Hard CCI Primers

Morning all.

I'm a NOOB to reloading but have been getting good results out of my sako .270 with my developed hand loads. However out of the 60 or so rounds Iv'e loaded and fired I've had two hard primers that have failed to fire - CCI large rifle primers.

Once was on an animal that walked off having heard the "click" the other was on a farm whilst doing some load development. The bullet on farm I continued to reset the firing pin, by lifting the bolt handle and firing the round again whilst still in chamber. About several attempts and a strong indent in the primer and it still didn't discharge.

Both "miss-fires" were inspected back at home and deconstructed to ensure the load was correct etc - I could see no errors in the reloading process I had undertaken.

In previous factory ammo I had never ever experienced this - is it a reoladers issue when handloading, CCI primers are hard or am I doing something wrong?

A sequence you may like to consider that should identify the cause.
Run a straight edge across the case head is the primer below or flush with the case. Seating too deep can cause it. More a case fault as the pockets too deep.
Deconstruct the round, deprime it carefully inspect the primer does it look ok. Is the anvil missing if it is it may go off when deprimed so wear ear muffs
Wrap it in paper loosely and drop it in a fire outside did it explode. Compound was ok
Rethink your loading process is there any way oil or sizing lube could have gotton onto the primer as that certainly desenstises them.

Over re-sizing cases.

Hi, a few things to check, have you dismantled and checked the bolt is clean and in good condition? Are the primer pockets clean and primers seated properly, if not fully seated the firing pin may not strike the anvil hard enough to fire. I uniform my primer pockets with a Sinclair uniformer and when the primers are seated they are a few thou below the case head and I've never had a missfire with any brand of primer. Another thing to check is if your sizing die is correctly set to give the correct head space, Erik Cortina has a good video on YouTube on setting up your full length sizing die for correct head space. I don't have the shoulder comparator for my calipers so it takes a bit more trial and error to get it to 2 thou bump. If you still have miss fires it may be faulty primers, you could also get a gunsmith to check your firing pin.

I keep my rifle pretty clean and fully dissassemble the bolt after ever couple of trips. I'll look into the primer pocket side of things, as I clean these pretty well - the fact that it has only been two rounds has me perplexed. If it was doing something that wrong I thoiugh it would be more rounds. Still I've taken the things on board and I'll dig down deeper into it.

Over sized or pushed the shoulder to far back.

Can you measure the headspacr on a fired case and compare it to the same measurement on the cases that did not fire?

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Originally Posted by Jaco Goosen

Over sized or pushed the shoulder to far back.

Can you measure the headspacr on a fired case and compare it to the same measurement on the cases that did not fire?

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This ^^^^
I had a CCI Primer misfire a while back and posted about it ( link below )
https://www.nzhuntingandshooting.co....primers-98508/

Jaco was one of the respondents who correctly diagnosed the cause. A simple adjustment of my FL Die resolved the matter.
I think CCI Primers have harder metal in the cups than other brands which makes correct headspacing all the more essential for reliable ignition.

Had a read of that post - makes sense thank you

Quote:

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Originally Posted by stumpys

.The bullet on farm I continued to reset the firing pin, by lifting the bolt handle and firing the round again whilst still in chamber. About several attempts and a strong indent in the primer and it still didn't discharge.
..

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Be very careful with mis-fires- you could actually be lined up for a very delayed hang-fire and opening the bolt on that can be disastrous.

With NRA shooting, the rule is WAIT 30 secs before opening the bolt on a mis-fire, and even then, with the port facing down. Personally I'd feel safe after 5 secs but this rule is obviously based on (bad) real world events..

CCI were renowned for harder cups, and recommended for things like certain russian/chinese semi's where the firing pin floated in the bolt group and were known to pop the odd round off without the trigger being activated in semi auto mode. Probably not what happened here, but the harder cup thing just makes it much more apparent if there is another issue at play or a mechanical reason for a lighter primer strike. A good diagnosis tool, if you will...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 6x47

Be very careful with mis-fires- you could actually be lined up for a very delayed hang-fire and opening the bolt on that can be disastrous.

With NRA shooting, the rule is WAIT 30 secs before opening the bolt on a mis-fire, and even then, with the port facing down. Personally I'd feel safe after 5 secs but this rule is obviously based on (bad) real world events..

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Yep that's a valid point. Some ammo such as old cruddy military surplus can be even more delayed, click, yawn, make a coffee, scratch the nuts, WTF? Range rules are generally minimum 30sec delay before opening the bolt and safety glasses etc but with ex-military rifles I tend to add a bit unless the shooter knows it's new known reloads or modern sporting ammo (in which case it's usually in my experience the bolt not picking the round up from the mag or the mag being empty).

I let pressure of my bolts when not in use as had issues with CCI small rifle primers early on...since releasing bolt spring pressure in storage the issue has never happened again.USUALLY only partial length resize so the other issue wont be in play for me.

I nwould tend to be suspicious whether you seated primer correctly. Have used thousands of CCi primers amongst others in 223 and 308. The few ( about 5 ) that have failed I put down to operator error/ bad luck. Fail to fire pimers I tend to look at the rifle and/or reloading procedure. Same as pierced primers. There was a thread about Ginex SR primers a short while ago, have used 500 approx. of these now without a problem, I think the OP may have had one.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bert 71

Hi, a few things to check, have you dismantled and checked the bolt is clean and in good condition? Are the primer pockets clean and primers seated properly, if not fully seated the firing pin may not strike the anvil hard enough to fire. I uniform my primer pockets with a Sinclair uniformer and when the primers are seated they are a few thou below the case head and I've never had a missfire with any brand of primer. Another thing to check is if your sizing die is correctly set to give the correct head space, Erik Cortina has a good video on YouTube on setting up your full length sizing die for correct head space. I don't have the shoulder comparator for my calipers so it takes a bit more trial and error to get it to 2 thou bump. If you still have miss fires it may be faulty primers, you could also get a gunsmith to check your firing pin.

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Deffinately this. A leaf is all it takes to get in there and cause issues with the firing pin. Tape up an alan key and wedge open your bolt assembly. Give the firing pin a bit of a clean. Might be all you need to do

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Marty Henry

A sequence you may like to consider that should identify the cause.
Run a straight edge across the case head is the primer below or flush with the case. Seating too deep can cause it. More a case fault as the pockets too deep.

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Along those same lines, what are you using to seat the primers? Are you consistent with seating every primer? I would take those cases that had failure to fire issues and reprime for a quick test to see if it is the case or the primer.
Cheers

Time to put this photo up again then. It was in the other post referenced but I think its worth redoing. As an aside the old lift the bolt and recock the rifle trick doesnt work in a lot of situation if you have too much headspace going on (doesnt need to be a lot, just zealous use of the press.)
Take that naughty primer that "failed" and set it off with a hammer or squeeze it in a vice it will 99 times out of 100 go bang.
In all the fail to fires I have ever had its never been a dud primer.

A pic of a cartridge that went bang outside the chamber.

Attachment 243751