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Annealed some 3-4x fired 284 brass. 6.5 - 7 sec in single flame gas torch, all cases on next firing came out with split necks ? Too much heat ? Or not enough ? Attachment 78335
Cases not annealed no cracks or splits.
Have annealed plenty of other brass using something around 6 - 7 sec in flame & have not seen thus before ?
Wot ya reckon ?
Are the split cases, and the ones that were ok from the same maker, fired the same number of times ?
If so, then logic says the difference is the annealing.
Could just be a bad batch of brass, I suppose.
I tend to anneal the same way, after 4-5 reloads as well.
No split cases ( yet)
Do you let them cool normally or quench? Changes in crystal size determines flexibility, slow cooling allows for large crystals which are brittle. My guess is too much heat and too slow cooling. When I used to do it the cases sat in a trough of water about half way up the case after heating to dull red they were tipped over.
I dont anneal anymore dont push anything that hard anymore.
If you are heating until they glowing red you are overheating. Only heat until the bluish tint forms, no more.
Brass all same - Hornady & all 3-4x fired.
Heat just long enough to see the blush & then dump onto large stainless bench to cool.
I’m guessing the split necks means I over cooked ?
It's very hard to give advise.
If you read the amp anealing site you will see colour or time means bugger all as different brass gives different results. The only sure way would be if someone is doing the exact same brass with the same thickness and brand, and has had it tested. But even still you won't get the same heat source.
If I'm having a stab in the dark, usually too much is soft and the brass can fold up when sized. No annealing you get split necks.
Actually you could be ruining them. I can get 6 fires from Hornady 7 REM mag with no splits or bad accuracy, without annealing.
I was in this boat.... 6 firings then buy more brass vs amp. I went amp but only because I had to neck down and figured the extra stress might be worth it, also I wanted very consistent accuracey from this particular case. Even still it's hard to justify. If I just had regular cases I wouldn't own a amp, I'd buy brass.
Have you turned them.... If so how thick are they?
Brass is all Hornady, no not neck turned
Some batches of brass are just rubbish.
I have some FC .223 2013 stuff that would split after 2 firings even after annealing. Other Fed .223 brass I got 10 firings out of.
If you don't know what you are doing you are likely to ruin more brass than you improve. It has to be heated to only 350 C (and water quenched) the only way to gauge that is with a heat sensitive crayon. Any higher and it is stuffed too soft to be of any use. There are guys with AMP machines who will do this for you. I use Nik in Wellington who advertises on Trademe very professional.
Interesting, the top case has a bright ring at the neck shoulder junction like it was turned, or a thickness was cut from there. (But obviously not)Quote:
Originally Posted by chainsaw
The others arnt just a straight split but a split in a ring also. I thought maybe the cases were turned real thin.
If I had a pilot to do them in the amp I would for you.
Or you buy the $20 pilot and send it all to me and I will do them. Maybe pm me if interested.
Annealed plenty of brass with no issues previously - the question I’m raising is could the split necks result from annealing , either over or under cooked. My research agrees with comments above, over cooked should result in soft necks rather than brittle cracked. But I’m keen to learn from any other inputs or experiences.
Maybe a dud batch like others said. Or what else could it be....
What's your sizing method... The horizontal crack looks to all be in the same place....
Sizing is Redding Neck die & to bump shoulder I use Redding body die. Thanks @bully I’ll pm u about the amp option. Cheers
No quick quenching. Quick quenching is only for hardening or tempering. Annealing is for softening the brass.
The case neck will either way cool relatively quickly. Brass is a good heat conductor so the heat escapes into the body of the case.
If you only heat the neck, the subsequent cooling of the neck will be too quick, and effectively it will become a neck hardening procedure, not an annealing procedure. So heat up both neck and shoulder.
The Art and Science of Annealing
Couple of relavant quotes from the above articel
"Brass, on the other hand, cannot be made harder by heating it--ever. Brass is always made softer by heating."
"Unlike steel, which will be made harder when it is cooled rapidly, brass is virtually unaffected when it is rapidly cooled. Annealing brass and suddenly quenching it in water will have no measurable effect on the brass"
Bullshit!Quote:
Originally Posted by Cordite
cheers for the link, some good reading . . . . RQuote:
Originally Posted by sneeze
Thanks for all the inputs. I see there are a lot of different ideas out there.
From all the reading ive done the data on brass annealing and quick or slow cooling supports the post from @sneeze above. Rapid cooling is not effective. And that’s been basis of my approach & set up to date.
I put out the original post and photo to seek advice and do so without any bias on my part.
I think i can rule out the “over cooked” scenario I’m my split necks.
Do you have any un annealed cases left? May have been a coincidence?Quote:
Originally Posted by chainsaw
