Great group those first three. How many shots would it take on average before fouling / leading makes accuracy drop off ?Quote:
Originally Posted by akaroa1
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Great group those first three. How many shots would it take on average before fouling / leading makes accuracy drop off ?Quote:
Originally Posted by akaroa1
With Alox only 3 to 5 roundsQuote:
Originally Posted by Moa Hunter
But I might start powder coating the bullets it likes most
Why can we shoot 22's for years without years and not have accuracy problems, both subs and supers ?Quote:
Originally Posted by akaroa1
Can soft 20 - 1 or 30 - 1 bullets be powdercoated ?
Quite grunty that 38/55
I'm surprised, I don't use alox rather beeswax lard mix but have fired 25 straight without aparrent loss of accuracy. Got the same result with some if Robs 250 grain flat base bullets with his trademark red lube. Speed is a shade over 1450 fps. Maybe a greased card wad to protect the base may helpQuote:
Originally Posted by akaroa1
Yes it's a work in progress situation with that rifleQuote:
Originally Posted by Marty Henry
It's now in pieces pending me making a new properly fitted firing pin
But when its all back together I will keep experimenting to find a load and bullet lube that is more sustainable
At least I know it is sub moa for at least the first hand full of shots
Powder coating is an obvious next thing to try
I use Black Widow 405 grain powder coated bullets in my 1885 45-70 and there are no issues with fouling
But to be fair it's a peep tang sighted hunting rifle and hard to realistically tell whats happening after the shoulder is softened up
Whereas the Stevens 44 1/2 38-55 was a proper target rifle in its day and deserves to be sorted to see what its capable of
I have a Saeco #311 bullet mold due to arrive any time now
It's a 308 cal 165 grain bore rider gas check bullet
These will be my test bullets for powder coating
I'm hoping that if i cast them medium hard, powder coat and size / crimp on the gas check that these should be a great cheap effective bullet in my 30-30 single shots
And maybe with the powder coating I can leave them reasonably soft and they will be ideal for the 30-30 out to 200m which is about the limit of what that caliber should realistically be used at
Is your lube sticky / tacky on the bullets or more like the waxy stuff on 22 ammo ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Marty Henry
Hi Moa, The lube is quite hard, when I first started selling bullets I used Lyman's Alox based standard lube and then the Orange oneQuote:
Originally Posted by Moa Hunter
but the bullets would stick together when shipped to customers in the summer,
The Lube I use now is much harder and the bullets rarely stick to each other even in hot weather
Only problem is that it has to be at about 42 degrees C to go through the Lube Sizer
Pan lubing may work but I have not tried that.
The mix 3 beeswax 1 lard is good to handle it's slightly more tacky but much easier to apply and appears to be more slippery than straight beeswax. I pan lube and cut out when cold using a flared cut off case.Quote:
Originally Posted by Moa Hunter
This with smokeless or BP ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Marty Henry
Saeco #311 mould arrived so I just had to cast a few
Very nice mould
And once up to heat it turns out a very nice bullet with care
Not so much a bore rider but a tapered shoulder
Truncated cone nose
Will learn to powder coat in these ones
And have to make a gas check seating die now for the lube sizer
Attachment 206071
Attachment 206072
Both, im an equal opportunities employer😁 The idea of powder coating intrigues me but I've never had any coated projectiles to play with. Fundamentally it seems to me that it shouldn't work, it's a coat of paint over the bullet if that paint contained Teflon maybe but then how do you get it to stick? Obviously I'm missing something because enough people do use it successfully and make wonderfully colourful bullets. Mine are just plain silver grey but smell a little like bbq especially the mine where I fill the cavity.Quote:
Originally Posted by akaroa1
I love my lipstick 45-70s
They do work and the store brought ones are done for the 1885 45-70 because at full noise I'm unlikely to fire big numbers
But I'm looking at coating the 30-30 bullets because more likely to be higher volume use
And now that I have measured the cast bullets ( and having read a bit on line ) I find that this bullet can be sized down for use in 30 cal and basically left as is with just a light crimp on the gas check for use in the 303
So having a different powder coat colour for each would be nice
Attachment 206075
That pc stuff is unbelievably sticky. First bulletsQuote:
Originally Posted by Marty Henry
I baked I didn't use a silicone surface. Brand new Teflon pan ruined by two bullets that ripped the lining off.
