Its late here but Ill try to dig you up some links on UK tickets and how they work.

You will have to bear in mind that here a shotgun cert and a firearm cer are two different things, alos each cheif constable of each constabulary makes there own interpretation of the home office rulings. 
So here in Berkshire they have slightly different ways of going about it than over the boarder in Wiltshire.
The only thing that is the same is its a mess just like NZ.

pm me if you want further info :Have A Nice Day:

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## tetawa

> Don't stress about this extra time factor. It's something we all have plenty of apparently. 
> We have just been told all our rural roads (nationwide) without a median barrier are to be reduced to 80 km an hour. Side roads to 60km. 
> "It will only add a few minutes to our journey" is the spiel from our council muppets who are pushing this(in fairness to them though, it has been passed by parliament and councils have been told to "sell" the policy). 
> What I want to know is who is providing all these few extra minutes?
> Travel costs on every service we get from town have just gone up by twenty percent.
> Another law/policy passed without consultation because they changed the rules to enable them to do it.
> Bit off original topic sorry but all sort of related.


When the speed limits are reduced rural, there will be large amounts of revenue available to be collected, they may spy a burglar while targeting the rural "speedster"

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## outlander

> When the speed limits are reduced rural, there will be large amounts of revenue available to be collected, they may spy a burglar while targeting the rural "speedster"


That's not to say that the burglar will be apprehended though, unless he's speeding of course.

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## XR500

Remember that most burglers wear raincoats these days...so they don't get too wet from the slap with a wet bus ticket they receive when caught :Wtfsmilie:

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## 7.62

> Had great hopes for Farmlands when I became a shareholder 10 or more years ago. Overall, they have lost the plot though, probably around the time of amalgamation. 
> 
> A farm supply outfit not selling ammo, sheez.
> 
> FarmSource is my go to supplier nowadays, despite me not being a Fonterra fan.


Agree with the comment RE Farmlands losing the plot. They posted a net profit before tax of $7 million but that was with an $8.8 million Covid wage subsidy (while continuing to operate and sell supplies to their customers during lockdown. Farm Source didnt take the subsidy...), and were provided with significant rent relief from their landlords. They wouldve posted a big loss without that support. Their obsession with market share at the expense of margin has caused a self perpetuated financial reaming. Sucks that they are moving away from stocking ammo but no skin off my nose, Ill happily give my cash to another NZ owned cooperative (Farm Source)

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## Micky Duck

> Great except MSSA's such as they were no longer exist in law. Really what it is is the Po Po mking shit up ("policy") om the hoof,  as they go and then it effectively being rubber stamped by the pony's mob and we who are actually effected left to try and figure out wht we have to do to keep ourselves on the right side of the rules. Its all getting a bit hard and eventually most will give it away for that reason.........................which I believe is the ultimate end game anyway.
> 
> I mean if you look in my truck I am sure if you looked hard enough you could find a live round or 2 rolling around in the dash or under the seats and that would mean my wife could effectively be in possetion of ammo as a non licence holder WTF


yes she can be...it has been this way for quite some time....Ive always said if I was to vist someone in prison I would have to get local copper to search my car first as there is bound to be a few rounds floating around and definately a knife or three.

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## Manchester

> Can hardly blame them. If you aren't a gun shop that's an awful lot of extra fucking around and liability.


Have to agree with this one. I'm based in Taranaki and spend a fair bit of time in the Hawkes Bay. Only the Bell Block farmlands had any significant range of ammunition. The others had a couple of pack of 22, maybe 223, 303 & 308. The amount if shotgun ammo depended on how close duck shooting was.

They didn't have enough to make it worth going in there to look for ammo. Not their core business or interest. 

Bell Block only has a decent range of ammo because one of their staff is ex H&F. It's his interest.

If we had all bought more ammo from farmlands,  maybe they would have kept selling it.

But it was never their main business, and it's become too much work and too expensive for them

Another one bites the dust. A great example of changing ammunition available bymaking things expensive rather than illegal. easier to get under the radar

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## Tahr

Im pretty happy with Farmlands. Been a member since '75. Recently got a good discount off a Ford Ranger - over and above trade or fleet discount.

I watch their specials and pick up some good deals on stuff I need (and don't need). 

And Ive always wondered why they bothered with ammo given the hassle for a small turn over.

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## Micky Duck

so....if you unemployed or finding current job not quite cutting the mustard you COULD go to farmlands/wrightsons/ITM and say you have FAL and would love to work for them......it might be the little bit extra that gets you the job.

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## 7mmwsm

I think it's a bit harsh blasting farmlands for making a financial decision. They are getting screwed by legislation changes just like us.

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## nickbop

We gave in our farmlands account recently, their service was turning to shit, they didn’t want to order stuff in and when they did they either ordered the wrong thing or it was faster to drive to another area yourself and pick it up, I heard great they took over CRT’s systems after they went under/bought out? They really only seemed to care about lifestyle blocks and horses, gone to another supplier now

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## XR500

Tend to agree with nickbop.  Ammo is the least of Farmlands issues. They have gone downhill since  CRT bought them out. Processes have become far more convoluted, many more middlemen clipping the ticket. May well go elsewhere .

