RCBS Dies... Problem?

Has anyone had trouble with RCBS dies? I have a set (FL sizer and seating die) that I bought a while back as I thought they might be a bit better than the Hornady New Dimension dies I was using. Haven't done any reloading for a while and have sold my Hornady dies. Got the new ones out yesterday and sized some brass (all Norma once fired, 270wsm)
It seems the last 3 or 4mm of the stroke requires a fair bit of effort to size the case, and then it feels tight still on the upstroke (removing case from die)
I cant find my micrometer to measure the cases, must have misplaced it during shifting, will get another today and see if I can find any odd measurements. I never had this problem using my Hornady dies (wsm/saum cases always seem to use a bit more effort than a 308 boltface case but this is ridiculous!) and my loaded ammunition always chambered nicely, chambered a few of the sized cases from this latest batch and theres excessive resistance when closing the bolt which is strange as with the effort I was putting into sizing them I would have thought they would be slightly under sized if anything. Any thoughts?

Edit to add: have inspected inside of die to check for a rough chamber and cant see anything, cases dont have any strange marks.

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Originally Posted by Ryan_Songhurst

Has anyone had trouble with RCBS dies? I have a set (FL sizer and seating die) that I bought a while back as I thought they might be a bit better than the Hornady New Dimension dies I was using. Haven't done any reloading for a while and have sold my Hornady dies. Got the new ones out yesterday and sized some brass (all Norma once fired, 270wsm)
It seems the last 3 or 4mm of the stroke requires a fair bit of effort to size the case, and then it feels tight still on the upstroke (removing case from die)
I cant find my micrometer to measure the cases, must have misplaced it during shifting, will get another today and see if I can find any odd measurements. I never had this problem using my Hornady dies (wsm/saum cases always seem to use a bit more effort than a 308 boltface case but this is ridiculous!) and my loaded ammunition always chambered nicely, chambered a few of the sized cases from this latest batch and theres excessive resistance when closing the bolt which is strange as with the effort I was putting into sizing them I would have thought they would be slightly under sized if anything. Any thoughts?

Edit to add: have inspected inside of die to check for a rough chamber and cant see anything, cases dont have any strange marks.

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Have you got the button fitted?

If so remove it and size a couple and see if it is still stiff.

Only resistance you should have on the upstroke is the button.

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Originally Posted by Ryan_Songhurst

Has anyone had trouble with RCBS dies? I have a set (FL sizer and seating die) that I bought a while back as I thought they might be a bit better than the Hornady New Dimension dies I was using. Haven't done any reloading for a while and have sold my Hornady dies. Got the new ones out yesterday and sized some brass (all Norma once fired, 270wsm)
It seems the last 3 or 4mm of the stroke requires a fair bit of effort to size the case, and then it feels tight still on the upstroke (removing case from die)
I cant find my micrometer to measure the cases, must have misplaced it during shifting, will get another today and see if I can find any odd measurements. I never had this problem using my Hornady dies (wsm/saum cases always seem to use a bit more effort than a 308 boltface case but this is ridiculous!) and my loaded ammunition always chambered nicely, chambered a few of the sized cases from this latest batch and theres excessive resistance when closing the bolt which is strange as with the effort I was putting into sizing them I would have thought they would be slightly under sized if anything. Any thoughts?

Edit to add: have inspected inside of die to check for a rough chamber and cant see anything, cases dont have any strange marks.

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That last bit is lies, it does have 270 marked on the bottom after all :P

Is the expander set too high and trying to squeeze the neck from the inside while the die is squeezing from the outside?

Got a set of forster dies here your welcome to try Ryan.....

So you sized 270WSM cases in a normal 270 die?

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Originally Posted by Husky1600

So you sized 270WSM cases in a normal 270 die?

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? no

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Originally Posted by Husky1600

So you sized 270WSM cases in a normal 270 die?

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Wow that would be impressive!

I would inspect the expander and measure it with a vernier caliper while it's out. Maybe it is set too high?

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Originally Posted by R93

Have you got the button fitted?

