Ideas for an unconventional crimping system

I have recently started reloading for a stunning wee antique rifle in 380 rook
This uses a 38spl case trimmed to 22mm
Also uses a heeled bullet (the same as what a 22lr uses) just a .374 125gn version (think of it as a scaled up 22lr)
The bullet requires crimping for reliable storage and transport

The issue is with a healed bullet the actual projetile is the same diameter as the outside of the case (a conventional round the projectile is the size as the inside of the case)

This means a conventional crimp die won’t work as it will hit the projectile before it gets near the case mouth

A lee collet die might work but the issue is they don’t make the collet crimp die in any calibre close enough to use as is or infact modify a die from

So im looking for suggestions on a way to put a light to medium crimp on these rounds remember that the projectile must be free to pass through till it reaches the case mouth then close to crimp

I did think of a terminal crimping tool but this would be very tedious lol

Any ideas?
Attachment 260330

Pipe cutter??? It works on .45/70 easy enough.

Pat's 380 Rook combination bullet mould and reloading tool will give you inspiration
It has a very cool crimper on it that would be easy to duplicate

I think the other two posts have already solved the issue, but for what it's worth, before I scrolled down, I was picturing the three piece holder from a bullet puller being supported from below and above at the appropriate height by a sleeve around the case, then pushing a second sleeve down over the pieces in such a way that they constrict inward (A little bit like an adjustable apeture).

Or you could take a leaf of the old German target shooters book and just hand seat without a crimp. It depends on whether you just want to use the rifle on the range or not. You might need to fiddle to get a bit of neck tension.
GPM.

I had a 380 rook which interchanges with the 38 long colt.Lee make a crimp die so ordered one from Reloaders but sold the rifle before they turned up.I also read on an American forum that the 40 S&W crimp die would work.Again I tried to order one and advertised on this forum looking for one with no luck.

https://www.reloaders.co.nz/shop/Rel...olt+90276.html

From: Handloading for British Rook Rifles by Collin Greenwood, Handloader's Digest 1997.

380 Long

"This cartridge is an extended-case version of the British 380 revolver round. Colt took both rounds as his 38 Short and Long Colt cartridges, and early 38 Long Colts are identical with the 380 Long rook rifle except that, in the specimens we have measured, the Colt case is 1.2 inches in length against the .96-inch of the 380 Long. Overall cartridge length is the same. The bullet was outside lubricated, which means that its diameter is the same as that of the cartridge case and a reduced diameter heel allows it to fit into the case mouth. Colt later changed their cartridge to use inside lubricated bullets of nominal .358-inch diameter, but the rook rifle cartridge continued to use its heeled bullet, which is of .376-inch diameter for the nominal .380-inch bore of the rifle.

If you've got access to a lathe it's quite an easy job to make a 2 piece tool for this, I've done similar but not for reloading. I don't have a workshop now but happy to send a drawing if that would help.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by grandpamac

Or you could take a leaf of the old German target shooters book and just hand seat without a crimp. It depends on whether you just want to use the rifle on the range or not. You might need to fiddle to get a bit of neck tension.
GPM.

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This is how I normally load all my ammo for all my bigger stuff 45-90 and the likes but it won’t work for this well not in large quantities anyway
I can load 5 rounds like that and go to the range
But I need a way to load a couple of hundred and not have them dismantling in the box
There’s less than 3mm of bullet in the case so they fall out extremely easily if not crimped

Go to Mitre 10 and buy the cheap little red pipe cutters. File the wheel so its blunt. (square) Then roll the cartridge around at the right spot, adjusting the tension as you need to as you go and and press a crimp into where the groove is on the bullet.


I use it for putting crimps underneath the bullet, like how factory .44/40 ammo comes, but it will work for crimping into the groove on your bullets.


Photo below shows my cartridges crimped under the bullet on right, and the little pipe cutter on the target photo.

(I should have patented this, it works so well.)


<a href="https://ibb.co/ZLPpHT5"><img src="https://i.ibb.co/FxMLs72/IMG-5702.jpg" alt="IMG-5702" border="0"></a>

<a href="https://ibb.co/rc2trw5"><img src="https://i.ibb.co/F04WTD8/IMG-5708.jpg" alt="IMG-5708" border="0"></a>

set of boltcutters, bore out the correct diameter centred on the closed jaws to make them crimpers, weld a piece of overbore pipe to one side so that they crimp at the right height off a flat surface every time or better yet, clamp them in a jig so you only need to open and close one handle to crimp

Cheap chinese boltcutter set at Bunnings say 70 bucks?

Edit, actually 80
https://www.bunnings.co.nz/trojan-60...utter_p0191062

All sorts of good ideas here, a couple of taps with a blunt dot punch might work too.
Also if you can get a few different brand .357 mag cases, trimmed to 22mm and measure them, you might find the internal taper on some will give you a tighter fit at that length than .38's. Noticed this when deep seating .357 air rifle pellets into .357 cases. (!)

Along same lines as @308 suggestion. T simple pair of pliers have a semi round grippy bit before cutters.wonder of you cut/ground a set down till only thin bit left you could have two curved jaws say 2mm thick than punch inwards...a gentle squeeze,half turn and do other two sides and no more movement perhaps.my understanding is you want firm grip on projectiles and minimal working of your brass,was thinking side cutters themselves but would be to fiddly to get it even,then saw the bigger pliers with grippy hole closer to pivot...which also makes me thing of the adjustable pliers...

Electritions crimp pliers might be worth trying.

https://www.bunnings.com.au/supatool...inals_p6010367

Issue solved
By a good friend who just decided to copy the lee factory crimp die
And make a custom 380 rook one

Very heavy crimp in photo but all adjustable
Attachment 260768

I was going to say.

I've got a full LEE 38 super die set. Which you may have been able to use the crimp die ?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rock river arms hunter

I was going to say.

I've got a full LEE 38 super die set. Which you may have been able to use the crimp die ?

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That's a taper crimp die. It'd crush the bullet before it got close to the case. Heeled bullets can't be used in taper crimps.

A (cringy?) crimp from the history books.

Attachment 260776

They were crimped like that into an similar indent in the bullet. Not cringy. .303's rule.