anealing service

im just wondering if there is an anealing service in new zealand.
as in send your brass and money in, and get your brass anealed back. ?

Yea that would be an awesome service

Or you could save your self all the bother and some cash and just do this

Annealing Brass in HD - YouTube

Or This

Annealing/It's not all that complicated - YouTube

Or you could go High Tech and buy or build one of these.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iy6OwiuWV7A

Cheers
Pete

Hell its not hard as P38 says, i use a 1/4 adapter with a 10mm 1/4" deep socket. ( or whatever fits your case) and put in the drill chuck, then rotate while being heated with a propane torch

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by P38

Or you could save your self all the bother and some cash and just do this

Annealing Brass in HD - YouTube

Or This

Annealing/It's not all that complicated - YouTube

Or you could go High Tech and buy or build one of these.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iy6OwiuWV7A

Cheers
Pete

---

Because why you can do it yourself they will be all inconsistent so may as well not even do it. Unless you have odd ball cals that you have to fire form or form in forming dies its not worth the effort. I'm most cases the case will be stuffed before then or the price of new brass makes it pointless just get new stuff

Sent from my GT-I9300T using Tapatalk 2

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tussock

Lots of reasons to do it. It is a good idea and it will extend your brass life.

The characteristics of your case will change throughout its life span, but that could be mitigated by annealing.

---

I know that I was meaning there is no half arsed way. Either do it right all timed the same or don't do it all all. Neck tension will be all different from case to case by hand so may as well not bother. . . . . Is easier way to put it

Sent from my GT-I9300T using Tapatalk 2

yeah i agree with tuiman, the methods ive seem dont seem very scientific, which doesnt seem to go hand in hand with the whole point of reloading, to be precise and measured about everything. But it obviously works for people so meh

i was thinking of one of the expensive machines that do it all in a professional manner.
i had a feeling dead eye dick had one. but maybe they just sold the machine once, i dont know.

Just need to know your colours? And control heat and time? Experience

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Maca49

Just need to know your colours? And control heat and time? Experience

---

Your onto it Maca.

Your eye is your best tool, watching the colours run and counting to four still works for me.

Tui_man2
Does your new brasscome with the Neck/Shoulder already annealed?

I would be interested to know how much inconsistency you have experienced or measured using any of the above methods.

Here's another method which is precise, confirmed with Tempilaq.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3Ln5ZdCyz8

And pretty simple too.

Cheers
Pete

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by P38

Your onto it Maca.

Your eye is your best tool, watching the colours run and counting to four still works for me.

Tui_man2
Does your new brasscome with the Neck/Shoulder already annealed?

I would be interested to know how much inconsistency you have experienced or measured using any of the above methods.

Here's another method which is precise, confirmed with Tempilaq.
brass annealing machine.mpg - YouTube

And pretty simple too.

Cheers
Pete

---

Still has error but if not shooting far then it wont matter anyway.

Lapua is as good as it gets an it comes annealed ready to load
Doing it by had is to hit an miss

I have made an are making 4 machines like my one but smaller an nice, i do think it is good to do but have to do it right an all timed the same, an for bigger odd ball cases i have to anneal in the forming stages to work the brass easier

then once all that effort it done i try to keep them good an anneal every 3rd firing to get them all the SAME consistancy.
Found by hand i would have un explained fliers witch LR you dont want.

There are a few machines out there that people would happy pay to do your brass, I would do it but its the sort of thing i would wait till i had a few to make it worth while to do

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tussock

I'm inclined to think that annealing by a slow bake rather than a blowtorch will work better.

Your trying to remove defects, any uneven heat distributions will create new defects in the form of grain size contrasts in your neck and shoulder which will lead to at best, uneven stretch and at worst failure.

---

So you would rather anneal the whole case? That's why you don't need to do it. Or all your brass will be going to the scrap man:rolleyes:

Sent from my GT-I9300T using Tapatalk 2

No annealing slowly is bad. You want to only heat the neck and small surrounding area. The more of the case you heat , the softer the rest of the case will get and you dont want the base getting too soft. If you look at lapua brass and how much they are annealed that would be a good guide.

