TrailBoss

Saw this comment about unobtanium aka TrailBoss

The EU (and England) has banned a number of Hodgdon powders made by ADI (Thales) in Australia because they contain Dibutyl phthalate. There is also a ban in it's use in cosmetics in Canada, maybe Australia, and a limitation of how much can be in children's toys in Canada and Australia. Maybe other countries that like to follow REACH compliance the EU has mandated. California has it on their bad chemies list. Green and health groups in Canada and Australia want a total ban.
So, ADI was going to reformulate some of their powders to be REACH compliant, or just replace them with new powders that are. TB isn't exactly the highest priority because the EU ban means that even loaded military contract ammo sent to, or shipped via, EU countries has to be REACH compliant.. Hodgdon really isn't responsible for this. We may see IMR and Accurate powders made by GD in Canada get dropped if Canada goes REACH.

One wonders why? Know nothing about the product or REACH but here's what Wikipedia says about Dibutyl Pthalate

"Dibutyl phthalate (DBP) is an organic compound which is commonly used as a plasticizer because of its low toxicity and wide liquid range. With the chemical formula C6H4(CO2C4H9)2, it is a colorless oil, although impurities often render commercial samples yellow.[3]"

Phthalates are believed to be associated with reproductive defects in humans and there's quite a bit of evidence to support that.
It's effectively non volatile so absorption is via skin contact etc much like bisphenyl acetate. However I would have considered loaded ammunition harmless as firing would combust whatever dbp was present which I suspect us minimal compared to the plastics in everyday use. Another example of a blanket ban enacted without careful consideration.

If we succeed in removing all causes of reproductive defects will that mean we will get no more politicians? Just asking....

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Originally Posted by TeRei

Saw this comment about unobtanium aka TrailBoss

The EU (and England) has banned a number of Hodgdon powders made by ADI (Thales) in Australia because they contain Dibutyl phthalate. There is also a ban in it's use in cosmetics in Canada, maybe Australia, and a limitation of how much can be in children's toys in Canada and Australia. Maybe other countries that like to follow REACH compliance the EU has mandated. California has it on their bad chemies list. Green and health groups in Canada and Australia want a total ban.
So, ADI was going to reformulate some of their powders to be REACH compliant, or just replace them with new powders that are. TB isn't exactly the highest priority because the EU ban means that even loaded military contract ammo sent to, or shipped via, EU countries has to be REACH compliant.. Hodgdon really isn't responsible for this. We may see IMR and Accurate powders made by GD in Canada get dropped if Canada goes REACH.

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Could be the letter of the law or 'rules' in theory, but you are able to buy Hornady and ADI ammo here which is loaded with non-REACH compliant powder (Varget, H4350).

Just can't buy the powder itself...

It's not so much in this case the end product (the powder) but the lifecycle of the constituent chemicals - think manufacture, shipping, factory workers' exposure... The ban on the chemical in the EU under REACH is a 'whole of product's lifecycle' targeted ban not just the finished product.

so if other places ban it then we could see more entering our local supply chain?........

thinking glass half full not half empty.........

Have never thought much of trailboss, as I started loading well before it was ever thought of. SR4759 was probably the closest thing then, but the universal standard always seemed to be "8-10 grains of unique"

I wrote Trailboss off years ago. It generates higher pressures than other powders than can do the same thing and, in my experience, has inconsistent velocities. It was aimed at cowboy action shooters who just wanted something easy that goes bang and really should be forgotten about.

If you want accurate subsonic loads at lower pressures, low velocity target loads, or small game loads for larger cartridges, this is what Unique was invented for 100 years ago. AP70N serves the purpose equally as well.

Got plenty of trailboss here

Got a bit of Trailboss on hand. The only place it’s going is through my barrels. Use it in 308 Win subs and 223. 308 is effective out to 80m on deer, goats, pigs. 223 about the same with good shot placement. Use both regularly around residential areas for animal control to avoid conflict with residents and theoretically stay within DOC caliber restrictions. Works for me, hopefully it’ll be around in future.

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Originally Posted by 7mmsaum

Got plenty of trailboss here

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Keen . What quantity?

I have 3 tubs:P
No it’s not for sale
As@johnduxbury says it’s pretty inconsistent velocity wise but in a 25-50m plinking rifle that doesn’t matter at all
Fantastic stuff for that job
Which btw as JD also pointed out that is exactly what it’s for shooting big steel plates at 10-20m

Trailboss has its uses and I have 1 kg tucked away, so not likely to run out in this lifetime.

It does have similar pressure to BP in straight walled cases ( and I accept the above likes and dislikes ).

BUT it generates that pressure in a much shorter cycle.
Meaning the same pressure in half the amount of time.
So this raises some very real concerns for guys like me who only shoot genuine original vintage rifles.
It's just fine in a repop rifle.

And mostly fine in an original.
But you do need to be cautious about the metallurgy and inherent strength of the action you are using it in if it's original.

I mostly use trailboss in late 1800s reloadable rimfire cartridges because those rifles are made of fairly good high carbon steel.
Not in mid 1800s rimfire or centerfires because the actions are iron.

It is also useful in pistol caliber original rifles and carbines with poor bores that will still shoot a jacketed bullet ok for plinking .
These rifles are almost impossible to clean with BP.
Sure there are other Nitro options but trailboss is just fine considering they are never going to be accurate beyond 50m

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Originally Posted by akaroa1

Trailboss has its uses and I have 1 kg tucked away, so not likely to run out in this lifetime.

It does have similar pressure to BP in straight walled cases ( and I accept the above likes and dislikes ).

BUT it generates that pressure in a much shorter cycle.
Meaning the same pressure in half the amount of time.
So this raises some very real concerns for guys like me who only shoot genuine original vintage rifles.
It's just fine in a repop rifle.

And mostly fine in an original.
But you do need to be cautious about the metallurgy and inherent strength of the action you are using it in if it's original.

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The bulk of the powder (which is desirable in low-grain loads) has the consequence of a lot of surface area so it burns fast. Steep pressure curve from that... The velocity spread thing I have always considered to be due to the steep pressure curve and neck tension differences, once I started neck crimping the velocity differences shot-shot basically went away. One of the things with loading subs and using Trailboss is that you never worry about annealing etc - and I think this can give you enough of a difference in neck tension to show the velocity spreads without the crimps.

I managed to pick up a full bottle of Trailboss a few weeks back - at 9.5g per load that will likely see me out. Hopefully we do start seeing it being made at ADI again, but as it basically doesn't have a military application as far as I know I don't think it's going to be a huge priority for them. The other issue is ADI is labelling their product as Class 1.4 still where NZ wants it labelled as Class 1.3 for transport purposes which is going to make it difficult.