Thread: Kaimanawa Forest Park

The info we have seen says the roads and the land they are on is owned by the Crown, but ownership is planned to be transferred to the adjacent landowners.
The day that happens I expect the gates will be closed and locked, unless the groups involved in discussions with the future owners can negotiate some form of access agreement.

Any update on these public roads and access?

Another gate gone in 2 km down Waipakahi road

So "they" are forging ahead regardless of any access challenges then.

www.kaa.co.nz have a look.

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Let's not forget they are offering this too from "their" Waipakahihi base

Hunting – Kaimanawa Alpine Adventures

I have read much inaccurate information regarding the roads to access the Kaimanawa Forest Park from the Dessert Road.
Firstly each road must be treated as a different entity as each road was made via different mechanisms to do with the Tongariro Power Scheme phases 3 and 4
Secondly I am only referring to Waipakihi Road.

Waipakihi Road was Gazetted in 1974. When a road is Gazetted, there is a process in Central Government, the survery, ownership, fell thru various agencies over the years from NZED to Lands and Survey and finally to Taupo District Council.

The Road now is in Private hands.

Rotoaira Forest Trust. Who also now own the land either side of Waipakihi Road.

Those of you who have a version 6 or earlier of TUMONZ with property owner module will be able to see who the previous land owners were.
A trust that went belly up some 3 years plus ago.

Waipakihi Road is the southern most road under Taupo District Councils area. The council does not use the same contractors for road maintenance as NZTA does for the Desert Road. Thus Taupo Council has been "Forgetting" about the maintenance on the road.
NB there is a back history of Taupo District Counci renegging on agreements to do with this road. Eg the Alternative Scenic Road Taupo District Council agreed to complete in 1975 when the Power Project was completed. The Ministry of Works made a well made gravel road linking the 4 roads from Waipakihi to Rangipo Power Station Road to keep the heavy earthmoving equipment off SH1. The Agreement was that Taupo District Council was to upgrade the Gravel Road to a Class1 road with many Campsites (DoCs commitment) along it, with the added feature of it being an alternative to the Sisters if a crash occurred.
When the Project Finished, Taupo Council removed the culverts on the Gravel Road and renegged on the Agreement. Interestingly they also never returned the Terrain or Flora to prior State. Hence the scars visable from Satellite Mapping.
So Taupo District Council, keen to remove a badly deterriated road from thier books, did a back room deal with Rotoaira Forest Trust, DoC, and Heli Sika.
There is also an implication of how the Reciever of the Bankrupt Previous Trust transfered the property into Rotoaira Forest Trusts ownership.
There is no documentation of this transfer.

Back to the Gazetted Road of Waipakihi Road.
There is no paper trail of removal of the Waipakahi Road from the New Zealand Gazette. But Council and NZ Outdoor Access Commission say it is not a Gazetted Road, even though they cannot say how it has been removed from the gazette.
Land Information NZ (LINZ) say Waipakihi Road is still a "Surveryed Centerlined Gazetted Public Road" Still in ownership of the Crown. But they could not answer how the Council and Outdoor Access Commission think it is Private Land.

So Fact, LINZ and the NZ Gazette STILL have Waipakihi Road as a Crown Owner PUBLIC Road as far as the Old DoC Campsight upstream of what we all call the Washed Out Road/ Washed Out Culvert/ River Ford. From the Campsite on the South Bank to 300m beyond the joining of the Waikato Stream is designated as a Gravel Pit. Crown Owned.

Heli Sika and Rotoaira Forest Trust have a deal with DoC to fly Mountain Bikers who can afford it to the Upper Waipakihi Valley (Waipakihi Hut and/or Pinnicles) so the Cyclists can bike down to the new ShedBOSS building on Waipakihi Road. Interestingly Taupo District Council Approved and signed off on this building. In and area that actually needs a Resource Consent.

Taupo District Council DO run scared of the Lake Rotoira Forest Trust. As do many other organisations in the region who must deal with them. Including DoC and RAL.

