# Firearms and Shooting > Reloading and Ballistics >  Lehigh Bullets

## ODL

I wanted some subsonic 300 BLK hunting rounds and did a bit of research into what works.  As such I ordered in some Lehigh bullets in a small quantity to put on the website in case anyone else was also interested.  Local website.

Here is the Lehigh website.  I have an export permit for most of their bullets including the match solids.  I am planning my next order now so if anyone wants to try some of their rounds, email me and I will get them ordered into the next batch.

My initial impression is that they do indeed expand within the first 50mm of meat.  I shot several possums from 3m to 50 meters and all had massive exit wounds from the 194 grain shot at around 1018 fps using 7.3 grains of lilgun.  I have not shot a deer with one yet but that is planned for the end of February.  I haven't loaded the supersonic rounds yet.

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## scoped

can you get the 168 subbys

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## Carpe Diem

Dude - I'd be up for this.. i saw the I think 220 or 230's Subs reviewed on Youtube on twang and Bang. and was wondering how to get a hold of them.

Do you know what you are looking to bring back? what the minimums are to make it worthwhile for you? and the potential costings?. As I say very keen, just drop me a PM with the details.

Word was Hornady were also going down a similar path that may or may not be on show at the "Shot Show" this week. I guess I'll wait to hear the report back from John and Darrin in a week or so's time.

Cheers P.

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## ODL

Here is what is on my current export license:

Controlled Chaos .224 55g
Controlled Chaos .308 110g
Controlled Chaos .308 145g
Controlled Fracturing .308 168g
Controlled Fracturing .308 174g
 Controlled Fracturing .338 283g
Controlled Fracturing Pistol .355 105g
Controlled Fracturing Pistol .451 170g
 Match Solid .338 245 g
Match Solid .416 416 g
Match Solid .510 650 g
Match Solid .510 750 g
Match Solid .510 808 g
Maximum Expansion .308 194 g

I can mix and match any number of these items in an order.  Until I get to large quantities, each box is limited to 20 pounds.  The last time I brought in two 20 pound packs.  With shipping, GST and clearance fees, they still come up only slightly dearer than they would in the US when adjusted for GST and NZD USD conversion.

Keep in mind that the subsonic bullets MUST be shot subsonic or transsonic and they are very sensitive to twist rate to keep them stable.  When I asked why the 194 maximum expansion rounds had a boat tail rather than a flat tail for better sound from a suppressor, they told me they would not stabilize with a flat base.  I duplicate all the individual info from their site on my site for bullets I carry.  Check their site for data on rounds I am not currently carrying for load applications.

If you want what I have now, you can order them off the website.  If you want something different, I will add it to the next order which will go in next week.

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## Carpe Diem

Thanks Guys... Have just ordered a pack off the website of the 194gr. I'll let you know how I get on.. Will probably split them with Darrin for his AR and I'll use in the Ruger Ranch loads as an evaluation of what they work well in.

Best regards P.

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## ODL

Here is an answer to some questions I had direct from Dave at Lehigh Defence:

You can shoot any of the .308 subsonics in any .308 cartridge at 1040fps as long as the barrel twist is 1:8 or faster.  I guess there are a lot of Tikka's there in 1:11 twist and none of our bullets will be stable there.  The 02-308-170-LP, 170gr Controlled Fracturing will stabilize ok in most 1:10's, but the 168, 174, and 194 need a 1:8; if a customer shoots any of these in a 1:11 with a can on, they are going to have a baffle strike.  The BC's (G1) for the .308 subsonics on the Lehigh Defense site are as follows: 168gr(0.630), 170gr(0.531), 174gr(0.586), 194gr(0.638)

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## PerazziSC3

Would the high velocity round perform similar to the Barnes? Would be a lot more cost effective

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## Markgibsonr25

I will take one or two boxes 50-100) of the 194grn expansion rnd for the blackout please

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## ODL

Sorry, I sold out of the 194's.  Carpe got the last one.  I will reorder today and get any other projo's in the next shipment based on requests.

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## scoped

so what should i use from a 12" 308 if i want to use subsonics and avoid baffle strike?.. i am using 168s at supersonic at the mo

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## ODL

If you have a 1 in 8 twist then all the subs should work according to Dave at Lehigh.  I have 168, 174 and 194 on order along with an assortment of other stuff.  I would always advise checking any new round is stable without the can before running them with a can on.

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## scoped

so what can I use with my 1 in 12 twist

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## dave-m

> so what can I use with my 1 in 12 twist


You could get away with the 174's but 1-12 is usually optimised for 150's. Being a subsonic load, that might change also...Only one way to find out bro.

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## ODL

> Would the high velocity round perform similar to the Barnes? Would be a lot more cost effective


I haven't shot the Barnes so I can't comment.  Here is a link to some videos of the Lehigh bullets in a variety of media.  They seem to perform quite well.





> so what can I use with my 1 in 12 twist


Only the supersonic rounds.  If the twist is to low, the bullet will yaw.

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## ChrisF

Any news on the locking cans ?

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## ODL

Two different types are printing next week.  I missed this weeks run for a variety of reasons.  One will work with a KAC A2 flash hider and the other one will work with a proprietary brake.  I will test these for accuracy, robustness and sound.  I should have some available for February.

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## Bugbait

Hi there ODL, When are you expecting delivery of new stock of the 194gr ME projectiles. Cheers in advance.

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## ODL

I just got in a box that was from the last shipment.  I loaded them back up on the store.  I also have more inbound on the next shipment along with an assortment of of other rounds.

