Thread: Half cock or safety

I hunt with a round chambered and safety on. If traversing a rugged bit then I unload. (reason I prefer top loaders)
If hunting with others then only the person in front is loaded.

See how a rifle 'slam fires' if bolt moved a little from 'half cock'

Looking at the answers from the different members on this post, it is interesting that each individual way of treating the problem might be linked to their location and the type of environment they hunt in. Hunting the kaimai is widely different to hunting the plains of Canterbury …

With all this cold weather at the moment Im using the half cock method...

Originally Posted by Friwi

Looking at the answers from the different members on this post, it is interesting that each individual way of treating the problem might be linked to their location and the type of environment they hunt in. Hunting the kaimai is widely different to hunting the plains of Canterbury …

It also seems to be a certain age demographic that prefer "half open" (or whatever you want to call it) to a specifically designed safety system.

Modern rifle , 100% the safety. A well known / respected Tauranga gunsmith said to me if they ( safety's ) didn't work the likes of Remington, Winchester , Savage would be sued out of business.
Makes sense to me , running an empty chamber until a round is needed makes sense also depending on what type of country you hunt.

Originally Posted by Friwi

Looking at the answers from the different members on this post, it is interesting that each individual way of treating the problem might be linked to their location and the type of environment they hunt in. Hunting the kaimai is widely different to hunting the plains of Canterbury …

ya bang on Friwi bush hunting Te Urewera we always used half cock - deer could be encountered at any time - if I was doing a whole series of river crossings then empty chamber - I never use the safety - maybe if I had a winchester type safety that positively locks firing pin I might

Not all safeties are created equal. For example, my rifle has a lever that has been knocked into the fire position in thick scrub, whereas other rifles have a button that slides forward. The latter is a lot harder to bump off. Then there are the ones that allow you to unload without deactivating the mechanism. These, if in button form are best. But even better is the empty chamber with bolt locked and closed.
For me, when stalking slow I have one up the spout, safety on but bolt unlocked and half open. Then there's a 2 stage process to close the bolt and take the safety off. Is it the best of both worlds?

Identify your target beyond all doubt because you never miss (right?) and I'll be missed.

The ONE THING we all take away from discussion like this is a little more awareness of what we do and why.that just HAS to be a good thing as we more aware of it's possible failings. Stay safe out there folks

Originally Posted by 7mmwsm

I have trouble believing a firearm with a closed action is safe.
I usually use half cock. Providing Ive checked it out and it has a half cock notch. Greg Duley did a very good article in their magazine about how to do this on Remington 700 rifles. I presume their clones would be the same.
Tragic started a thread on "Which Rifle". I said Blaser to meet his requirements. Blaser gets my vote on this subject too

Problem with your theory is some designs have no inbuilt mechanism to prevent the firing pin from releasing at half open bolt positions. So, if the firing pin were to be released (sear dropped) the rifle could either fire at half battery (bolt half unlocked) or the striker collects the cock on opening cam surface in the bolt knocking the bolt fully into battery for a good old negligent discharge. Not exactly safe and itsbecause the action is being used in a way the designer never intended.

Well at least we have moved away from what was a shocker of a practise I often saw used 40 years ago...bolt closed with trigger held back so the fireing pin was sitting on primer.....I know of one fella who dropped his 8mm mauser carried in this manner,it went down bank(assumably he was hanging on to stop himself falling) rifle struck rocks or some such,it fired and round went up through his hand arm and shoulder,luckily deflecting outwards rather than inwards removing his head....

The way I see it there is no perfectly safe scenario once a round is in the chamber. In the old days using a mauser 98 actioned rifle I always used the 1/2 cock system, I liked it because at a glance it was obvious to me or to a hunting companion that the rifle was not able to be fired, the 1/2 cock on the 98 mauser is excellent. However I do recall a couple of occasions when hunting thick bush the bolt got closed by a piece of scrub hitting the bolt handle, the only good thing in this case is that it is visibly obvious the moment it happens. The type of hunting I was doing in thicker bush meant that hunting with an empty chamber was not really a viable option.
The modern safeties once applied are pretty foolproof, however it is nowhere near as obvious that the safety is actually on. There is a definite possibility that the safety could be moved from safe to fire simply by brushing against a pack strap, Some rifle brands (safety designs are prone to this than others). I see neither system as being foolproof.

Originally Posted by Micky Duck

Well at least we have moved away from what was a shocker of a practise I often saw used 40 years ago...bolt closed with trigger held back so the fireing pin was sitting on primer.....I know of one fella who dropped his 8mm mauser carried in this manner,it went down bank(assumably he was hanging on to stop himself falling) rifle struck rocks or some such,it fired and round went up through his hand arm and shoulder,luckily deflecting outwards rather than inwards removing his head....

Less dramatic but a chap I hunted with ( many years ago) used to carry his 303 with one up the spout and the bolt closed in the fired position, he claimed it was safe (“see, you can pull the trigger and it won’t go off”) and all he had to do was pull the cocking piece back when he saw a deer.

Told him to empty his magazine and give me all the bullets from it and I’d show him which ones had been up the spout.

Showed him two bullets with noticeable ‘dings’ in the primers and told him both would have been up the spout at some stage with the firing pin resting on the primer and all it would take to fire the rifle would be dropping the rifle on its butt or smacking the cocking piece on a rock when he slipped and fell.

He didn’t use his ‘safe’ method after that.

why has no one mentioned the push feed actions not latching onto cartridge rim until bolt is full closed, many have been caught out when clearing a push feed style action and round is still up the spout.
M77 3 position safeties imo is about as good as them come.

Half cock with safety on. You can physically feel that’s it’s still safe without having to check checking that that you’ve knocked the safety on or not. If you can accidentally knock your bolt back without knowing you’ll accidentally knock your safety off without knowing also to easy for a stick or bush to get caught on trigger.
I’ve done a lot of bush hunting and can’t recall ever thinking ‘ if only my bolt was down I would have got that deer’ if deer has gone before you’ve got the bolt down there’s no way you were going to get a good clear shot any way.

Originally Posted by Stump

why has no one mentioned the push feed actions not latching onto cartridge rim until bolt is full closed, many have been caught out when clearing a push feed style action and round is still up the spout.
M77 3 position safeties imo is about as good as them come.

@Stump read the thread again. I got you mate