# Firearms and Shooting > Reloading and Ballistics >  Short Action CheyTac Mag

## L.R

Myself and Abe have been playing around with ultimate short action calibers.  This is what we have come up with.  It's a shortened and improved cheytac case and will be in 6.5,7 30 and 338. The hard part was finding a suitable action that had a big enough Tennon and strong enough locking lugs without being to heavy, but that is now all sorted. We are still yet to fire a round. Anyway here is a pic of the 6.5 version next to a 6.5saum.

----------


## kiwijames

Looks like a before and after ad for Jenny Craig

----------


## von tempsky fan

Barrel life expectancy? fuck all!

----------


## Looseunit

Dare I ask Velocities and pressures?  :Grin:

----------


## L.R

Secret.

----------


## Terminator

Shorting the Cheytac case that much will cause all kinds of problems with very thick brass in the shoulders and body  :Wink:

----------


## L.R

It has been thinned down to allow it to be formed.

----------


## Terminator

Also how many steps does it take to make the brass??  
I've had some experience with shortening a Rigby case and necking it to 7mm, its not much fun :XD:

----------


## Toby

Looks cool, hope it all works out well.

----------


## R93

> It has been thinned down to allow it to be formed.


How has the brass been thinned down?

----------


## L.R

Turned down on a lathe.

----------


## kimjon

I like it! Very similar to Duley's ''Fatso'' and ''Fatmax'' type catridges...but yours looks a bit more overbore again. Will be keen to hear what velocities you end up getting?

kj

----------


## L.R

There is no denying its overbore however the 338 version will not be. Should perform like a 338 lapua imp at a guess.

----------


## Cyclist

Awesome ANOTHER pointless chambering  :Wink: 

I'll take the extra 1.5 inches of action and (semi) off the shelf components thanks...

Fun project I suppose

----------


## L.R

Really pointless?  What other chambering will drive a 300gr 338 bullet around 3000fps in a short action?

----------


## kimjon

Looks like a cool project to me, I like the idea of short action (with a hunting rifle build in mind). Hey worst case scenario it ends up in a long action with room to seat the projectiles right out?

Keep up the posts as I'd love to see the outcomes of what you're doing?

kj

----------


## 199p

Thats a fucking good looking round. 
Defiantly keen on results when you start shooting it.

----------


## veitnamcam

So what action did you settle on?
Gonna be mag fed?
What sort of all up rifle weight are you lookin at?

Sent from my GT-S5360T using Tapatalk 2

----------


## von tempsky fan

Seems like a lot of effort for a small weight saving in action weight , all the bullshit involved with case prep etc. Go factory caliber and get better resale and it just WORKS.
You should look for a barrel maker to sponsor you.

----------


## L.R

Dont get to caught up on the 6.5 version, its just to prove the brass could be formed down that far.  The 338 version wont be a barrel burner at all.  Effort is what some of us enjoy, this is not for commercial sale.

----------


## Cyclist

Thats the thing effort - I just cant believe how much farting around and money people will pour into having their own pet chambering. I also dont get the short action obsession - if you really want a short action get an R93 which will be plenty shorter than any turnbolt.  The R8 is supposed to be even more compact.

Have to have a hobby I suppose.

Next question is - will it eject an unfired round without major surgery / bolt out?  (suspect not??)

----------


## L.R

Ill buy a r93 chamber it and this and you can be the first and id say prob last to fire it.  A case this size would never extract out of a blaser even if the bolt coped with the thrust, which i doubt it would.

The ejection port is no problem.

----------


## R93

Each to their own and I certainly can see the enjoyment in it. Be good fun.

I had to ask how it was thinned, knowing the only safe way was on a lathe. That *is* a lot of work to get 20-50 cases only to be chucked out after x many firings.
How much case capacity will the projectile use up? If throated correctly it will quickly turn into a long action using the intended projectiles, no?

It would be interesting to see it perform as a .375 or .338

----------


## R93

> Ill buy a r93 chamber it and this and you can be the first and id say prob last to fire it.  A case this size would never extract out of a blaser even if the bolt coped with the thrust, which i doubt it would.
> 
> The ejection port is no problem.



Ya dont know much about how blaser works or action length then? 
Maybe if your firing at ridiculous pressures and not exhausting any gas to atmosphere in time. 

