Leaver action black magic/ dark arts

Ive started my first ever foray into loading for my fathers 30/30 marlin leaver action, going to be honest I sort of like it and I can see the functionality of it……and that’s about it, the rest is challenging, he is after some leverevolotion but it’s in the wrong island. He purchased a stack of 170gr nosler partition projectiles

I’m unsure just how much crimp is best? Also using a powder that is readily available, ive a bit of 2206h 2208 BM1 h4831 and a small amount of h335. I did a test load tonight on a 2206h recipe and man slightly disappointing but im taking that down to running in a new barrel. But again that could also be poor crimp application?

Are there any good powders readily available, preferably in the adi range for the 170gr range

And any other tips greatly appreciated

Thanks

AR2206h, 2208 and leverevolution all work in the 30-30, I'vebeen using LVR recently but once the bottle is empty I'll just go back to 2208.
My barrel is 8 inches shorter than use for most of the available data, I use the velocity of factory ammo in my rifle as a benchmark for working up a load.
I seat to the cannelure and crimp just enough to prevent the projectile moving deeper into the case.

You might find a round nose pill better in the marlin, from memory the partition is pointed ?
Do you have a factory load that shoots well ? I have only loaded for 1 lever a marlin 336 30/30, it shot well with Hornady Whitetail 150gn so I basically emulated that with sierra 150gn rn projectiles seated to same ogive length with a little crimp to stop them being pushed into the case when pushed into the mag.
A lot of folk say levers are only MOA or just over MOA but I can tell you mine was well under MOA 3 shot clover leaf groups where the norm, it's no different to loading for any other rifle find a good stable velocity node then twiddle seating depth for accuracy.

Partitions would generally be considered too pointy to be going in a tube magazine lever action.

Seated to recommended OAL, i appreciate that its not crimped in the cannelure, can you neck size with a lever? Does the mechanism allow for seating longer to adjust for bullet jump?

It it a brand new rifle, i have 3x boxs of 170gr projectiles
Attachment 205545

Seat them deeper
Attachment 205546

Greetings @Tertle,
Assuming that the loads shown in the pic are yours I would try seating the projectles a little deeper so the case mouth is in the middle of the crimping groove. I would also ensure that the cases are all trimmed to the same length as the crimp will differ from cartridge to cartridge if they are not. I would also load just 3 for a start and feed them from the mag to ensure there are no demons here to bite you later. You don't say what type of crimper you have but most need a crimping groove for best results. I once had a Martini chambered in .30-30 and the only group I shot was under 2 MoA at 100 yards (one called flyer excluded) with iron sights so the cartridge is capable.
Regards Grandpamac.

@Tertle I’ve got a couple box’s of leverlution ammo if you want some factory ammo for it.

Full length sizing is recommended for lever actions, you don't have the camming action of a bolt-action to push slightly tight cases into the chamber.

@grandpamac yes they were my initial load, they were new brass but still went through the normal prep, i did think it was just odd that the cannelure on the nosler rounds when seated to the OAL was that far off the groove? If i seat to the crimp grove wouldn’t that create a further bullet jump? That sort of runs against my normal approach? I am using lee reloading dies that include a factory crimp die, i may be well over thinking it, ill make a few more today with 2206H and 2208 and see how they go, i will see if i can play with the crimp a little
@outdoorlad i might hit you up for a couple of round to compare, thanks :)

I will see how these loads go and then if still have no luck will try and get dads leverevolution powder down

I have a marlin 336 Texan.
I handload with 29 grains of ADI 2206h and 170 gr Sierra flat points.
Cheap to load.

Sighted for 50m and groups 1inch at 50m.

Attachment 205552

suits the bush really.

