# Outdoors > Gear and Equipment >  Hands up who else hates ITAR??

## Proneshooter

International Traffic In Arms Regulations.

Of course there are totally sound reasons to stop crate-loads of AKs ending up in terrorist hands but this???

ATI Universal Featherweight Bipod 9" to 13" Matte Black

Its a plastic bipod guys! seriously???

Scott from the rifle scope store (where I just bought a Nikon Prostaff 4-14 x 40) said that the products they have which have ITAR restrictions tend to be the latest gen night vision... and I can sort of understand that too but a plastic bipod???

sigh

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## gimp

Buy from somewhere else other than CTD and you might get it. A lot of places just don't ship regardless or don't have the right paperwork or don't understand these so just say everything is ITAR to be safe. Also it's probably Bad.

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## mikee

It is what it is, you just learn to live with it. Won't change for little old us

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## res

It sure is frustrating at times

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## Pointer

Is ITAR like an Himalayan IGOAT? Something Apple has recently released?

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## Spook

> Is ITAR like an Himalayan IGOAT? Something Apple has recently released?


Dunno, but if they are keeping plastic bipods out of the country, then they get the thumbs-up from me...seriously, plastic bipods...sheesh

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## Proneshooter

> Dunno, but if they are keeping plastic bipods out of the country, then they get the thumbs-up from me...seriously, plastic bipods...sheesh


Well yeah... I wasn't sold on it just liked how light it was for being on a hunting rifle... I think I'll just stick with a non-swivel Harris clone  :Have A Nice Day:   cant go wrong

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## Spook

All good mate...just taking the piss

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## Beavis

Alot of places pull the ITAR card when they don't know any better and don't want to risk the wrath of the federal govt

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## cambo

The NZ ATI agent sells them on Trade Me from time to time.  http://www.trademe.co.nz/Members/Pro...member=3356285
I got 1 of mine from Gunshed a while ago. The other came from Brownells.
UNIVERSAL FEATHERWEIGHT BIPOD | Brownells

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## cambo

Cheaper Than Dirt doesn't do international shipping at all.
Tried them - no go at all for anything.
They won't even send to a Freight Forwarding company as well.

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## Proudkiwi

> I think I'll just stick with a non-swivel Harris clone   cant go wrong


Ahhhh, wanna bet?

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## gadgetman

Those plastic ATI bipods are actually quite good. I'd only use one for rimfire though.

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## cambo

I got 1 mainly for the kids 22, but I use it more on my AR now.  Great bit of kit.

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## Proneshooter

I learnt long ago that just 'cause something has a "name" on it does NOT mean it will always be better than something without a "name" and the reality is most "name" stuff comes out of china nowadays... its the only way they can stay competitive in todays market... often the no name stuff has just come out the back door of the same place making the name stuff... but for less.

You only have to peruse youtube to see any number of videos detailing how some expensive "name" item had a major fail.

well thats my take on things and I do work for a company that manufactures in China... which is not to say I know it all, this is just what I have concluded myself

cheers
Tracy

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## Proudkiwi

> I learnt long ago that just 'cause something has a "name" on it does NOT mean it will always be better than something without a "name" and the reality is most "name" stuff comes out of china nowadays... its the only way they can stay competitive in todays market... often the no name stuff has just come out the back door of the same place making the name stuff... but for less.
> 
> You only have to peruse youtube to see any number of videos detailing how some expensive "name" item had a major fail.
> 
> well thats my take on things and I do work for a company that manufactures in China... which is not to say I know it all, this is just what I have concluded myself
> 
> cheers
> Tracy


If it helps you to sleep at night mate, keep telling yourself that......  :Have A Nice Day:

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## gadgetman

> I learnt long ago that just 'cause something has a "name" on it does NOT mean it will always be better than something without a "name" and the reality is most "name" stuff comes out of china nowadays... its the only way they can stay competitive in todays market... often the no name stuff has just come out the back door of the same place making the name stuff... but for less.
> 
> You only have to peruse youtube to see any number of videos detailing how some expensive "name" item had a major fail.
> 
> well thats my take on things and I do work for a company that manufactures in China... which is not to say I know it all, this is just what I have concluded myself
> 
> cheers
> Tracy


You are on the money there. The only thing you have to watch is that some other no-name co in the next town will be making an inferior copy. Picking the difference from a photo on the web can be a problem.

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## Southern Man

The most Hilaryous part of it all is that the World's greatest debtor nation ever is blocking the export of items people in other countries can lawfully import and freely buy. Guess they want to go spectacularly broke!

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## stumpy

so I tried to order a range bag from Midway usa , ... itar blocked ...... but lookee here

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## Proneshooter

Yeah, US paranoia truly knows NO bounds!!.  

It seems to me that america's main threats come from a) the USA..ie internal terrorists    b) dusty third-world locations... neither of which are particularly affected by Mr. ITAR!






> The most Hilaryous part of it all is that the World's greatest debtor nation ever is blocking the export of items people in other countries can lawfully import and freely buy. Guess they want to go spectacularly broke!

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## Proneshooter

ok, I'll ask... so where did you get it from??




> so I tried to order a range bag from Midway usa , ... itar blocked ...... but lookee here 
> Attachment 24467

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## Neckshot

> If it helps you to sleep at night mate, keep telling yourself that......


Fuckin trolling again arnt you.so when someone like Norway uses Buffalo river what dose that say????
Or uses Lyman raloading scales? ??? Your a troll who needs to pull his head in 

Sent from my HUAWEI Y210-0100 using Tapatalk 2

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## Proudkiwi

> Fuckin trolling again arnt you.so when someone like Norway uses Buffalo river what dose that say????
> Or uses Lyman raloading scales? ??? Your a troll who needs to pull his head in 
> 
> Sent from my HUAWEI Y210-0100 using Tapatalk 2


Neckshot - your post is so full of wrong.

