Thread: 500 BPE load advice

Originally Posted by southernman

local gun store here in Canada has Norma 500 nitro express,($149)for 25 also starline in 50-110 win and 50-90 sharps, $90-50 and $110- 50, any of these any good to you, I will be back in NZ in five weeks.

@southernman I have it under control with the 5 cases I have and I know where there is another 15 if I ever need them
But thanks for the offer

I do need an original 1885 center fire firing pin if you happen to have one spare in your parts boxes !

Cheers

Well I have just fired the Hollis Martini
Set up with sand bags and a string on the trigger
It went bang like I had expected
Primer was fine
Still sitting where I put it so not to much recoil
Shot clearly hit roughly where I had aimed it at a full sheet of ply wood
Very easy to see which hole was the 500 !

Load was
Large rifle primer
70 grains by volume of FFG
Compressed slightly with a card wad
Length of PEF rod slightly compressed
Card wad
Lubed and sized 450 grain projectile
Hard finger pressure into expanded neck
Perfect ignition
Case came out with a light tap from a cleaning rod ( no extractor )

When I get some time I will trim the rest of the cases and do the same loads again and run it through the chronograph and see what its doing.
Just want to show the case to a friend and get his take on where to seat the projectile etc.
I'm picking if this was a 500 Express that was firing 340 grain paper patch projectiles that they would have been seated well out to be able to fit the original 136 grain load in there
Because the lead area seems quite long even for the 450s
Lots to learn

The bore might be choked like a 577/450 Martini Henry.
The bore begins .470 and tapers to .450.

If that's the case and it has Metford Rifling,Sizing bullets is a waste of time imho but cast them super hard and seat them well out in the case.

Hard bullets grip better in Medford Rifling and longer seating length means a shorter run to the taper of the bore.

Originally Posted by norsk

The bore might be choked like a 577/450 Martini Henry.
The bore begins .470 and tapers to .450.

If that's the case and it has Metford Rifling,Sizing bullets is a waste of time imho but cast them super hard and seat them well out in the case.

Hard bullets grip better in Medford Rifling and longer seating length means a shorter run to the taper of the bore.

@norsk I'm just delighted it went bang and stayed in one piece

I know heaps more about its chamber now and its sizes
So I can google around and find out more about the type of projectile that most suits it
Once I know the speed I can make a call on firing it from the shoulder and then I can see if it shoots minute of barn door or better

I use the guts of auto motive double ended screw driver droped down from muzzle end to pop cases out of my .45/70 saves carting a cleaning rod around.
if you want to roll your own BP the recipe is easy to find.....and so simple to do.

So is anyone doing a nitro from black load for anything like this 500 express ?

My only concern is that there is data out there which was posted earlier in this thread but I would want to reduce it even more.
I don't want a nitro equivalent load because I don't want to push it that hard and it's only a 7 1/2 pound rifle !
If it was a double and weighted another 2 or 3 pounds and if I had to hit the speed to regulate it then I would push it on.

So there will be a huge space to fill
That's no problem when the PEF rod is so good for that job, but I'm not sure if only filling the 1/3rd with nitro powder and 2/3rd with PEF rod is safe ?

I will get back on to it later in the week

I realise the .45/70 is only a baby by comparison.....but plenty of loads out there for it....Ive used 2206 loads and they surely are a huge step above black stuff.the beauty of home rolled is its bulk....its a real effort to get 65grns into case so it might give you a fuller case than commercial stuff without so much filler needed.

So @john m and @Maca49 what is the book that you guys posted the images of BPE load data from ?

It looks like the sort of book I need to own

Cheers

Originally Posted by john m

Attachment 131621

Thanks John
That's a whole can of worms to open up !
A book like that could get me in a lot of very expensive trouble

It's a minefield of facts and opinion with regards to smokeless loads in BP rifles.

Personally I do it in two MH's and a Trapdoor Springfeild using a fast pistol powder and backer rod.

Kynoch did it for 50 years by reducing the volume of the case with clay and having a collum of smokeless powder up the middle of it for 577/450 smokeless loads.

Firing a couple of smokeless rounds after a BP shoot gives the bore a good clean.

@norsk you know me
I will want to get it out hunting asap
So a smokeless load would be nice to have on hand when cleaning up after BP loads is awkward

The extractor will sort it out sooner or later.
I will turn up a safety catch spindle maybe this weekend and start to see what's happening in there.
I would like to find a period looking lever to go on that spindle
Or I can make one and antique it

The price of the book will make you shit your pants, there are later editions than the one in the phot, I got mine from Aussie

Originally Posted by Maca49

The price of the book will make you shit your pants, there are later editions than the one in the phot, I got mine from Aussie

Yes I googled it
The book is about the cost of a cheap double rifle !!

Originally Posted by akaroa1

Yes I googled it
The book is about the cost of a cheap double rifle !!

Well no, if you find a double for a couple of hundry I’d be keen!!