Attachment 205553

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Originally Posted by Tertle

@grandpamac yes they were my initial load, they were new brass but still went through the normal prep, i did think it was just odd that the cannelure on the nosler rounds when seated to the OAL was that far off the groove? If i seat to the crimp grove wouldn’t that create a further bullet jump? That sort of runs against my normal approach? I am using lee reloading dies that include a factory crimp die, i may be well over thinking it, ill make a few more today with 2206H and 2208 and see how they go, i will see if i can play with the crimp a little
@outdoorlad i might hit you up for a couple of round to compare, thanks :)

I will see how these loads go and then if still have no luck will try and get dads leverevolution powder down

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Yes there will be a bit more bullet jump but the blunt projectiles are pretty tolerant and usually shoot well seated away from the rifling. Crimp variation would be a bigger factor. Even with the Lee actory Crimp die I would still seat to suit the crimping groove.
GPM.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by grandpamac

Yes there will be a bit more bullet jump but the blunt projectiles are pretty tolerant and usually shoot well seated away from the rifling. Crimp variation would be a bigger factor. Even with the Lee actory Crimp die I would still seat to suit the crimping groove.
GPM.

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Attachment 205590Attachment 205591

I have attacked the use of a lever action from a different angle using it mainly for plinking and Hares and Wallabies at close range,
and so have used 110 grain rem bulk pack SP,s or 110 grain restrikes which go well in the 308,s as well.
I have found 30/30 very tolerant to bullet jump and in my Winchester feeding and accuracy to not be a problem.
My loads are light and Grandkids could not get enough of them.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tedz50

Attachment 205590Attachment 205591

I have attacked the use of a lever action from a different angle using it mainly for plinking and Hares and Wallabies at close range,
and so have used 110 grain rem bulk pack SP,s or 110 grain restrikes which go well in the 308,s as well.
I have found 30/30 very tolerant to bullet jump and in my Winchester feeding and accuracy to not be a problem.
My loads are light and Grandkids could not get enough of them.

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Just wondering what sort of load you use with the m1 carbine projectiles?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by omark

Just wondering what sort of load you use with the m1 carbine projectiles?

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I used Unique then AP70 using the same loads [about 8 grains] and now use trailboss.I use 2206 behind the Rem SP,s.I use 25 grains which is a light load but check your ADI charts before committing to using this data. I use these projectiles in the 308 at similar velocities and find they work well.

Forgot to add these are just plated soft lead so are treated like cast bullets

Quote:

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Originally Posted by omark

Just wondering what sort of load you use with the m1 carbine projectiles?

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In the past I have used 36 grains of 4064 with the Sierra 110 gun rn carbine bullet. You need to use the Lee factory crimp die as there no cannelure. They were quick light recoicing and pretty effective.

Thanks
I’ve been using unique but might back it off a little
Cheers

I would if I were you!.
I didn't think that it was useable with jacketed bullets, it's just about the perfect powder for cast bullets

Medium crimp seems to yield better results than mild. I use a Lee M die and i nudge it till I get a minors mark from the gaps in the collet.

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Originally Posted by T.FOYE

Medium crimp seems to yield better results than mild. I use a Lee M die and i nudge it till I get a minors mark from the gaps in the collet.

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Thanks, i think this will be a culmination of trying differing amounts of crimp, then an appropriate ADI powder!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tertle

Ive started my first ever foray into loading for my fathers 30/30 marlin leaver action, going to be honest I sort of like it and I can see the functionality of it……and that’s about it, the rest is challenging, he is after some leverevolotion but it’s in the wrong island. He purchased a stack of 170gr nosler partition projectiles

I’m unsure just how much crimp is best? Also using a powder that is readily available, ive a bit of 2206h 2208 BM1 h4831 and a small amount of h335. I did a test load tonight on a 2206h recipe and man slightly disappointing but im taking that down to running in a new barrel. But again that could also be poor crimp application?

Are there any good powders readily available, preferably in the adi range for the 170gr range

And any other tips greatly appreciated

Thanks

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Have consicdered using Cast bullets the 30/30 is one of the perfect cartridges for cast bullets can easily shoot them at close to the velocity of jacketed bullets at half the price,
The one I sell is a copy of the Lyman 311041 it weighs 180 grains, It is listed on Trade Me, If you want to try some I am happy to send you some as a sample.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by shooternz

Have consicdered using Cast bullets the 30/30 is one of the perfect cartridges for cast bullets can easily shoot them at close to the velocity of jacketed bullets at half the price,
The one I sell is a copy of the Lyman 311041 it weighs 180 grains, It is listed on Trade Me, If you want to try some I am happy to send you some as a sample.