If so remove it and size a couple and see if it is still stiff.

Only resistance you should have on the upstroke is the button.

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Took the button and shaft out of the die and its still really hard to push it up that last few mm

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Originally Posted by Ryan_Songhurst

Took the button and shaft out of the die and its still really hard to push it up that last few mm

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That's odd then mate. Even if it is over sizing the spring of the brass shouldn't allow it to bind (at the neck?) without the stem and button.

Go with your original plan and have a measure up.

Have you seated a primer to see if the pocket is still tight? Might indicate a problem if loose.




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Will try pick up a caliper tomorrow and see what I come up with, had a quick look for my other one this evening but I'm buggered if I know where I have put it, have stopped sizing for now as I don't want to wreck all my brass if its playing silly buggers. @matagouri I will give you a text, might have to take you up on using your sizer until I get it sorted

Its not already sized?

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Originally Posted by Gibo

Its not already sized?

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Nah mate, fired primers in all the brass, and I have only used that brass once, it was all brand spankers at Tobys shoot last year in fact. if it was already sized I would expect it to be even easier to put through the die. I'm beginning to think that this is a dud die, a measure up is needed to confirm though.

Anneal your brass. Does wonders for sizing .

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Originally Posted by TeRei

Anneal your brass. Does wonders for sizing .

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After one firing?

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Originally Posted by Ryan_Songhurst

After one firing?

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I do mine every firing, don't know if it helps but cant hurt

are you lubing the entire outside of the case

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Originally Posted by Ryan_Songhurst

After one firing?

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Do your fired cases, prior to sizing chamber easily Ryan?

If so back the die off the case holder a turn and size another. Could be out of spec lengthwise or your case holder is out of spec causing too much shoulder bump. You should be able to see how far your neck is sized by eye if you have backed off too much.

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Prior to sizing they all chamber fine, they were all new norma cases and have only been fired through my rifle, they were originally sized and loaded through Hornady new dimension dies. I never had a problem with the same once fired brass when I ran it through the Hornady dies, it ran in and out of the die nicely and chambered nicely once loaded

Back your die off


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Don't know why the RCBS dies should be tight near the base. I would be doing a check with an inside mic but unfortunately you no longer have your old dies to compare. And if there are problems closing the bolt after FLSing I would suspect excess sizing of the body has pushed the shoulder fwd and the die need adjusting down not up. With a cheap set of Hornady gauges you can measure to the shoulder datam point and know exactly the issue. You could also use the old felt tip pen trick and paint some stripes the full length of the case and then see where the rub marks are.

Check you case overall length unsigned and sized - when you locate your vernier ha ha. This will tell you how much you are working the cases.

Ha Ha. Sorry Ryan. No wonder I was miffed.

Go with what Zimmer has posted. I use a forster press so my upstroke is your downstroke (wish I could find better words😆)

I'm all back to front. But that's not new.




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So i managed to pick up a new caliper today and just had a measure up, the dies seem to be sizing the brass to spec pretty good, and the brass doesn't seem to be getting excessively stretched during firing, only thing I can see is im approaching max length and due for a trim (never checked case length before first loading, just sized and chamfered then loaded, so they could have been long to begin with) im miffed as to why its taking so much effort to do so little sizing?
Attachment 71259

Lube?

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Getting weak... More weetbix

I would say your new dies have a smaller body and base dimension than your old ones, this will cause tight sizing that last few mm as it is squeezin the whole body and base in smaller, this should make em chamber more easy but that brass has to go somewhere and it goes forward and pushes the shoulder forward, this should show as easy to chamber but hard or impossible to close bolt, check with vivid or some marker where the empty sized case is binding on the mouth/neck/shoulder and body.
Necks generally can be quite a bit longer than SAAMI spec in a SAAMI spec chamber but if that is the cause trim, if not then most likely the shoulder has moved forward, on the same case wind down an 1/8th of a turn until it will chamber with the slightest resistance on bolt closing=Zero headspace go down max 1/8th turn more and test another couple of brass and if all good you should be all set up, recheck for any sign of excesses case length.