Tui_man2

I haven't noticed any inconsistancy using the drill method to anneal my brass, But then I dont shoot long range either.

I especially like to anneal my 25-20wcf brass about every 6 or 7 firings as it's getting hard to get new.
The last batch I bought new was Remmington Brass and not annealed, case length varied a bit too and need trimming.

Which type of annealing machine are you building?

I like the simplicity of the last one I posted and for most needs I'm sure will be accurate enough.

I'm going to build one shortly ... not because I need one but just because I can.

Any excuse to spend an hour or two in the machine shop is a good enough excuse for me.

Cheers
Pete

Annealing is the best kept secret in reloading. Wonderful how you can resurrect hard brass. Cant understand why people throw away good brass. Possibly because they are lazy or are scared of the hype surrounding this mysterious art.

A water bath heat, case in,neck out,treat nice straw colour,push over? Annealed, Easy, but I only shoot BP so no real pressure or shock, plenty of heat and corrosion, the bastards still split if I don't

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tussock

You probably dont need to push them over, just let them cool slow.

---

Push them over and you don't burn yourself!

Thats interesting putting them in the oven. havent heard of that before. But how do you keep the water cool?! To me annealing over a 'longer' period is just asking for trouble if you cant keep the bottom cool enough. But i mean , i reloaded some cases this afternoon, annealing was done and cases cooled in 5 minutes ready to continue. The other thing is how do you heat around the case evenly if they are all standing up in a water tray? Also pushing a hot case over into the water, might mean that one side of the case cools faster than the other.

If i remember rightly, the brass has to get to or reach a certain temperature for it to anneal which i think is why people use temperature indicating fluid for this (You can use a similar method to anneal work hardened aluminuim using the soot from an acetylene torch). And you want to do that without annealing the rest of the case. Also if you get the brass too hot, it will be just as bad for case life as over work hardened brass

What would be a reasonable price to pay for an annealing service, per x100 say ? ?

Thoughts anybody. . . .?

You could do it commercially with a variable speed conveyor, even heat source and a spray cooll,is there a business op here?

Courier would make all the money?

its not worth it really, buy a few tools etc and youre sorted forever!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by scoped

its not worth it really, buy a few tools etc and youre sorted forever!

---

Yep that's my thought as well, but there some" uncoordinated "people out there, I know from the questions I get in my bus

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tussock

You need to protect the rest of the case from the heat, in a bath with cooling liquid.

Annealing slowly is fine. Believe it or not, cases anneal at room temperature. Just very very slowly. Work hardening is a process where the metal is deformed, and defects accumulate in its crystal structure. In order for metal to stretch smoothly, it needs a nice, homogenous crystal structure, where each atom can slide past the adjacent atoms unimpeded. The defects from deformation (work) created gaps etc where that impede that smooth slide. These correct themselves over time, as the brass goes back to its preferred structure, but its very slow.

You can speed up that healing process by heating the metal up. This opens up the crystal structure and lets everything relax back to where it wants to be faster. Fast or slow, the end result is the same. No more defects, and soft, homogenous metal. 5 seconds at 500 degrees or 5 minutes at 150 degrees, same result (I made those numbers up but you get the idea).

Because it would be more even, my preference would be slow annealing in an even heat, like an oven. Then there is no hot spot like with a blow torch.

The you just have to keep the lower part of the case cool. For that you can use a water bath.

I have not done it, but it should do a good job.

---

Not sure you are correct on annealing all the case including the web and over a long time. There is a report on this and I will try to locate it again.

Look at this for an analysis about all case annealing. Scroll down the paragraph headed OVER ANNEALING /UNDER ANNEALING.

Sorry forgot to include link

http://www.6mmbr.com/annealing.html

I can appreciate that if you are not an engineer / techy you have not done anealing in tech but really its pretty easy once you have looked at it. I dont think you can get it to wrong, interesting that mil brass is usually (always?) anealed, they even glue often?

