Thread: 300 Ham'R or 30 Apache

Originally Posted by Beetroot

Whats the appeal of using cast bullets? Just for the cost saving?
I briefly played with case bullets and found them to be a pain in the arse when loading, that unless I was a very high volume shooter then I'm not sure I'd bother.

If I were limited to a 223 bolt face I'd go for 6x45, maybe 25x45 or 6.5x45 depending on projectile availability.
It's probably just me but I don't see the appeal in a 30cal with such little case capacity.

My thought process is this:
the small case capacity means you either need to go for a very light bullet or put up with lower velocity with a heavier bullet, both result is a cartridge that will have a practical range of 300ish meters, if you are then limiting yourself to 300m then you may as well go go for something like the 6x45.
6x45 will have less muzzle energy but will have a higher BC bullet and higher muzzle velocity that at 300m you'll have performance similar to a 243 at 400-500m which most people would be happy with.
You then get the advantage of less drop and less effected by the wind.

Unless you need a lot of close range energy (like the Americans want for big game or shooting mass pigs with ARs) then I don't see the appeal in the 30/338/45/etc calibre cartridges unless the idea is also do run subsonics. I also think in the current climate where the likes of ADI have stopped producing the less common/popular powders I wouldn't want to get into a cartridge that needs a oddball powder unless I already had a decent supply.

In saying all that in the OPs situation, especially if he already has 30cal bullets and suitable powders, then 30 apache (30-223) would be a good choice as forming of brass is easy and 223 brass is readily available. If the hunting distances are such that 300blk/30-30 would be more than adequate the 30hamr/30-223 are giving you better perforamance with the only downside being burning more powder, which is likely inconsiquential in this siutation.

The appeal of cast bullets to me is guaranteed availability as long as you can find lead. Current projectile situation is exactly why I like the idea of casting. I also enjoy tinkering and I design my own bullets and machine my own molds.
The smaller caliber high velocity cartridges just don't work that well with cast projectiles for larger game and to me a .30 is about as small as you can go and still get decent weight behind a reasonable length projectile.
The fact that you also have a speed limit of around 2200fps adds to the need for weight. 140-160gr seems to perform well at this velocity and it so happens that you can achieve this out of a little case like a 300 HAM'R, thumbs up all round in my books.

Subs are interesting and I have a short 45-70 single shot that I am loading cast 450gr flat nose projectiles at 1050fps which is great fun, but the trajectory and sights limit it to inside 100m realistically.

I have enough high velocity high BC laser beams that can kill to 800m+, cast bullets are the other end of the spectrum and is its own challenge, which I enjoy.