Using new RCBS single stage summit press and getting roughly 3-6thou case neck run out after re sizing..any idea why ?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Printable View
Using new RCBS single stage summit press and getting roughly 3-6thou case neck run out after re sizing..any idea why ?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Give the die a little bit of float using an o-ring. The Lee lock rings are good for this. Give the bushing a little bit of float by not screwing the plug down on top of it hard. Anneal and neck turn the brass.
They seem to work well with custom tight necked chambers. A bit hit and miss on factory chambers sometimes. FL dies don't do this.
Is the run out there before sizing?
3-6 thou I wouldn’t worry about it if the loads are accurate
Is the bush able to move slightly in the die so it can center on the neck?
If there is more than 5 thou difference between your fired case neck outside diameter and the sized case then Redding suggest you use more than one bushing.
I had this same issue when sizing for a 6.5x55, fired were .299" and sized are .291 and I experienced runout. Once I sized in two steps the runout dropped to around. 001".
Do you neck turn or not? What is the inside neck run out?
Will suss some lee lock rings thanks for that! Its for 300norma magQuote:
Originally Posted by Pommy
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Havnt actually measured ID.. nah maybe i should be neck turning thoQuote:
Originally Posted by Friwi
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Ill do some measuring. Thanks for that!Quote:
Originally Posted by Tech
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
New norma brass is about 1-2thous. Once fire formed 0-1 thou!Quote:
Originally Posted by chainsaw
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Another thing you can do is half seat the bullet then raise the ram and turn the case 180deg then finish the seating.
Was getting similar result with my type s die, 3-4 thou was common and that is neck turned and then annealed.My competition redding die was no better. Tried a redding FL die and that was more often in the 1-2 thou range and surprisingly running an expander mandrel through after sizing had no effect on runout
Cheap & cheerful way is to buy a, Lee collect neck sizing die, and even after FLR use the lee die & turn the case 180degrees, give it a double tape. Works well for me.
Might pay to check neck thickness variation too. You may have a couple of thou here that's showing up as runout. Turning necks will clean this up.
I wouldn't bother with neck turning. It's just a pain in the butt for hunting rifles which usually have about .006"- .008" neck clearance. Also, I doubt if you'll see much of an improvement in accuracy between .001"- .005" run out. If you do it will be minimal and make no difference at most hunting distances. Different for bench rest and long distance rifles where every fraction of accuracy is desirable.
With the Redding bushing dies you should be backing off the adjustment stem about a third of a turn so that the bushing has some float
I agree...my chambers are all tight requiring neck turned brass, and Redding S type dies with loose bushings just can't and never produced zero runout on the necks.......FLS first and then if you have too deal to the neck size. I have seen a Hornady FLS die with standard expander button produce excellent zero runout every time and that is on Bertram brass with up to 0.001" neck wall variation so it is not a dream to have zero runout.....!Quote:
Originally Posted by Pommy
To measure neck runout is very difficult as well so be sure you actually have a neck that is not concentric with the body as distortion of the body can produce a false negative. Not sure how you are measuring runout but it is imperative the body of the case is running true on bearings of your gauge by indicating on the radial line of support first before the neck. Better still is to machine a mandrel on the lathe and press your cases onto it......you will soon see if you have runout then.
@Waimauku, could I ask please if you ever found a way to get improved runout from either your Competition or FL Bushing dies?Quote:
Originally Posted by Waimauku
Although the design of the competition dies is intended to remove misalignment introduced by the press, I have found this not to be the case, and traced unexpected runout back to the shell holder. Perhaps the case-to-sleeve fit is poor?
Has anyone considered running their chamber reamer into the sleeve?
I have 3 sets of Redding comp dies. The only set that gives zero runout is my 6.5AI. The sleeves on this were opened out using the chambering reamer.Quote:
Originally Posted by Puffin
With the others, have tried all sorts - locking the bushings down, floating, die screwed down onto an O ring, all to no avail.
The sleeves are just not doing a great job of supporting the cases.
I recently upgraded my shell holders to Redding E-Z (very well made) as well and still the same result.
I even bought an expensive Whidden FL Bushing die. Beautiful die with no improvement to the runout.
The issue with the Redding Comp dies is irrespective of neck turning or not.
The Redding Body die is terrible for runout, it does not support the neck whilst sizing.
My press have minimal slop but I'm not sure whether slop in the press, unless massive, will give an issue.
In the last year I changed my technique and now get close to zero runout. Anneal after every firing, FLS with Forster die with expander removed, expand with 21st Century expander. 0 - 1 thou runout achieved.
The other die which gives me zero runout is a Wilson inline which was bought as a blank and reamed with the chambering reamer.
The only issue with dies reamed with chambering reamers is the cases can be tight in them after a firing but it's not an issue for me as I FLS.
Generally I have found that if there is runout in the case introduced during the sizing the seating dies will not correct it.
The humble Lee Collet as pointed out gives very good results.
I had considered whether the bushing/die tolerance was responsible,but I don't know that for a fact.The FL die and then running the cases through the expander die from my sinclair neck turner where an improvement so have stayed with that sinceQuote:
Originally Posted by Puffin
I have a mate using the Lee collet die who rates it as Zimmer has mentioned
I have gone back to a F/L Forster die and open up with Sinclair mandrel.
Both my redding dies with bushings ,comp & type s were the same.Quote:
Originally Posted by Puffin
I have continued with the redding fl and instead of the 3-4 thou it's now more like 1.5.
Haven't looked at bushing dies since.
Separate expander die for something like 2 thou neck tension and doesn't appear to effect runout at all.
I have seen this with Redding dies so many time I have lost count
FL resize without the expander
Then expand the neck with the expander pushing DOWN into the brass from above
The taper on the expander suits this direction and no runout in the brass is generated
So you expand the case mouth/ pop primer out after FL resizing as a seperate pass
Same experience almost. Also same with a Whidden FLS bushing die which in a moment of weakness I purchased (expensive and disappointing). The worst runout "inducer" are Redding body dies. They provide no support for the neck whilst sizing and once out of wack a neck die won't straighten them. The best are Lee Collet dies.Quote:
Originally Posted by Waimauku
The only Redding sleave type dies where I get zero to maybe <1 thou run out is my Swede Ackley. The sleaves in the dies are standard 6.5x55 SM sleaves reamed to the Ackley chambering with the rifle's reamer.
A couple of years ago I changed my reloading methodology and went away from bushing dies (except my hot Swede) and replaced my Redding stuff with Forster FLSing dies. The Forster dies are used without the expander and then I expand using 21st Century expander mandrels. They too are expensive but over a period of time I have built up a selection for each of my calibres in 1/2 thou steps. I have very good control over neck tension and no run out to speak of.
I usually seat using a Wilson inline seater. Best performing of those is my 308 FTR rifle seating die. I purchased a Wilson blank and had it chambered at the same time my rifle was chambered.
Shit, just saw this is an old thread and I have repeated myself. Verbal diarrhea methinks
At least it was a repeat not a contradiction.
easy fix is stop measuring LOL.