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Originally Posted by Feather or Shoot

Lube?

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Shouldnt be a lube problem, i dip all the necks in graphite and lube case with Unique, never had a problem with that routine before

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Originally Posted by veitnamcam

I would say your new dies have a smaller body and base dimension than your old ones, this will cause tight sizing that last few mm as it is squeezin the whole body and base in smaller, this should make em chamber more easy but that brass has to go somewhere and it goes forward and pushes the shoulder forward, this should show as easy to chamber but hard or impossible to close bolt, check with vivid or some marker where the empty sized case is binding on the mouth/neck/shoulder and body.
Necks generally can be quite a bit longer than SAAMI spec in a SAAMI spec chamber but if that is the cause trim, if not then most likely the shoulder has moved forward, on the same case wind down an 1/8th of a turn until it will chamber with the slightest resistance on bolt closing=Zero headspace go down max 1/8th turn more and test another couple of brass and if all good you should be all set up, recheck for any sign of excesses case length.

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What do you man by wind down VC? Wind the die down further? I have it setup so that shellholder stops on bottom of the die as per instructions with the dies... They seem to be sizing to spec well I just cant understand why I nearly have to rip my press off the bench especially when they are not stretching much during firing so the die isnt actually doing much sizing really.

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Originally Posted by Ryan_Songhurst

What do you man by wind down VC? Wind the die down further? I have it setup so that shellholder stops on bottom of the die as per instructions with the dies... They seem to be sizing to spec well I just cant understand why I nearly have to rip my press off the bench especially when they are not stretching much during firing so the die isnt actually doing much sizing really.

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You are hitting the case holder while on the sizing stroke with a case being sized?!?

First ascertain where the case is stopping you chambering it, if it is at the mouth all good trim, if it is at the shoulder your die needs to go down, die setting instructions are shit....dont set to touch the case holder set to match your rifles chamber lenght/headspace.

If it is tight on the shoulder the die needs to go down, if it is kissing the shell holder WHILE SIZING the case you need to remove some of the die from the bottom.
presses stretch and kissing the holder with no case can be miles of with a case.

Having never seen a reloading press in action, my thoughts are from way out left field,,,,,but does the press have a shaft that could be binding up with pressure. When moving some of the lube may have been wiped off, and when under pressure from sizing, it's loading up on the slide/shaft/pivot.

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Originally Posted by veitnamcam

You are hitting the case holder while on the sizing stroke with a case being sized?!?

First ascertain where the case is stopping you chambering it, if it is at the mouth all good trim, if it is at the shoulder your die needs to go down, die setting instructions are shit....dont set to touch the case holder set to match your rifles chamber lenght/headspace.

If it is tight on the shoulder the die needs to go down, if it is kissing the shell holder WHILE SIZING the case you need to remove some of the die from the bottom.
presses stretch and kissing the holder with no case can be miles of with a case.

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I think he can chamber it and the measurements stack up its just tight as on the way out of the die

Worth checking what oraki said. My old Lee Turret press used to bind up under load when the shaft got a bit dry.

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Originally Posted by Gibo

I think he can chamber it and the measurements stack up its just tight as on the way out of the die

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He said excessive resistance closing the bolt.

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He did, my bad :D As you were mate ha ha ha

Bought some new dies this morning, also RCBS as thats all I could find on the shelf in chch, set them up exactly the same as I had the other ones and brass is running through them nicely, I had a measure of a few cases sized through the "defective" die and got some odd readings so the one I measured yesterday was fine and I chambered it and it was fine, but most the others were not, the die seemed to be bringing the shoulder forward. So im just going to put it down to a dicky die. This is the second problem I have had with RCBS gear, first was my rockchucker snapping in half!

Dumb question but you did lube the cases ?

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Originally Posted by Chop3r

Dumb question but you did lube the cases ?

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In the end I was lubing the hell out of them to the point I became worried about dented shoulders

One thing I once struck with new dies was a factory protective coating, had to clean internally with solvent and problem disappeared.