A blaser action will handle any conventional pressure thats out there. It is total ignorance to think or say it wont. They have been tested to destruction way above any pressures that can be achieved conventionally. :36 1 5: 

It employs radial locking very simililar to plenty of other systems out there. The purchase on the locking ring is greater than most similar systems yet to achieve locking it does not have to rotate to achieve battery.

----------


## L.R

The case is 56mm the Norma mag is 63mm and can just sneek in a short acton as a 7mm, this will fit in in 338 trim just.

----------


## Cyclist

The R8 is chambered in all the africa mags so it will take some steam, chey tac case head wouldnt fit on too many bolts though I assume?

Anyway, get an R8 with factory barrel in .338 "whatever" (improved if you must throw money away) and you have 99.9% of the same thing with no fucking around whatsoever, it will be lighter, shorter and it is still worth something if you ever need to sell it...  sounds too easy really?

Its the biggest round in the short action thing that I just dont get If you need to get that max max fps then surely carrying 100-200 grams more action and putting in a full sized chey tac round is the way forward??  A rifle in that class dosent exactly want to be a lightweight anyway, people usually seem to be adding weight to serious thumpers like mercury recoil reducers etc.  anyhoo

----------


## L.R

> Ya dont know much about how blaser works or action length then? 
> Maybe if your firing at ridiculous pressures and not exhausting any gas to atmosphere in time. 
> 
> A blaser action will handle any conventional pressure thats out there. It is total ignorance to think or say it wont. They have been tested to destruction way above any pressures that can be achieved conventionally.
> 
> It employs radial locking very simililar to plenty of other system out there. The purchase on the locking ring is greater than most similar systems yet to achieve locking it does not have to rotate to battery.


Trust me I really understand how they work, I've had a lot to do with building receivers for them.  The R93 absolutely would not allow a big enough barrel tennon to allow extraction with this case, no doubt about it.  On the other point, its a combination of case head area and pressure that create the load on the locking lugs or ring in the blaser, obviously the Cheytac has a very large case head and will put much more load on the locking mechanism than say a WSM case loaded to the same pressure.  I highly doubt that the R93 action would cope with this much thrust and I don't think you would find anyone willing to find out, even if you did you would have to find a new way of extracting the case.

----------


## L.R

Its still way to big for the R8.  You tell me what 338 that Blaser chambers for will do 300fps with a 300gr.  I doubt the Blaser would be lighter than this will end up if they both had the same barrel length and contour.  

This round is not for you Cyclist, its far to much work for conventional reloaders, and was not designed to be a commercial option.

----------


## R93

You made out the action would not handle the pressure which is what I was talking about. Not footprint of a case.
Otherwise I would have brought up the LRS2 which would handle that round with slight modification.
Whacking up a receiver or 2 on Lathe and mill doesn't mean much to me unless you have used one extensively.
I hope you hardened the receivers you made, chemically?





Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk. So please forgive my sausage fingers!!!

----------


## L.R

At no point did i mention pressure, we are talking about R93's.  There is a huge difference still between the lapua case and the cheytac case.  

I have used a Blaser quite a lot.  I really enjoy the design and function of them, however I realise there limitations.

As for the hardening, we went a lot more in depth with the material choice and hardness than in the one you used, time will tell how they go.  It seems that the 316L ones will do the job if the headspacing is always controlled i.e. not fireforming to AI, so our metarial which is much harder and tougher than 316 should be good.

----------


## Normie

Abe I want a 338 version.... When I can afford it.

Regarding the Blaser actions, I'd heard of a few failing a while back where the bolts acted as a reverse projectile into someones face? Only heard/ read it.

----------


## tui_man2

Here's the 7mm version with a 180gr hybrid 
An the 338 version with a 300gr gen2
Shown with a 338edge an gen1

Will be a interesting case :Have A Nice Day: 

Sent from my GT-I9300T using Tapatalk 2

----------


## Rich007

Sounds like a lot of fun guys! As long as you are getting what you want out of it, it doesn't matter how long it takes (or costs).

Will be interested in the results :Grin:

----------


## Terminator

If I had a choice between all the hard work of your short Cheytac range or Kiwi Gregs new300-338-375 range that requires little or no work at all, will work in a cheap 700 Rem action and will push a 300gr at 3150+ Kiwi Gregs would get my vote every time.

