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Heya crew , im a newbie to this.
Dairy farmer based in central north island , so abit busy at the moment.
Im struggling to get the gun to group well , im not sure if its a bedding or something else issue or its my load. an inch at 100 , 6 inchs at 500.
ive pulled it apart and had a nosey etc ,
Who would you guys recommend for me to send my gun to , to get checked over and a load worked up for it ? im hoha with tutu-ing with it lol
thank you
What load are you using ? What sort of speed are you getting ?
Is it a new rifle ? Has it had many rounds down the barrel ? Could copper fouling be the issue ? Have you had someone else try shooting it ? Does it group well with factory ammo ?
So many variables
G'day mate, 1moa accuracy is not bad for hunting. At 500 you will hit an animal in the shoulder.
Fine tuning a load will help tighten the groups up. There are a few guys on here with 270wsm who will help you out
70gr 2225, 150 LRAB or VLD. Go shoot stuff
How have you decided on your COAL (cartridge overall length)?
Without measuring it for your rifle and projectile you could be jamming in the lands or jumping the Grand Canyon, or anywhere in between.
When i first brought the gun , i took it to my mate who does alot reloading. factory loads are worse. our best load we came up with was , 66gr with 2217 150 sst's ( all i had ).
but every 3rd shot would fly. both of us shooting .
I just want it to shoot well. and cant be faaarked pissing around with it at the moment
average of 2870 from 5 shots the chrony told meQuote:
Originally Posted by dannyb
2nd hand rifle , unsure but the barrels pretty tidyQuote:
Originally Posted by dannyb
Second hand and unknown round count yet another variable, you say the barrel is pretty tidy but is this your opinion from looking down it with a torch or have you had it inspected with a bore scope ?Quote:
Originally Posted by vtkomene
What ammo or load was the previous owner using and what kind of accuracy where they getting ?
Are you using the same optics as the previous owner ?
Is your mate that shot it a reasonably proficient shooter ? Can he achieve consistent groups with another rifle without getting fliers ?
Your mate that does a bit of reloading, no offense but how experienced is he ? Does he get good results with other rifles ? Just cause someone does a lot of reloading doesn't mean they are good at it (no offense intended it's just another unknown variable at this stage). It is one thing to be given a recipe and then just duplicate it, its a whole lot different can of worms and a lot more experience and knowledge is required to develop your own recipe and know what to look for when trying to develop a load
As much as I don't like sst's I've not really heard of anyone having trouble getting them to shoot, in fact the opposite is true and one of the reasons why they are so popular is that they are easy to get accuracy out of them.
You say you have been tutuing with it have you had the action and barrel out of the stock ? Did you torque it back up to sako specs ?
Are the sope rings and bases torqued to spec ?
Have you tried your scope and rings on another rifle or vice versa another known good scope and rings on your rifle.
As Mimms2 has said if you were closer I would help, surely someone from here is up your way and can help.
I know some of my questions might seem like I'm having a go, but rest assured this is not the case there are just so many variables that are unknown, getting consistent performance out of reloads and accuracy out of a rifle is all about removing the variables and getting everything as consistent as possible.
Also, look at timing of shots, an over-warm barrel can significantly open up groups, if the first two are close and the third is a flier, may just need some more space. I find that shooting lots in quick succession is better for replicating grip etc, but very bad for warm barrel.. A fan can also speed up cooling.
Are you using a muzzle device? if not, could also be a flinch and/or just jumpy recoil. could also check its not coming loose after 2 shots if you already are.
if you are sure its the load, then best to work it up from scratch. not overly hard to do if you follow a systematic process.
6" at 500y is fine to go hunting with, wasn't that long ago that may rifles couldn't get close to that
If you want to have accurate sub moa rifle/load then you're going to have to get used to " tutu-ing with it". No free lunches or shortcuts - sorry about that. Plenty of good advice above and I'd suggest going for a slower powder than 2217.
As a factory rifle ~1 moa might be as good as you get, unless you go to bedding action etc. And just fine for hunting out to 500 yrds or so.
To get tighter groups you need to methodically work thru a trouble shooting list to rule in/out different potential issues. As @dannyb has said - check rifle action/stock for fit and correct torque, then check scope base & rings for torque. Also make sure the mag box is not binding once you torque the action screws up. This is easy to miss and WILL cause fliers.
Then check bore for carbon and copper fouling. Both can ruin bbl accuracy. Put Hoppes thru it and leave it over night - muzzle down on a several paper towels so the Hoppes can drain out. Then dry patches, bronze brush and repeat. For stubborn Cu fouling i use Boretech Eliminator - dont leave it in too long (~30 mins should do the trick). See how much blue shit you pull out. Observe Cu fouling from muzzle end by shining a LED torch down it. Cu in lanz is pretty easy to spot.
If the bbl has had a fair few rounds thru it then a polish of the bore with JB's borepaste or autosol would help.