Dave from Lehigh just emailed me saying that the 168 grain controlled chaos work very well on whitetail and are in use by a DOC agency back there.  I have some coming on the next shipment.

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## scoped

great are those 168s you speak of for subsonic?

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## ODL

Yes, they are.  Here is the data on them. 


Here is a link to the load data.

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## Grue

Anyone knocked a deer over with a sub yet?

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## Carpe Diem

Sorry Guys - With Ruger delaying the arrival of the 300 Blk American Ranch model til March /April Can't quite get this info to you yet.

Once I do I'll do a full independent report for you all on Range and on Game... Til then I also will be watching the American sites for anything else that shows up.

Best regards CD.

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## ODL

New bullets just arrived with a few more due in next week.

Lehigh Bullets

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## tikka

> Anyone knocked a deer over with a sub yet?


Just came back from a trip in the bush for the first try on Lehigh 194gr ME subs. Only did a 3 shot group at 60m with a 1" group ( no chrony ) will do when have more time.
Shot 5 goats all broad side body, heart, lung shot and the bullets did awesome internal damage and large exit wounds. The only bullet recovered was a front on centre chest shot found in the gut.

The bullet on the top is a 230gr Berger OTM shot between the eyes and exited at the base of the skull and found under the skin on the back steaks.

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## Grue

Looks like they're doing what they're supposed to!

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## PerazziSC3

That is pretty awesome performance, would be a very large wound channel

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## tikka

> Sorry Guys - With Ruger delaying the arrival of the 300 Blk American Ranch model til March /April Can't quite get this info to you yet.
> 
> Once I do I'll do a full independent report for you all on Range and on Game... Til then I also will be watching the American sites for anything else that shows up.
> 
> Best regards CD.


You got your Ruger yet? I see there's one on TradeMe

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## Carpe Diem

> You got your Ruger yet? I see there's one on TradeMe


Yup and loving it. It did need a bit of tutu-ing @tikka - but most of that was playing to my OCD - stiffening the fore-end of the stock, lightening and taking creep out of the trigger all really easy do yourself stuff and next once I've got Mark at Waitaki to do the custom overbarrel supressor I'll glue and screw the final bedding in for it (nathan Foster style) just like yo do for a Accuracy International stock. I understand that's how to get the best out of it.



From the firing different projectiles I was well impressed with the grouping of the lehigh 196 ME rounds as they were second in grouping accuracy onlybehind the 125 Sierra match kings that I expected to use for the benchmark. The Hornady Whisper 208 factorys were slightly worse. 

Now gonna have to make up my mind what to do with the Troy PAR in 300 with a same 16" nitrided barrel but 1:8 vs 1:7 for the Ruger - next project or flick it on ???

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## Carpe Diem

Here's The TROY PAR - in 300 AAC just in case you hadn't seen my other post. Yes - its A-CAT being non-semi and has just been type approved by Wellington YAY!!!  in 223,308 and 300AAC 



Keen to see if you all like it or not - What sold me originally is its a grand cheaper than a Daniel Defence, AAC or similar AR in 300 at under 2K. and a variable length stock that is made for it not an afterthought...oh and removable muzzle break threaded 5/8x24.

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## Simon

I like it a lot. 308 is more my style as I already have a 300 Blackout AR15.
Been thinking of buying one for quite some time from NZ Guns as they are listed at $1500.
They have been on Pre order on the site for quite some time. If they have got the tick from Wellington now I guess they will be available very shortly.
Need a bigger safe.

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## veitnamcam

What's it weigh ?

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## Carpe Diem

> I like it a lot. 308 is more my style as I already have a 300 Blackout AR15.
> Been thinking of buying one for quite some time from NZ Guns as they are listed at $1500.
> They have been on Pre order on the site for quite some time. If they have got the tick from Wellington now I guess they will be available very shortly.
> Need a bigger safe.


Yup - Don't know what the ordering scenario is for NZ Guns at a $1599 dollar price point (that's been the price they've stuck with since September last year at least and it hasn't moved a inch) - but I know another mob did the import and type approval for this to distribute themselves. Don't wanna talk ill of NZG as they do a good job, but I hope they can stick to their price-point given the way the US dollar has been moving around -For me it wasn't cheap to import even as as part of the inital supply that was landed so I hope they are setting the right price expectation currently for the market.

Happy to give you the detail of the importer by PM to discuss how you could get access to stock if you want.

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## Carpe Diem

> What's it weigh ?


Troy quotes the weight for the PAR at 6 Lb's in 223 /300 the 308 is bit more hefty at 7lbs. - Hope that was what you were after VC.

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## tikka

How everyone getting on with these Lehigh Defence projectile's?
I have been having a good run with them, massive exit wounds and blood trials on red deer, shooting goats is a waste of a good pil. The 194gr ME is definitely the best subsonic projectile I have used so far.  They blow strait through shoulders and shred the insides like a broadhead. Still haven't recovered one yet on broad side shots.

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## Bugbait

Yeah the 194gr ME is really good to load very accurate(in a AR), I have only shot one deer with them but whilst I got a good blood trail with a couple of larger pools of blood I was unable to recover the animal(gutted). The dog trailed it for a couple of km but it was not to be. Not the projectiles fault it obviously produced a decent hole on both sides. 
Next I tried the 168gr CF, a little more difficult to load for but once I worked out that 2205 worked much better than N110 it was all good. I also crimped that load and it was better again. I've done lots of shooting into wet cardboard with the 168gr and without fail they expand/explode well, 4" in pretty good cavitation and the petals fracture off in a 6" diameter.
Sounds like your having good success with shooting the 194gr methinks I will try them again.
Cheers

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