I've even recoated hi-tech bullets and it sticks fine
Yes powder coat is not just paint
Very tough
I melted down a few of the powder coated black widows with some other old bullets and the red powder coat empty skins floated to the top of the pot
They didn't burn
They mostly stayed intact
So that explains why the can cope with all that pressure and friction
.309 and .311 PC gas check cast bullets Attachment 206551
I found the checks too tricky to seat afterwards so I just stick em on at initial sizing. I do dust the pc off with a bit of paper towel as I want the bases as flat as possible. Doesn't look totally perfect but they fly well and true
Why do both? GC and PC?Quote:
Originally Posted by T.FOYE
The Gas Check reinforces the base when using high velocity loads also there is an improvement in accuracy when gas checking a bulletQuote:
Originally Posted by Jhon
lhat is designed for them, and the bullets can be made from softer lead for expansion, Powder coating is modern Paper Patching.
Thanks @shooternz At last I understand powder coating and how it works.I'm now going to give up the fiddling with cut bits of paper for that goes on for a few guns.Quote:
Originally Posted by shooternz
@Marty Henry do you want me to send you some .309 and/ or .311 to try ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Marty Henry
Guaranteed not to wreck your barrels
I have just found a load that my 500 3" BPE is happy with. 450 grain PC bullets 3 shots going into a raged single hole at 50m
@akaroa1 Some 309 would be brilliant thanks you should have my address off the snider package
They seat better I find and they also seem to keep the bore cleaner at high speed. But I don't reckon the blast melts the bases. Not from the unchecked bullets I've recovered from the dirt anyway.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jhon
I have put a lot of very big lumps of PC lead down range last week
Finally found what my 500 3" BPE likes
Nitro for black load
450 grain PC bullets sized .510
Made a new front globe sight for the rifle
Shoots 25mm groups at 50m
So loaded up a few to fire a couple every now and then to make sure it will work consists
Then it can go hunting
500 3" with 308 on left and 300wsm on rightAttachment 207149
More powder coated cast lead success stories
This group from my Baikal 30-30 self build carbine
Bullets are Saeco #311 mould
165 grain Powder Coated Gas Check
Sized .309
No fancy load work yet
Just getting them down range to see if they are accurate enough to hit a deer at 200m
The picture speaks for itself
Attachment 207354
What velocity are they going ? Great groupQuote:
Originally Posted by akaroa1
I didn't put them through the chronographQuote:
Originally Posted by Moa Hunter
The load was straight Nick Harvey's reloading book and half way between the starting and max loads
So 10% more to get to max loads
If the group is still good it will still only be under 1900 fps because barrel is only 14 1/2"
I was guessing they would be 1600 ish being cast. 1900 is plenty fastQuote:
Originally Posted by akaroa1
It's shooting better than a marlin lever 3030 I was messing about with once (open sights but still).
It's shooting better than a lot of rifles worth 10 times as muchQuote:
Originally Posted by T.FOYE
It's a bitser
Baikal shotgun
16" 30-06 barrel off forum
Suppressor off forum
Very cheap scope off forum
Cheap rings off forum
Weaver base retail $30 ! Is the only new thing in it
Chamber reamer self made
Dies and brass off forum
New old stock second hand bullet mould is a keeper
I just need to chronograph a hotter load and see if it still groups
Zero at 100m
Check the drop at 200m
Done
No speed limit on powder coated gas checked bullets other than running out of case capacityQuote:
Originally Posted by Moa Hunter
I ran my new MP 415gn hollowpoint (pentagonal cone shape) across the radar yesterday. These had cc1 200 primers, 'cost effective' winchester brass (10th cycle), N130 VV powder. Carefully waiting 4min between shots.