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If it were mine I’d be in like Flynn, but dad is adamant it’s nosler ballistic tips……… god forbid I mention lead cast! I’m just heading to the man cave to do some tinkering ive a sneaking suspicion I may have that mould….. im almost tempted to get a lever action myself and have a play in this sandbox myself, and trust me she would be a cast load rifle as you are right the 30-30 would be an ideal rifle for it!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tertle

If it were mine I’d be in like Flynn, but dad is adamant it’s nosler ballistic tips……… god forbid I mention lead cast! I’m just heading to the man cave to do some tinkering ive a sneaking suspicion I may have that mould….. im almost tempted to get a lever action myself and have a play in this sandbox myself, and trust me she would be a cast load rifle as you are right the 30-30 would be an ideal rifle for it!

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Tell the ol man that his barrel will last forever shooting cast bullets.

I recently got some of Robs 180 gr cast bullets for the 30-30 and was looking into some loads but having trouble getting info on cast loads that would get speeds more around 1500-1600 fps maybe. I have played a bit with the 151 gr cast bullets but only for subs and would also like to get them going a bit faster. Is there a particular manual that would be good for this or any loads that anyone could suggest as a good starting point for these? I have a reasonable selection of the adi powders. I’ve got the aid manual but can’t see much for 30-30 cast especially at the heavier weights and slower speeds.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ebee

I recently got some of Robs 180 gr cast bullets for the 30-30 and was looking into some loads but having trouble getting info on cast loads that would get speeds more around 1500-1600 fps maybe. I have played a bit with the 151 gr cast bullets but only for subs and would also like to get them going a bit faster. Is there a particular manual that would be good for this or any loads that anyone could suggest as a good starting point for these? I have a reasonable selection of the adi powders. I’ve got the aid manual but can’t see much for 30-30 cast especially at the heavier weights and slower speeds.

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Try ADI cowboy loads for data although I like faster powders.Hodgens have similar data on there site.
Data – Single Action Rifle – ADI World Class Powders and Ammunition

adi 2nd edition manual
150grn lead projectile
ar2205--15grns---1600fps
ar2207--17grns----1550fps
ar2206---21grns---1600fps

Lever guns are a passion of mine so started looking through my bookmarks and revisited this site.
Always worth a browse.American powders but they duplicate many ADI powders.Just reread the 32/20 article.
https://www.leverguns.com/articles/t...del94_3030.htm

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ebee

I recently got some of Robs 180 gr cast bullets for the 30-30 and was looking into some loads but having trouble getting info on cast loads that would get speeds more around 1500-1600 fps maybe. I have played a bit with the 151 gr cast bullets but only for subs and would also like to get them going a bit faster. Is there a particular manual that would be good for this or any loads that anyone could suggest as a good starting point for these? I have a reasonable selection of the adi powders. I’ve got the aid manual but can’t see much for 30-30 cast especially at the heavier weights and slower speeds.

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Any of the Lyman reloading manuals will have load data for this bullet, the beauty with cast in a 30/30 is that you can use the jacketed data starting loads
just work the load up as normal look for accuracy not velocity the rifle will tell you when to stop lead fouling starts just after the accuracy drops off,
With these bullets is at about 1800 fps, I have not had a chance to do any testing myself; but one of my customers says that 1800 fps is an accurate velocity,
I would use 2206H and any faster powder 2207 and 2205 are very good cast powders I use Alliant 2400, Check the Listing on TM there is photo from the Lyman manual
with load data,
Or tell me what powder you have and I will look up some loads.
Cheers

lol I just saw your listing and contemplated copy n paste of the photo....

Quote:

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Originally Posted by shooternz

Any of the Lyman reloading manuals will have load data for this bullet, the beauty with cast in a 30/30 is that you can use the jacketed data starting loads
just work the load up as normal look for accuracy not velocity the rifle will tell you when to stop lead fouling starts just after the accuracy drops off,
With these bullets is at about 1800 fps, I have not had a chance to do any testing myself; but one of my customers says that 1800 fps is an accurate velocity,
I would use 2206H and any faster powder 2207 and 2205 are very good cast powders I use Alliant 2400, Check the Listing on TM there is photo from the Lyman manual
with load data,
Or tell me what powder you have and I will look up some loads.
Cheers

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33 grains of Leverevolution gave me just over 1800fps with both 125 and 150gr jacketed bullets in my M94 Trapper (16" barrel)