Examples:

The word 'fucking' has a g at the end of it. Correct punctuation states that a capital letter follows a full stop. Dose in the context you used it in is spelt 'does'. There is no such word as 'raloading'. You used 'your' incorrectly. It should be 'you're' as in 'you are an idiot'. Again, correct punctuation states that a sentence needs a full stop at the end.

As for my post, no I am not trolling. I learnt a long time ago there is no shortcuts when it comes to quality. In short, if you want to play you have to pay.

People that try to talk themselves into believing that a knock off from where ever or a plastic thingy from Tim-buck-too are going to be as good as the product they ripped off design wise and then produced in shitty materials are just deceiving themselves.

My time is too valuable to me to be let down buy some second rate piece of shit product from some second rate piece of shit website just cause I scored it "cheap as bro"

Also, I put a smiley at the end of my original post. So chill the fuck out!

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## Neckshot

Your a Fuckin troll so keep dreaming otherwise if your time was valuable you wouldn't have written a novel 

Sent from my HUAWEI Y210-0100 using Tapatalk 2

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## gimp

> Your a Fuckin troll so keep dreaming otherwise if your time was valuable you wouldn't have written a novel 
> 
> Sent from my HUAWEI Y210-0100 using Tapatalk 2


lol chill out bro

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## scottrods

got a few things being held up by ITAR. My company Has ITAR certification and I still can't get stuff through. I got my scope stopped last year, even with a copy of email from Swaro saying it wasn't subjected to ITAR regs didn't help. So I brought it back in my luggage regardless.

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## Proudkiwi

Additionally, as with everything there are ways around ITAR.

As long as you are not being an idiot and trying to get stupid shit in then re-shippers will send you whatever you want. Not that I would want any of the stuff that Proneshooter is looking at, but if I did it would take about 5 clicks on a mouse then about 5 days transit before I had it in my hand.

Just saying......

Also, Proneshooter, I assure you I am not deliberately trying to wind you up or knock you. I thought I would mention that, in the extremely unlikely situation that there was one single other person as retarded as neckshot on the forum. Long shot I know, but better to be safe than sorry  :Have A Nice Day: 

If you want more info about re-shippers and who I use, feel free to PM me.

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## stumpy

who , this post went south all of a sudden ..... as to my range bag , i got it sent to an american friend , who then onsent it from his home .... midway will not send to the u-shop (nz post) address in the states and they reconise it as a frieght forwarding company that will send items internationally , . , so to bypass the dumb (for a range bag anyway) rules , it works easily . 
cheers ...

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## ChrisF

The level to which ITAR has been aplied is so overboard its not funny , I donot think that was the real intention , but thats what pencil pushers do .

Some of you guys have a idea as to how truelly INSANE it is , some donot.

Amagine this , a Canadian company scared shitless about sending me thier product , WHY , because the little torq screws used in the item , Came from the USA , just donot try to aply logical or reason , as these are now outlawed in the USA .

Later  Chris

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## Proneshooter

Good grief!  Then again we ARE talking about the USA...the most letigous nation...in the world!  





> The level to which ITAR has been aplied is so overboard its not funny , I donot think that was the real intention , but thats what pencil pushers do .
> 
> Some of you guys have a idea as to how truelly INSANE it is , some donot.
> 
> Amagine this , a Canadian company scared shitless about sending me thier product , WHY , because the little torq screws used in the item , Came from the USA , just donot try to aply logical or reason , as these are now outlawed in the USA .
> 
> Later  Chris

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## Dead is better

Cabellas sent to my youshop address - I just had to send them a bank statement with my verified address plus their relevant info written at the bottom (my cabella's login code). It took a few days extra than a straight buy off ebay but whatever.

Funny thing was that I bought a shop model autopriming tool - which arrived with several primers up one of the tubes!

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## ChrisF

Sorry Guys ,

Just be careful about trying to get to clever about going around the ITAR us BS , as people both in the USA and here in NZ have been visited by the men in black , things you could DO a few years ago , and get away with , you will not get away with now .

Up to you if you want to get your mate/relative in the US in trouble .

Dosnt matter that IT is crazy or not , as they are like children , unable to apply logic to problems .

Later  Chris

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## stumpy

i will look deeper into it , but i thought the itar rules prevented shops, dealers etc , from sending overseas.... does it also include its private citizens?

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## Koshogi

Yes,  it is an offense for anyone to export an ITAR controlled item without the required paperwork. 

Sent from my GT-I8190N using Tapatalk

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## Proneshooter

..and if we were just talking about .50cal Barretts and such then sure fine...

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## stumpy

as pointed out by koshogi , above .... 
here is it in very plain English 
"For practical purposes, ITAR regulations dictate that information and material pertaining to defense and military related technologies (for items listed on the U.S. Munitions List) may only be shared with U.S. Persons unless authorization from the Department of State is received or a special exemption is used.[3] U.S. Persons (including organizations) can face heavy fines if they have, without authorization or the use of an exemption, provided foreign (non-US) persons with access to ITAR-protected defense articles, services or technical data"

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## Dead is better

Category XII-Fire Control, Range Finder, Optical and Guidance and Control Equipment

    *(b) Lasers specifically designed, modified or configured for military application including those used in military communication devices, target designators and range finders, target detection systems, and directed energy weapons. 

The LRF I want is red, has no ballistic software and is only 4x. I really hope the classifiers aren't muppets 'cause there is no way any army would want these trupulse 200L rangefinders. They're freaking RED

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