Which leads me to, I had a chat to an experienced reloader & shooter over the weekend, he shoots mil now rather than palma so I dnt think he's as closed lipped as others. Anyway, He seemed to think that neck tension was one of the biggest factors in accuracy. Which suggests to me anealing is important, plus consistant wall thickness, and concentricity, which points me at better quality brass. So prep and care in this area would be where to spend the time by the sound of it. He likes Lee kit a lot except for the chamfer tool, buy something better. Thinks the "better" competition stuff is a rip off.

thoughts?

My one is buy the Lee 50th kit and the lyman vld tool...spend the money saved on a better scope or shooting.

I like the idea of running sane pressures so primer pockets aren't ruined, minimally sizing, and annealing after every so many firings to make my expensive brass last forever

However I don't actually do it as it's too much effort compared to emailing Belmont for more

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by gimp

I like the idea of running sane pressures so primer pockets aren't ruined, minimally sizing, and annealing after every so many firings to make my expensive brass last forever

However I don't actually do it as it's too much effort compared to emailing Belmont for more

---

How is it too much effort? Drill, propane torch ,socket/adaptor. 5 seconds for 223.

I bought the Lee and the only thing from it I use is the press and powder thrower. I only use the thrower cause it's easy and the press because I can't afford to upgrade yet.

If doing it again I wouldn't buy a kit. I'd get a good press, a set of good digital scales with trickler and all the other accessories all seperately. Plus a load data manual.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TeRei

How is it too much effort? Drill, propane torch ,socket/adaptor. 5 seconds for 223.

---

I'm hell of lazy at brass prep and after the ~10-12 firings my brass lasts for it's basically cost nothing anyway

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by gimp

I'm hell of lazy at brass prep and after the ~10-12 firings my brass lasts for it's basically cost nothing anyway

---

Like you in most cases its the easier way to be when its getting say get new brass
Only odd ball cases make it really worth while an in the forming stages

Try 577/450 brass at about $10.00 a case if you can find it. 45/70 about $2.00 I hate losing one

I'm paying $2.20 ish each for 6.5x47

So over ~10 firings it's 22c. I guess if I annealed and say, doubled the brass life (total guess with my nice safe pressure load, not damaging case head/primer pocket - which remains to be seen longer term so far but my old load was loosening them up quite a bit in ~5 firings, also only minimally sizing) I could theoretically save ~$660-880 on brass cost over the life of a barrel (guessing at 3000-4000 rounds) which literally almost pays for a new barrel + fitting.

When my current batch of brass gets there maybe I'll give it a go, worst that can happen is that I have to throw out a heap of brass I was going to toss anyway if it does give inconsistent results

A couple of us went through the exercise of pricing it a couple of years ago
Long story short, NZ Shooters in general, are too tight to pay for a automated, repeatable and accurate annealing of brass - at 10c a piece you would have to do 10k pieces to even pay for the gear and gas let alone labour or turn a profit.
Noone works for free - especially not me! :)

I designed and started building a machine about 4 years ago - gave up when I found exactly what I wanted to buy.
2 years later, and I still cant get one off the bloody Sepo...

I would go for paying someone with the equipment and a standard process if it is available.

The hand methods I've read about all look pretty hit and miss to me.

Fuck me, it's just annealing, it's not rocket science to get everything even.

Yes, what's the worst that happens if you don't? You've ruined some already ruined brass. Good job, try harder next time.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by gimp

I like the idea of running sane pressures so primer pockets aren't ruined, minimally sizing, and annealing after every so many firings to make my expensive brass last forever

However I don't actually do it as it's too much effort compared to emailing Belmont for more

---

If you have brass you cant be bothered reloading send unwanted 303, 308, 7.62x39 and 54R my way...all gratefully excepted by the poorish...ie me.

;]

PS primers seem to be getting endangered.... :(

regards

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by steven

If you have brass you cant be bothered reloading send unwanted 303, 308, 7.62x39 and 54R my way...all gratefully excepted by the poorish...ie me.

;]

PS primers seem to be getting endangered.... :(

regards

---

Sorry, I don't own terrible calibres.