PS: I've had alot of experience with extreme forming of cases and while I agree its fun at the start in the end its just not worth it and you end up wishing you never talked yourself into it.

----------


## L.R

> If I had a choice between all the hard work of your short Cheytac range or Kiwi Gregs new300-338-375 range that requires little or no work at all, will work in a cheap 700 Rem action and will push a 300gr at 3150+ Kiwi Gregs would get my vote every time.


Really? I would never have guessed that.

----------


## kiwijames

> Abe I want a 338 version.... When I can afford it.
> 
> Regarding the Blaser actions, I'd heard of a few failing a while back where the bolts acted as a reverse projectile into someones face? Only heard/ read it.


And that's all any one has ever done. No one seen it. But they're spendy rifle for knobs so lets cane em.

----------


## L.R

No one is caning Blasers. They are a nice rifle that works well. But they are limited by what they can handle like any action, they can't do everything.

----------


## Terminator

Out of interest what is the water capacity of you new cases (grain weight of water minus the case weight)??

----------


## R93

> And that's all any one has ever done. No one seen it. But they're spendy rifle for knobs so lets cane em.


I actually met a bloke with pretty severe facial injurys that it happened too. He was still using a blaser tho.

----------


## kiwijames

> I actually met a bloke with pretty severe facial injurys that it happened too. He was still using a blaser tho.


Aargh Dave. Don't feed the haters. I once read about a R93 issue where a round was fired with a primer in with the powder. Other than that they're all piles of shit that are less stable than a sweaty stick of gelly in the sun.

----------


## R93

> Aargh Dave. Don't feed the haters. I once read about a R93 issue where a round was fired with a primer in with the powder. Other than that they're all piles of shit that are less stable than a sweaty stick of gelly in the sun.


My point was the bloke was still using a blaser James. Its not my place to say what happened other than it wasnt totally the rifles fault, this was 15 yrs ago. 
I have never heard any of the improved line R93 actions failing. 
I decided to get one after seeing them used and passed for deployment in a military role. Plenty of Armys including the Australian Army have kitted up with them for their main sniper system in .338LM.
.338LM is way larger than I would ever go for what I do, so if its good enough for them, anything smaller is good enough for me.

I personally have never seen or handled a more accurate or practical rifle for the way I hunt or shoot. I doubt I could ever go back to a standard bolt action as I am pretty sure I have forgotten how too cycle it and would get majorly fucked off crawling thru scrub and having to unload and load all the time. My only issue with them is the weight. A lot of it is in the stock and it would be good to see a sturdy carbon fibre one come out.

----------


## kiwijames

> My point was the bloke was still using a blaser James. Its not my place to say what happened other than it wasnt totally the rifles fault, this was 15 yrs ago. 
> I have never heard any of the improved line R93 actions failing. 
> I decided to get one after seeing them used and passed for deployment in a military role. Plenty of Armys including the Australian Army have kitted up with them for their main sniper system in .338LM.
> .338LM is way larger than I would ever go for what I do, so if its good enough for them, anything smaller is good enough for me.
> 
> I personally have never seen or handled a more accurate or practical rifle for the way I hunt or shoot. I doubt I could ever go back to a standard bolt action as I am pretty sure I have forgotten how too cycle it and would get majorly fucked off crawling thru scrub and having to unload and load all the time. My only issue with them is the weight. A lot of it is in the stock and it would be good to see a sturdy carbon fibre one come out.


http://www.christensenarms.ch/e_extremer93.asp

----------


## R93

> Christensen Arms Europe - Extreme R93



Bastard!!! You most likely cost me x amount of dollars! Just sent them an e-mail regarding a stock.

Never heard of them and I search regularly for new blaser aftermarket stuff. (I like wasting time and money on my POS rifle :Psmiley: )

Cheers for the link James

----------


## Cyclist

For the record i'm not suggesting that you can get 3000fps out of a blaser mag with a 300g pill - i'm suggesting that its an irrelavent and arbitary figure (and one that you have presumably pulled out of your bum anyway till the pin hits a primer  :Wink: ) and that figure can be exceeded or near met by other more efficient (logical?) rifle systems i.e long action or "no action".

Hope you enjoy your build and it kicks ass.

----------


## sneeze

> I actually met a bloke with pretty severe facial injurys that it happened too. He was still using a blaser tho.