There has been a full complaint submitted to the NZ Ombudsman regarding these Back-Room-Deals, and transfers without the correct process by Taupo District Council. There are another 8 Complaints being Investigated by the Ombudsman over other Back-Room-Deals Taupo District Council have made in "Closed Workshops"

Tree Trunk Gorge Road, Rangipo Dam Road, and Poutu Dam/Rangipo Powerstation Road have different Status as Roads, and as such are not included in my brief.

Taupo District Council have continually dodged the question, with time honoured techniques of distration, when did the process to remove Waipakihi Road from the NZ Gazette Occur. AND what was the process?

It is dificult to remove a Gazetted Road and transfer into Private Property. Plus via Treaty of Waitangi or Public Works Land Confiscation Act the process is longer and bigger.
Either Way there MUST be public consultaion of intent to remove a Gazetted Road from the NZGazette.
Non on record.

Final Footnote, NZ Access Commision is a Crown Entity the Crown uses to "advertise to the public" and to "Officially Notify". Also the Comission says they are a "Lobby Group" to gaurantee access to the outdoors for all NZers, however in practice the Government uses the Comission as a way of "we asked the public" for Parliamentary Select Committee Submissions and Feedback IN FAVOUR of what the Government is Trying to Pass as Law.

Ross read my Article and deep research.
Anton, Matt's mate.

I have learnt from a personal experience that deals aligned to Treaty decisions do NOT require public consultation. Welcome to our future.

Heli Sika will have made a commercial decision.
I do not imagine they have "ownership" of the road.
They may have helped it happen.

And no, that's not a racist comment, but an observation based on reality.

@Snow4wd
Thankyou for that very commendable work. I am sure many of us look forward to the Ombudsman findings.
However; my past dealings with Ombudsman indicate that office has no poers of correction but only to make recommendation to the appropriate Minister of the Crown. A usual prior requirement is that such Minister must have been approached prior to Ombudsman creating an investigation. Perhaps in this case it may be the Minister for Local government?
Three forum members approached Taupo Council about this matter and the Mayor Trewavas denied any knowledge of the issue and stated to me that he was unaware of any public consultation having takeb place. At a meeting we attended on the subject the legal advisors to TDC brought no light to the matter either.
NzDA chief and deputy execs were fully informed by us at that time. The only other update I am aware of was a proposed closed meeting within the Rotoaira forest trust for 12th Sept but I do not know what disussions actually took place; nor any outcomes since.
Please keep us updated if you can.
Kind regards--

Originally Posted by Woody

@Snow4wd
Thankyou for that very commendable work. I am sure many of us look forward to the Ombudsman findings.
However; my past dealings with Ombudsman indicate that office has no poers of correction but only to make recommendation to the appropriate Minister of the Crown. A usual prior requirement is that such Minister must have been approached prior to Ombudsman creating an investigation. Perhaps in this case it may be the Minister for Local government?
Three forum members approached Taupo Council about this matter and the Mayor Trewavas denied any knowledge of the issue and stated to me that he was unaware of any public consultation having takeb place. At a meeting we attended on the subject the legal advisors to TDC brought no light to the matter either.
NzDA chief and deputy execs were fully informed by us at that time. The only other update I am aware of was a proposed closed meeting within the Rotoaira forest trust for 12th Sept but I do not know what disussions actually took place; nor any outcomes since.
Please keep us updated if you can.
Kind regards--

Sounds like the Taupo mayor was correct then that there were no 'public consultations having taken place'.
Rather, closed to public consultations may have taken place?

An issue that has recently been highlighted by the ombudsman regarding local government and democracy.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/pol...ncil-workshops

Then again, here's an article from 2 years ago about the ombudsman looking into public excluded council workshops.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/manawatu-sta...ssion-welcomed

In fact at the meeting we held with TDC Mayor and CEO REP and their legal advisor, that legal advisor specifically stated to us that TDC did not own Waipakihi road. I have now suggested to NZDA CEO to read the recent inputs in our forum on the matter.

I would not be voting for re election of the Taupo Mayor - he's full of sh.t.