Note how the radar starts logging irregular velocity after 65m. This is a fat arse bullet so i reckon anyone trying to find a bc beyond this with a smaller cal / boat tail etc is kinda wasting time.
I dunno if G1 is best to represent the hollowpoint keith designs but it has spat out .26 as the average BC for this shape when powdercoated.
I did this batch using the hornady bell mouther and then Lee M die to crimp them. As you can see it makes for good ES and SD (for what thats worth in 45-70 :D )
That coating didn't want to come off even when struck by another bullet... but as you can see the points broke up into segments. I wouldn't use these on animals i intend to eat.
Attachment 208211
Attachment 208212
Attachment 208213
Attachment 208217
Fairly good groups at 100m. It's pretty hold sensitive being such a light rifle but it's fine for hunting out to 200m imo
I cast 150 22 HORNET 45 grain bullets today and powder coated them
Gas checked and sized a couple to measure
The .224 sizer is exactly to size and the bullets are now 46.5 grains
A very kind forum member gave @Tentman and I two moulds, gas checks and .224 and .225 sizers
I feel a bit of a K hornet shooting comp coming on ( but only for rifles over 100 years old )
Attachment 211551
Learned one important thing today. 45-70 doesn't require you to spend all that time with the deburr tool. I got my best groups at 100y with un-DB'd ammo. I'd wanted to try this as I wondered if my variation in deburring technique was resulting in a different amount of crimp. It does, but it's not much. But I'm lazy az and less steps is a good thing.
Attachment 213335
Nice Hornets, what alloy are you making them out of?Quote:
Originally Posted by akaroa1
The Hornet bullets were cast pure soft because you can with PCQuote:
Originally Posted by 300CALMAN
But didn't shoot well in the vintage hornet I tried them in
I have two other vintage Hornets to test them in yet and have given some to mates to test as well
I will cast and PC some harder alloy of the same bullet and test those also
Soft lead in the Hornet isn't so important anyway
I was just playing with fully soft because it's been a great options in my vintage big bore rifles
nice group n good speeds . . . can i ask what powder your using ?Quote:
Originally Posted by akaroa1
sorry if this has been asked somewhere else . . what kind of increase in diamater would you expect on a just cast .309 bullet with powder coating ?
I'm consistently getting a 1 thou coating so 2 thou biggerQuote:
Originally Posted by rossi.45
But I size to fit the gas checks
Or could for gas checks and coat afterwards
So plenty of diameter options for old rifles and worn bores
DIY BRINELL HARDNESS TESTER. ( BHN )
Just found this thread. As mentioned earlier there are a few ways to do this.
Lee test kit. I haven't used this but reports suggest it works fine but a but fiddly to work with.
Pencil test. I have only just seen this. For a quick guide seems sensible but there is a problem. It is a "scratch" test not a true "pressure" or "deformation" test which is what the brinell test is. Scratch is a resistance to wear, not pressure. They are different physical properties.
I don't have a great need as only cast occasionally. So I went down a different track being a tight arse didn't help and into DIY to. lol. I built one and its pretty easy and I've compared it to pure lead seems very accurate. All you need is:
Reloading press.
Some weights.
A PC to use a excel spread sheet.
A small amount of ingenuity.
Some weights. (I use old bar bell training weights)
A PC or mobile app to use an excel spread sheet.
A small amount of ingenuity to make the platform. My platform is a little different to the one on the link. The lead sits on the ram platform and the ball is held above.
Small ball bearing. Say, about 4 to 5mm
Vernier caliper to measure the "dent"
Perhaps a magnifying glass to help with accurate measurements.
Here is the link I got the info from. Its easy to follow and I will upload the excel spread sheet.
https://mountainmolds.com/lyman-bhn-tester/