Hmmm.... any mirrors around at the time?

----------


## R93

> Hmmm.... any mirrors around at the time?



Wanka!! Im a pilot so of course I have one in every pocket. :Psmiley:

----------


## sneeze

:Grin:  :Grin:  
Well , a self proclaimed 'face for radio'.. still shoots a blaser.... seemed possible  you met yourself in a mirror

----------


## R93

Or run into a strong one, head first, really fast :Grin:

----------


## sneeze

Now that would be some serious self atraction

Actually I cant see the " realy fast" thing but in slow motion with welcoming arms spread .. definatly

----------


## R93

Whadda ya mean ya cant see really fast? The cook calls me *Lightning* on Wed nights.

----------


## tui_man2

Right off the blasers now :Psmiley: 

First few rounds went trough the 338 version tonight an all went well witch is a plus an showed very good promise
Speed wise pushed upto 3080fps with the gen2s with the ladder as far as was loaded from what we had decided, more testing to follow but things are looking  :36 1 11: 
Let the hatters hate but this is one sext looking round

----------


## 7mmsaum

3080fps is very usable velocity !

----------


## BRADS

Any update on this @tui_man2


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

----------


## Seventenths

Well done guys on trying something new regardless of the flack your receiving... boundaries are meant to be pushed and when people said we want to put a man on the moon there were sceptics saying... what the fuck!

Good luck in your endeavours and like KJ... I'm looking forward the pictures and results!

----------


## tui_man2

> Any update on this @tui_man2
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Lol you tapped my phone mate?

Mark 2 not far from going have built a single shot action to suit better bolt went to be hardened Friday

----------


## veitnamcam

> Lol you tapped my phone mate?
> 
> Mark 2 not far from going have built a single shot action to suit better bolt went to be hardened Friday


 :Useless:

----------


## deepsouthaussie

Fired a 416 cheyTac yesterday. Was cool!  💪👌

----------


## tui_man2

Like this bolt for my Gen2 action but way shorter amd fatter

M31.5 x 1.75 thread to make biggest tenon I can, barrel solid buts up on internal face and slim not gay looking barrel nut . . . Unlike savages

Bolt will come out to load one back on the face, on action port since it's short. 

Pics of it and Gen2 ti actions will follow when I'm happy with them after more testing. . . 

Semi finished gen2 bolt by short action rem bolt. Weighs 319grams complete with lugs amd spiral flute still to go.

----------


## Proudkiwi

Don't send it to the anodizers though Abe. You'll never get it back.

----------


## ChrisF

The  Aussie Army using the Blasers in 338LM , was more of a emergency , quick off the self purchase , with no propper Army Trials etc done , I think they where listening TOO much to a certain US SF group .
Show me some more Armies that use the Blaser in 338LM as a sniper rifle ?

And they have had some issues with the Blaser in Aussie service recently  , I think it was along the lines of a blowup or two .

Also , talk to some Brits about the Blaser in 338LM , that they trialled , the Blaser did not get far , they deemed it unsafe ( they had a couple , not just one rifle ), as it was firing simply by chambering a round , and firing when the safety was removed etc , if you want more info on the Brit issue go over to ukvarminting they have all the info .

I maybe WRONG , show me all the Blasers in 338LM in service as sniper rifles , outside the silly Aussies & Yanks , Opps .

All I see is a lot of AI , Sako in the main , with a bit of PGW & Steyr .

----------


## tui_man2

> The  Aussie Army using the Blasers in 338LM , was more of a emergency , quick off the self purchase , with no propper Army Trials etc done , I think they where listening TOO much to a certain US SF group .
> Show me some more Armies that use the Blaser in 338LM as a sniper rifle ?
> 
> And they have had some issues with the Blaser in Aussie service recently  , I think it was along the lines of a blowup or two .
> 
> Also , talk to some Brits about the Blaser in 338LM , that they trialled , the Blaser did not get far , they deemed it unsafe ( they had a couple , not just one rifle ), as it was firing simply by chambering a round , and firing when the safety was removed etc , if you want more info on the Brit issue go over to ukvarminting they have all the info .
> 
> I maybe WRONG , show me all the Blasers in 338LM in service as sniper rifles , outside the silly Aussies & Yanks , Opps .
> 
> All I see is a lot of AI , Sako in the main , with a bit of PGW & Steyr .


