Subsonic loads in 308 with 11:1" barrel twist

Hi guys

I am considering trying some subsonic loads in my Tikka all-rounder for closer range goat hunting.

There have been plenty of attempts and many were successful using trailboss and projectiles from 150gr to 230.

Given the 11:1" barrel twist rate of the tikka, those that successfully have done it, what was the projectile you managed to shoot with your 11:1" barrel.

I'd be keen to try the hornady 190gr sub-x, calculations indicate marginal stabilization, so it could work or it could not. 175gr would be another (slightly safer) option. Then again, ideally would want to go as heavy as possible.

Also heard mentions of cast bullets, any recommendations? do not necessarily have to use the hornady sub-x...

No intention to change the barrel or anything, gun is fine as is, just trying to find out what is possible and what not.

thanks in advance!

190g long range accubonds are perfect for subs in the 1 in 11

Often get inch groups at 100 yards which is exceptional for subs

Greetings @STC,
Cast lead projectiles are a whole new rabbit warren, perhaps best left until later. Sub sonics have a pretty loopy trajectory so ranges will not be long. Looking at the two projectiles on line the 175 grain seems to be intended for the .30-30 and the 190 for the other .30 calibre rifles including the blackout. .308 rifles often have a 1 in 12" twist so I would be surprised if they did not work, only one way to find out though. Hodgdon's suggest some loads.
Regards Grandpamac.

The cast bullets that shooternz on here sells are perfect for goats. Cheap and expand reliability with a good hollow point. I have shot deer, goats, rabbits, pigs and possums with them. Ideally have a scope with holdover marks or can dial.
Work ok on deer but I wouldn't recommend them unless it is open country or you have a good dog.
Margin for error with head and neck shots is extremely minimal as they do very little damage.
I tend to treat them like shooting a bow.
My load is the 151gr cast with just under 8gr of trail boss, if you can't get ahold of that Robert will give you some advice on other powders.

Tlb is correct if your hunting bush and shoot shoulder or lungs with subsonics with out a good dog expect to be going home hungry they can go a fair way with no blood and no obvious sign left of a hit .

The very best way forward with subsonic rounds for reliable terminal performance is purpose built lathe turned projectiles like Lehigh etc

Otherwise as mentioned previously you best have a good dog, you will need it

Bare in mind there are cullers using 22RF with solid 40 grainers to great effect, but that is akin to comparing yourself favourably to SVG because you can operate a car :)

Much appreciated guys, however the question wass mostly centered around, projectile stabilization of as heavy as possible bullets in a 11:1 barrel...

any experience there?

I have also shot 200gn Lapua FMJ in my 16" T3 308 and they stabilized and were accurate. As far as killing things went they were worse than the 190 Sub-X, just leaving a neat .308" diameter hole through anything they touched. Apparently they were supposed to tumble on impact but if they did it didn't make much difference to their effectiveness.

This: Outlaw State .308 SUBSONIC - Outlaw State Bullets LLC
Not lead free but the best terminal performance in subsonic

1-10" stabilised everything I tried, up to (I think) 180gr soft cast lead. Slight off topic, but one of the big things for lead cast bullets intended for subs is that not all lead is created equal, some of the wheel weights and linotype brews containing antimony to allow the molten metal to flow into the molds and tin for hardness mean that they can be quite hard. You won't be forcing them hard enough at sub velocities to need anything other than soft lead.

As far as that goes, the slow velocity is both a blessing and a curse as it can have odd results for stability as generally speaking the faster it goes the faster it spins and the more stable it is - within reason as a 1-5 twist might tear things apart etc etc. 1-11" is a fairly standard twist rate in .308, target barrels used to come in 1-13 or 1-14 which often showed issues as soon as you got over 168-170gr target loads. Next variation is the weight distribution of the projectile may have an effect on the accuracy due to stability, a smaller hollow point (shorter projectile) may be OK whereas a larger hollow point (longer pill) might show instability. What you will have to do is get hold of whatever you are planning on using and try it with the suppressor off - it's the only way you'll know for sure.

Compare these conventional projectiles shot into water at 950 fps from a 450 Bushmaster, notice the 250 FTX didn't expand at all sub sonic, it did super sonic

https://hosting.photobucket.com/albu...720&fit=bounds

To this 220 Lehigh & 395 Sub X & 194 308 Lehigh & newer 308 198 Lehigh I haven't tested yet, but looks to be more impressive

https://hosting.photobucket.com/imag...720&fit=bounds

The 220 450 is 44mm across the petals :o

The only thing that makes me a little bit screwy with those is how much of an impact initiates the expansion? A little something in the way that you don't see causing the parachute to open... It's all placement with the subs I think, doesn't matter which way you go there are going to be compromises.

those Lehigh look impressive. may have to give them a try in my 358.
i've been running 220gr lead large HP in my 358 over 10-12 gr of trail boss. have taken a sika hind and a few goats with them at 1050 fps good size exit hole..
but only for close work as they drop real fast. From forum member.
more effective on light deer, goats I have used the 158 gr 357cal XTP HP with great effect on goats at 50 mtrs. they will clover leaf for me at 50mtr 16-1700 fps muzzle velocity. Full case of trail boss 14 gr.
Z

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TLB

The cast bullets that shooternz on here sells are perfect for goats. Cheap and expand reliability with a good hollow point. I have shot deer, goats, rabbits, pigs and possums with them. Ideally have a scope with holdover marks or can dial.
Work ok on deer but I wouldn't recommend them unless it is open country or you have a good dog.
Margin for error with head and neck shots is extremely minimal as they do very little damage.
I tend to treat them like shooting a bow.
My load is the 151gr cast with just under 8gr of trail boss, if you can't get ahold of that Robert will give you some advice on other powders.

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Get in touch I am back Casting again have started catching up on backorders, I have a few bags of 151HP in stock, Don't want to list on TM yet
still recovering from Covid don't want to many orders,
I have been doing some powder tests with 700X Red dot 800x they are nearly as bulky as Trail Boss, an 8 grain load is still a good starting point,
Contact me at "robs.reload@gmail.com" if you want any or some other projectiles, I can source Hornady projectiles and reloading tools as well

Robert great to hear you are on the mend!
I had a tinker with 700x too and it seemed ok but nothing beats the bulkiness of trailboss sadly. Tough times call for creative measures :)

The trailboss loads I had for a time weren't that consistent speed wise. A bit odd, that. Also smoked like a coal range. Better results using red dot, unsure why.

Damn double taps

Quote:

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Originally Posted by No.3

The trailboss loads I had for a time weren't that consistent speed wise. A bit odd, that. Also smoked like a coal range. Better results using red dot, unsure why.

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I think Red dot has a little more pressure than Trail Boss out of the 3 powders I tried I like Red Dot best, Magnum primers may mix the smoke problem

Quote:

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Originally Posted by shooternz

I think Red dot has a little more pressure than Trail Boss out of the 3 powders I tried I like Red Dot best, Magnum primers may mix the smoke problem

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yip but as I found out and you corrected me on...you have to go stupidly low/light powder charge to keep them quiet if using a magnum primer

Quote:

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Originally Posted by No.3

The trailboss loads I had for a time weren't that consistent speed wise. A bit odd, that. Also smoked like a coal range. Better results using red dot, unsure why.

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I found with running subs a crimp on the case after seating does wonders for settling the velocity down. Cases don't come out covered in soot either.