..... then you can start tutu-ing with pills/powder/ loads etc
Well being a finlite in 270wsm would make an interesting choice for a gong gun I was assuming its more for hunting use, plus far to many people over think about group size.Quote:
Originally Posted by mimms2
who would I recommend?????? ...Nathan Foster....located just down the road in the naki...knows his shit....Quote:
Originally Posted by vtkomene
Bang on ShaneQuote:
Originally Posted by 199p
This thread is in an example of that
I was thinking 6" at 500 yards is a very tidy group and a very dead deer out to maybe 700....... much further than I would contemplate trying.
Dunno about over thinking, he asked about getting tighter groups so the advice given has been directed at just this, being a sako 75 which come with a 5 shot moa garuntee I'd be very supprised if it wasn't capable of sub moa groups unless its completely trashed.Quote:
Originally Posted by BRADS
Have owned a few sako's now and all of them have been capable of sub moa groups with a bit of load development even my dirty old thrashed 270 finnbear.
Anyway hope the op can get some help and isn't bamboozled by all the info being flung at him :D
2870fps with 150gn SSTs?
It's going too slow, that's the problem.
Definitely on the slow side, I'd be trying adi 2225 or retumbo which is the same powder under a different label.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shearer
Also I'd be trying pretty much anything but sst's
145gn eldx
150gn berger vldh
150gn lrabs
Would be at the top of my list
since when has 8" been considered a "big bit"?????????
Thank you mate. Thats what im after. cheersQuote:
Originally Posted by Micky Duck
Have some 2225 and the eldxs waiting to be used.Quote:
Originally Posted by dannyb
I only had 2217 and 150s when purchased
I had great success with the eldx in my 270wsm and they were pretty easy to develop a load with not too fussy on jump although with a 75 you should be able to seat them right out and get some great speed.Quote:
Originally Posted by vtkomene
I found them to perform well with bang flops on everything from 40 yards out to 400 yards.
In the 270wsm you should be able to get 3100fps or better with the 145gn eldx I was getting 3153fps in my a7 which has a shorter magazine which limits how much powder you can stuff in the wsm case.
Danny I've owned more sakos than I care to remember mate.
My point was more some of advice is a bit over the top.
I could count the number of people on this forum on one hand who would no what look at in a borescope its not something you'd suggest for the average hunter to try.
As was suggested its a finnlight wsm not the easiest to shoot long range for a good group.
My suggestion to the op would be try some good factory ammo and see if it solves the issue.
If it doesn't send it @7mmsaum on the forum who's work would run circles around Nathan's.
so thats 30 posts and 2 suggestions /answers to original question....
Rest assured I'm not trying to compete with you on number of sakos owned :DQuote:
Originally Posted by BRADS
I wasn't suggesting he looked at the bore himself with a borescope I was questioning where he got his information about the barrel being "pretty good" and wether this was his assessment or if he had the barrel inspected by someone who knew what to look for and had the appropriate tools to make such an assessment maybe I wasn't clear on that.
I never had any issues shooting good groups with my wsm so didn't consider that as part of the equation to be honest.
Good on you for reccomending 7mmsaum had no idea he did load development, after all we are all trying to help the poor fella out.
Granted it's easy to go very deep into a rabbit hole....sometimes too deep.
I believe the op tried factory ammo with less than average results too.
I here ya mate.Quote:
Originally Posted by dannyb
I hear you on factory ammo but we don't what/how many makes he tried.
If he's new to shooting the wsm wouldn't be making it easy for him, without knowing if its braked or suppressed.
Yes 7mmsaum does a fantastic job particularly on sakos and if this chap is time poor and in the Central North Island id recommend him.
My question is, what sort of groups do you normally shoot at 500?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Agree its unlikely that two shots would overheat it that much, and agree if using a temp stable powder then velocity increase will not be the mechanism. but, there are other mechanisms of accuracy loss from a hot barrel, for example stress relief, barrel expansion increasing contact area, changed harmonic response etc. i dont know much, but i know more than i used to, and that is one of the things i have learned.Quote:
Originally Posted by mimms2
For what else its worth, i have also learned that good shooting technique is extremely important for small groups and very difficult to master. i think there would be a small market for coaching if anybody was inclined to set something up. I am toying with setting up a slow-mo camera to try to self analyse my shooting, as I cam sure that all of my poor groups are just my poor shooting.
Your rifle is a fine rifle and I'm sure it's accurate to boot, the wsm is a bit of a beast to take in a light rifle though like a finn and there are guys that no matter how much load development is done, simply won't be able to shoot them well. You most likely just need trigger time before vomiting money out all over the show trying to chase tiny little groups.
The finn in 270wsm get pretty warm pretty quick. I know... Got carried away and shot about 40 odd rounds at a stupid deer target before someone finally told me you won't hear your hits.. Its made from plywood, not steel. She was glowing hot... Needed new barrel after that lol