Chris no one cares. . . . You hate blasers. . . . .get over it. . . .

----------


## BRADS

> Chris no one cares. . . . You hate blasers. . . . .get over it. . . .


He likes those AI pieces of heavier  shit which is amusing


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

----------


## kiwijames

> He likes those AI pieces of heavier  shit which is amusing
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Sssshh. He WAS about to tell the PLASTIC washer story WITH faulty caps lock button and all. 
Go talk to SOME Brits, they'll tell YOU all about IT.

----------


## BRADS

> Sssshh. He WAS about to tell the PLASTIC washer story WITH faulty caps lock button and all. 
> Go talk to SOME Brits, they'll tell YOU all about IT.


Bro Monique says your dumb

But I do like the washer story can you tell it again Chris?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

----------


## R93

> The  Aussie Army using the Blasers in 338LM , was more of a emergency , quick off the self purchase , with no propper Army Trials etc done , I think they where listening TOO much to a certain US SF group .
> Show me some more Armies that use the Blaser in 338LM as a sniper rifle ?
> 
> And they have had some issues with the Blaser in Aussie service recently  , I think it was along the lines of a blowup or two .
> 
> Also , talk to some Brits about the Blaser in 338LM , that they trialled , the Blaser did not get far , they deemed it unsafe ( they had a couple , not just one rifle ), as it was firing simply by chambering a round , and firing when the safety was removed etc , if you want more info on the Brit issue go over to ukvarminting they have all the info .
> 
> I maybe WRONG , show me all the Blasers in 338LM in service as sniper rifles , outside the silly Aussies & Yanks , Opps .
> 
> All I see is a lot of AI , Sako in the main , with a bit of PGW & Steyr .


Fuck sake. You believe everything you read on the Internet about military issues,  written on a varmint forum no less😆

They are still in service. End of story.
Britt used/use the SA 80 so you have to question there trialing methods and choices. Its a piece of shit.
Stop posting what militaries do with weapon systems because at the end of the day you just read about it and most of the shit is written about by other wannabes who have as well. 

I work with ex Aussie snipers who admittedly do not like the blaser but for no other reason but how they were expected to employ it.


Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

----------


## 7mmsaum

I shoot plenty of blasers and the accuracy is outstanding.




The aussie that blew his one up was fully lubing the brass with sizing lube before firing (to aid extraction )

This resulted in excessive bolt thrust, and component failure as a result.

----------


## BRADS

> I shoot plenty of blasers and the accuracy is outstanding.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The aussie that blew his one up was fully lubing the brass with sizing lube before firing (to aid extraction )
> 
> This resulted in excessive bolt thrust, and component failure as a result.


I like the chick that owns that one more than the gun


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

----------


## 7mmsaum

:Have A Nice Day:

----------


## R93

> I like the chick that owns that one more than the gun
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Pic?

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

----------


## BRADS

> Pic?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk


Sorry chap best I could do.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

----------


## R93

Good enough for an old deviant like me😆
Especially seeing I am hut bound with a bunch of smelly bastards because of this.


Just missed a chance to take a pic of a red stag covered in snow roaring in a clearing 100 yrds from the hut.
Pretty sure he was bellowing just to keep warm.

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

----------


## BRADS

Jesus Mate that looks dam cold!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

----------


## R93

It is especially for me. I am struggling with it to be fair. Used to 40° heat and it has even been warm on the coast. 
This is retarded but has got the animals going great guns. Poor buggers.


Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

----------


## 7mmsaum

> It is especially for me. I am struggling with it to be fair. Used to 40° heat and it has even been warm on the coast. 
> This is retarded but has got the animals going great guns. Poor buggers.
> 
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk


Try calling one right up to the hut  :Have A Nice Day:

----------


## R93

> Try calling one right up to the hut


We are fenced in. And can't see much more than 100 yrds in this blizzard.
None of the reds here are worth looking at. All shit heads. 

The Fallow bucks are another story.
Bloke shot a black fallow day before yesty. Absolute munter of a head and deer.

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

----------


## PerazziSC3

glad we got out of fiordland early after seeing the snow being dumped around southland...

----------


## R93

How did you get on Jock?

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

----------


## PerazziSC3

plenty of seafood, stags/bulls were going ok at times, didnt pull the trigger

----------