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## 7mmwsm

Leave your options open guys, the way the world is your present day heros may turn in to dickheads next week. It's happened before.

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## LMcNab

> so....if you unemployed or finding current job not quite cutting the mustard you COULD go to farmlands/wrightsons/ITM and say you have FAL and would love to work for them......it might be the little bit extra that gets you the job.


Except they just laid off a heap of people "to economize costs"

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## Ben Waimata

> Tend to agree with nickbop.  Ammo is the least of Farmlands issues. They have gone downhill since  CRT bought them out. Processes have become far more convoluted, many more middlemen clipping the ticket. May well go elsewhere .


Farmlands staff moral seems to be at an all time low too. We've been members so long we've got a 3 digit member number starting with a '2'. It's not the same co-operative structure it was when it started, and sometimes we find ourselves going across the road to PGG for better prices. I ordered 200 cyanide pellets through farmlands last week and 10,000 arrived, this is the kind of stupid stuff up that is happening all the time. I suspect Farmlands may be on the way out.

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## 7mmwsm

> Farmlands staff moral seems to be at an all time low too. We've been members so long we've got a 3 digit member number starting with a '2'. It's not the same co-operative structure it was when it started, and sometimes we find ourselves going across the road to PGG for better prices. I ordered 200 cyanide pellets through farmlands last week and 10,000 arrived, this is the kind of stupid stuff up that is happening all the time. I suspect Farmlands may be on the way out.


I hope you are wrong about Farmlands being on the way out. Wrighties did a dirty on us back in the nineties and the only way they will ever get my business is if they are the only option.

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## BRADS

> I hope you are wrong about Farmlands being on the way out. Wrighties did a dirty on us back in the nineties and the only way they will ever get my business is if they are the only option.


That's a common occurrence there mate.
Our local farmlands has also taken a turn in the last few years to be fair.
Seems a bit like walking into a h&f store 10 people behind the counter and no one wants to serve ya.

Sent from my SM-G986B using Tapatalk

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## zimmer

Hardly use Farmlands now. Local RD1, sorry, FarmSource prices are comparable plus they are 10 minutes away versus 35 minutes drive for Farmlands.
Noticeable for some time and given I don't use them much but each visit to Farmlands sees mostly new faces behind the counter. My FarmSource has had the same core of staff for years.

Their nice things like discounted phone bills are well gone although Spark stopped that.

One thing that has always annoyed me with my Farmlands is we have to load (overload?) our animal feed on to a trolley, checkout at the counter, take out to our vehicle, unload. FarmSource is drive thru and usually with staff assistance for loading.

Just wish FarmSource would stock Hansen fittings instead of the poxy brand they sell.

May be time to cash in my FL shares...

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## XR500

If its as we suspect, I doubt you would be able to cash them in just at the mo.... :Wtfsmilie:

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## zimmer

> If its as we suspect, I doubt you would be able to cash them in just at the mo....


Fark

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## Manchester

Farmlands seems to be going the way of all the previous stock and station agents. Too many have done their dash and amalgamated with the competition.

But it hasn't made the surviving operators stronger.

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## rockland

Over the Hill for a shopping trip today, called in at Farmlands Motueka & Richmond.  Grabbed a box of .25/06  2 boxes .357 magnum and a slab of Falcon SP40 number 3's.
Still good deals on 12 ga. lead and steel at Richmond site.  Rifle ammo has been well picked over... a staff member was surprised how many locals had bowled in last week and taken advantage of the prices (forum members I'm looking at you guys...)
Both stores said the new Red Tape has made it nonviable for them to continue supplying ammunition.

Visited the big new Gun City store right next to KMart in Richmond which cheered me up immensely.

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## charliehorse

Called into Farmlands Matamata yesterday and they had 2 boxes of 308, 2 boxes of 243 and about 5 boxes of 12g. All the rest goooone

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## bluebaiter222

Interesting to pick up on the Nth Island perspective of 'Farmlands has gone to shyte ever since got on board with CRT.'  Well I can only tell ya from the Mainland, that we reckon it  soon turned to poo since CRT cobbled up with Farmlands.The trajectory has been very steep downhill from then.Bring back the good ol days.Sounds like I,m not the only shareholder irrespective of Island getting ready to tell them to jam it

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## Kiwi Sapper

From my somewhat biased observation of companies performance and my many redundancies. I am firmly convinced that once the Bean Counters, ( the Suits)  get control of any business, then as they know the cost of everything but not the value of anything, it is downhill from then on.

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## tetawa

Can remember many years ago when a major firearms wholesaler had been taken over by an accountancy firm. They had zero .223 ammo in stock at a time when the demand was great for aerial shooting, the head "bean counter" told their rep " tell them to use 243, 270 or whatever we have in stock, not ordering 223 until the other calibers are all gone." By the time it was re-ordered the demand was gone.

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