Thread: 143eldx vs 147eldm

So what's the difference, my readings on the world wide web recons much of a muchness between the two although a slight difference in size and ogive.
Anyone use both in the same rifle, any performance difference?

@Steelisreal can probably chime in here.

I'm led to believe they're the same size and shape but the M's have a thinner jacket and less of a HP so less copper and more lead to make up the extra 4 grains.

I've got two rifles that like the M's. Have never tried the X's.

Obvious performance difference is the difference in BC. Terminal performance: the M's will be a bit softer.

Originally Posted by Pommy

@Steelisreal can probably chime in here.

I'm led to believe they're the same size and shape but the M's have a thinner jacket and less of a HP so less copper and more lead to make up the extra 4 grains.

I've got two rifles that like the M's. Have never tried the X's.

Obvious performance difference is the difference in BC. Terminal performance: the M's will be a bit softer.

That pretty much sums up what I know as well.

They might be the same shape but they definitely behave very differently. I've had great success with the 143 Eld-X - shoots very small groups repeatedly with Re16.

The same can't be said for the 147 - haven't found the magic recipe as yet.

I've shot a pile of small to medium sized critters with the Eld-X and they worked well. I've only fired four at deer so far. The first one was a complete miss, many lessons learnt. Next three have all dropped a deer each so no complaints at all.

NB word also is that the thicker jacket on the X is inclined to push up pressures,

ie don't take the load data for the heavier M and expect to use it for the X.
Z

So does M not stand for Match - i.e. X is a hunting projectile, M is a paper puncher?

https://www.hornady.com/bullets/eld-match#!/

Or am I stating the obvious, missing the question?

Originally Posted by Jhon

So does M not stand for Match - i.e. X is a hunting projectile, M is a paper puncher?

https://www.hornady.com/bullets/eld-match#!/

Or am I stating the obvious, missing the question?

Those are their stated purposes as per Hornady, yes. The M's certain don't bounce off of deer though. They're both jacketed hollowpoints with polymer tips when you cross section them.

So are Ms commonly used for hunting? Or just when needs must?

Originally Posted by Jhon

So are Ms commonly used for hunting? Or just when needs must?

Quite common yes. Often used for long rang hunting applications as when impact velocity decreases the softer ELD-M expands quite reliability and creates good wound chanels. Some harder purpose built hunting projectiles leave the risk of not having enough expansion if no bone is hit at longer ranges.

Also a lot of people(including myself) use the match model(still going on the 162 amax) in short bushpig setups. Driven at moderate speeds they are very effective close range projectiles and still retain enough energy and expansion abilitues to shoot out to 500m ish- give or take depending on shooter ability, load consistency etc.

Originally Posted by Jhon

So are Ms commonly used for hunting? Or just when needs must?

The use of M's these days would have stemmed from the extensive and successful use of the old AMAX. Which was in fact by design a match projectile but good old Kiwi's turned it into a deer slayer with a cult following, ever heard of AMAXED?

Here's the exit on a fallow hit with a 7mm 180 ELD-M.



The M's do just fine, even up close, provided they aren't pushed too hard.

@Pommy what is pushing too hard ? 3000fps?

Originally Posted by Pommy

Here's the exit on a fallow hit with a 7mm 180 ELD-M.

Attachment 176038

The M's do just fine, even up close, provided they aren't pushed too hard.

Originally Posted by 308mate

@Pommy what is pushing too hard ? 3000fps?

@308mate difference in intended ranges would be my deciding factor when doing a load development. I tend to think more about impact velocity when used for hunting applications. Eg a 7mm mag, capable of taking deer par 7-800m, anything north of 3000fps for 162eldm is more desirable, however, my 7mm08 with same 162eldm i aimed for 2650fps for more appropriate impact velocities at closer ranges

Originally Posted by 308mate

@Pommy what is pushing too hard ? 3000fps?

I think there's a lot of variables to that as with most things. What animal? How far away? Shot placement?

The bigger the diameter and the higher sectional density on the bullet, the more forgiving they're going to be. But based on the amount of expansion I've seen from 180's, I don't think I'd want the impact speeds to be much above say 2600 (the MV from my 284) for a boiler room shot on a red?? My preference is to get an exit wound and I strongly suspect that, M's mushroom out a bit too quickly and dump their energy before punching all the way through, with too much speed or after hitting bone. I've had one fail to exit a big red at 100m - high shoulder shot, impact about 2450. The deer got back up and ran (not far, fortunately). Mangled bullet recovered under the opposite shoulder, so what's that? About 10" penetration??? Boiler room shot would have been better but wasn't an option. On the other hand, the above fallow was at 150m and yeah... pretty emphatic results. I've taken another fallow at 500m (so impact was around 2000fps), vertical spine shot, and the wound channel was perfect, exited bottom of the ribs with very little meat damage.

Only shot one deer with a 147. Red hind. 200m. Boiler room, quartering away. She ran too (probably close to 100m). Second bullet opened up the bottom of the ribs and she died quickly. Bullet mushroomed nicely and was recovered under the offside skin. Should have potentially gone for a hilar shot on that one.

@Steelsreal
Ive been shooting 130gr TGK in a 6.5 creedmoor 22" barrel with very good accuracy and velocities using Rl16. Im looking to change to something a bit heavier for hunting use and have a heap of 143eldx. What's your load and rifle setup for the 143 just for interest not to copy it.

General rule of thumb

Heavy projectile for case then M
Light projectile for case then X