Thread: 6.5 Creedmoor load development

Yip can looks great! Id say RL16 will be the winner in your 20" tube too. Mine loves the 130gr TMKs and 136gr Scenars but will be testing some 130gr vlds this week.
Post your results here as Id love to see how you get on with it.

Tested my scales up against two sets of my mates scales tonight and they were spot on so that rules that theory out..

My brass has been tumbled neck sized and re-anealed today so all set for the next tests.
I also picked up my new batch of 2209 from him so Ill re-test that same troublesome load of 41.5gr in it too to rule out a bad batch of powder.

Well after a couple of test loads of the new batch 2209 can safely say tht it was my other batch of 2209 that was giving me the pressure spikes. Very interesting and not something Ive ever seen to this extent.
So 41.5gr of the new batch of 2209 shows no signs at all of high pressure at all. No ejector imprint or wipe, no heavy bolt lift and no flat primer or ugly sharp cratering. I would be more than happy to push this load much more.

The pic shows on the right hand side; my pet load of RL16 with a 130gr TMK at 2927fps shot as a fouling shot right before the left hand case of 2209 loads which gave me 2659fps, 2653fps and 2657fps with 139gr Lapua scenars.

Pleased you found the culprit Wingman. I've found AR2009 to be the most accurate powder in my rifle. Might try RE16 with the 123 SST for fallow as the 143 ELD-X is a little too heavily constructed for the little buggers.

I have a friend who likes to buy powder in bulk once he's found a load he likes. He has many kilo's of mostly Vihtavuori powder that is at least 20-30 years old. We tried some recently; no odd smell or colour - all useless.

Thought that might be the case. ADI has been known for iffy batches in the past. There’s a good example of batch variance written up on one of the Aussie forums, I’ll see if I can find it. But in a round about way you’ve probably ended up better off anyway as RL-16 seems to be a very well matched powder.

I’d be inclined to get onto ADI and give them some straight forward feedback. You never know which one of the techs you’ll get, if they are the kind that gives a shit it might just result in something positive.

Try the original AR2209 again and you'll conclude it was the issue I referred to earlier.

Originally Posted by Puffin

Try the original AR2209 again and you'll conclude it was the issue I referred to earlier.

I have.. the old batch gets similar velocity but high pressure signs on brass and sticky bolt lifts.

@Puffin Yes I went back to find what you said in your post and I think that may have contributed for sure. However this brass is on its 6th load (anneald on the 5th) and I would have thought to see ejector prints disappear by now if it was just the new case dimensions. I have only ever neck sized this brass and bumped the shoulder a couple of thou, head spacing on loaded rounds feels fine, no weight to close bolt or wiping on them when extracted unfired.
There is nothing else obvious that I can see and with the new batch of powder the pressure signs have gone which leads me to believe that was the sole cause.
Regardless of resolving that issue I dont think I will stray from RL16 now as 2209 may match it in accuracy with a little more load developement but will never match its speed.

Thats interesting , RE the maybe out of spec powder batch of 2209 , and Old Vit powder , I am still using a lot of OLD ADI 2208 powder from rusty cans that are around 18-20 yrs old , still GOOD .

Originally Posted by ChrisF

Thats interesting , RE the maybe out of spec powder batch of 2209 , and Old Vit powder , I am still using a lot of OLD ADI 2208 powder from rusty cans that are around 18-20 yrs old , still GOOD .

Probably depends on the way the powder is stored.

Storage has to be really cool and dry, plus dont have your can in a warm room when youre reloading, or sitting around opened during the process. But even properly-stored, it will change over time and can only be compared to itself, ie it is whatever it is. I still use 20yr-old cans of IMR, still work, but I will get fresh, when the opportunity arises, and I bet I'll be happy with a modern improved powder

This thread has been awesome thankyou.

Big thanks to Gibo for the 130gr Berger VLD hunting bullet samples!
Loaded a few up today for testing. From what Ive been told and what I have read this Berger bullet design likes to be seated very close to the lands or even touch for them to group at their potential.
In my rifle this came with a couple of hiccups.. firstly the seating depth of 5 thou off my lands only put about 75 thou (2mm) in the neck which meant not a lot of neck tension and it made it very hard to seat them concentrically. Alongside my other chosen bullets it has a much shorter bearing surface from top of the boat tail to the ogive which also means less generated pressure and more powder room in the case.




Left to right: 130gr Berger VLD, 136gr Lapua Scenar L, 130gr Sierra TMK, 123gr Lapua Scenar




It also put them at the absolute maximum mag length which had the tips getting caught under the feed ramp.
It would require a small grind if I wanted to feed them from the mag.








So once happy with that I put my same 44gr of RL16 behind them as I use with the 130gr TMK and the CCI BM-4 primers and put it over the chrono.
As expected with less bearing surface and more space under the projectile the pressure and velocity was slightly lower than my TMK loads.





I bump the load up to 44.4gr hoping to get closer to the 2910 -2920fps which the 136gr Lapua and the Sierra TMKs seem to respond best to in my rifle and took 5 rounds to the 100y range.
There was a light wind but it was consistent not gusting but as usual I put 5 rounds of my control 130gr TMK loads on paper to check conditions and warm the barrel (and because I never get sick of seeing them do this) Note: the barrel had a few fouling shots over the chrono.





The velocities for this groups were 2898, 2904, 2892, 2890, 2893 and there were faint shiny ejector marks so Id call it a max load.



Not the best group by any means but I can't help but feel I was responsible in limiting its performance with my throat mod. What works for some bullets clearly doesnt work for others.
Sure I could probably work up a load that may shoot them better, different powders etc or even go against Berger trends and seat them deeper but Im not sure Ill get the same consistent results as the TMK and Lapua bullet offerings which even before fine tuning a load recipee still punched sub moa groups at 100y.
I have 3 VLDs left so maybe Ill load them tomorrow and seat them with a 50 thou just and 44gr to see how they respond.

My 130 berger load is way off the lands. Short magbox on my mod 7 is a prick in that way. Shoots good though so dont be scared to jump the feckers

Originally Posted by Wingman

There was a light wind but it was consistent not gusting but as usual I put 5 rounds of my control 130gr TMK loads on paper to check conditions and warm the barrel (and because I never get sick of seeing them do this) Note: the barrel had a few fouling shots over the chrono.





The velocities for this groups were 2898, 2904, 2892, 2890, 2893 and there were faint shiny ejector marks so Id call it a max load.

What am I missing here ?

If the 130 TMK shoots that well why are you still testing ?

Originally Posted by Kiwi Greg

What am I missing here ?

If the 130 TMK shoots that well why are you still testing ?

You do seem to miss a lot.. don't lose any sleep over it.
Diversity makes life interesting and variety is the spice of life that gives it all its flavor.”

ummmmmmm that and I enjoy reloading and shooting