That answer will be very interesting.
Printable View
That answer will be very interesting.
I think you are going to find guys, that Waipakihi road from the boundary of Tongariro National Park (where the gate now exists) was in fact taken from Maori owned land under the PWA, so will quite probably be returned to them. I would dearly love to see it remain as a public access for all to use, but the construction of the gate and the business partnership with Heli Sika would suggest there may be other plans.
We're working on "other plans".
Just to give a little more clarity folks. Information from sources indicate that of the four access roads from Desert rd to the park boundary; there will be two that will remain open. The open accesses are Kaimanawa road and Tree trunk gorge road.
On the other hand the two which may be closed are Rangipo Intake and Waipakihi roads.
Our Taupo small working group assisted by other forum members are steadily working towards meaningful cooperation wIth NZDA Natex and other branch execs and other significant players, obtaining facts and relevant considerations of parties involved.
I would personally like to thank all of you unsung heroes who are working hard behind the scenes to get some resolution from powers that be to resolve this if possible for the benefit of your fellow hunters. Good bastards all of you . To D.O.C remember your public statements and policy - free and unrestricted access to all DOC estate
Question -
Would it be an option for NZTA/DOC/Whoever to put a new access road in just slightly further south linking back to what left of the access road and National park?
Looking on the map it quite clearly shows that there is a section of Public owned land that crosses SH1 south of these accesses(Lost) and a new access road could be put in for park users linking to the existing tracks etc?
Yes a bridge will be needed and a bulldozer etc...
Just a thought... instead of fighting to regain access to lost access, just request a new access for majority of NZ's/public to still access?
free and unrestricted access to all DOC mismanaged estateQuote:
Originally Posted by Barry the hunter
Fixed for ya
Hardly helpful for the group from here who are talking to DOC.Quote:
Originally Posted by Double tap
Hi All,
Kia ora koutou,
We have completed our research into the background and legal status of the land relevant to Rangipo Intake and Waipakihi Roads. This information is now on our website and may be accessed through this link https://www.herengaanuku.govt.nz/abo...ipakihi-roads/
Nga mihi,
Ric
Ric Cullinane
Tumuaki | Chief Executive
Aotearoa Outdoor Access Commission
+64 48158509
+64 274775042
herengaanuku.govt.nz
It would have to be a long road, there is a large block of private land south of the Waipakihi and north of the Waipahihi.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sika stag
Attachment 203628
Just read that HiTop Good info,would you say that access is still available on these roads until sorted.
An exellent post with a very detailed link. Thankyou . Maps we have seen indicate the land owners as far back as 1891 were in The Crown.Quote:
Originally Posted by HiTop
Good work being done here.
My view for what it is worth is that the truth is not always at the bottom of the well. Its easy to become distracted by the detail and lose focus on the goal. The goal being access for recreational users.
The deeper down the well you go the more entangled you will become in arguments over legal rights. Nice to have a legal argument in your back pocket if its a strong one, but far better to focus on a negotiated agreement based on the principles of fairness and reasonableness.
and if B.W. is even half right in his number of animals "migrating " from public land onto private.......the private land owners should be very forthcoming with open access to public land to keep down the ravishing hoards or animals...
Its going to be busy in there with people going in for a look to see what all the fuss is about.
Nice thought but can't see it happeningQuote:
Originally Posted by Micky Duck
A meeting was help with TDC mayor and staff today. They have been brought up to speed as far as possible at this stage with further enquiries to be carried out. NZDA HQ are aware of the discussion and are also following lines of enquiry. Affected parties not only include us or hunters per se, but trampers, Genisis energy, and many other user groups access to this portion of Kaimanawa Forest Park. TDC is now fully aware of this wide band of interest.
"We understand the Waipakihi accessway land is going through a process to transfer the Crown land back to the former or adjacent landowners."
It's noteworthy that the Herenga a nuku statement doesn't name those who it is proposed might acquire the ownership.
I wonder what stage this process has reached. That web site doesn't say.
One of the adjacent landowners is the Tongariro National Park and public good and the goals of Herenga a nuku would be best served by transferring it to the park. ("Our purpose is to provide New Zealanders with free, certain, enduring and practical access to the outdoors."
https://www.herengaanuku.govt.nz/abo...spe-2022-2023/ accessed 2022 08 12)
@HiTop are you in a position to discuss this online ?
Not my circus sorry. I'd let the processes of local government, the crown and the adjacent land owners sort it all out. The interest shown has signalled the need for a well negotiated outcome and it really is up to the parties to come to an agreement.
But local Government knew nothing about it, hence the desire by central North island forum members to go to the Taupo District Council and get as much sunlight on the issue as quickly as possible.
The parcel of land the tar seal strip (known colloquially as Waipakahi road as its not a 'road' in the legal sense) is still vested in the Crown, so the Maori Trust theoretically do not have legal ability to place bollards and a gate on Crown land.
DoC appear to have been singularly hopeless in doing anything to foster continued access to the Public Conservation Estate.
The Walking Access Commission on the other hand appear to be sticking to their stated principles and doing their best to maintain enduring public access.
Thanks @HiTop.Quote:
Originally Posted by HiTop
So the Aotearoa outdoor access commission / herenagaanuku is not going to take action to meet its statement of performance expectations 2022-2023 ?
the more parties with SOME clout that come along and chip in to help keep access open the better,one would think.....
Hopefully they will agree to work closely together. The outcome will have effects elsewhere in NZ in the future.
It would appear the commission has already responded to the concerns and has spent considerable time investigating. Resolution is a different matter and I think there will need to be further discussions between the parties before anything can be progressed. Clearly there are issues of clarification of who actually has title and what that title ensures or if that title will actually be given up in a restoration process. How much the public's interest will be considered I cannot guess. I look forward to seeing a resolution and if the road is illegally blocked then the blockages must be removed prior to any further discussion. Enduring public access is most certainly what everyone appears to be looking for and I sincerely hope that can be retained but I think we all need to be aware there may be a dispute over the ownership of the land the road sits on due to it being taken under the Public Works Act. Hopefully something will get sorted quickly and everyone can come to agreement and you can all get back to enjoying the place soon.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bagheera
SO.....if it was taken under the public works act.......... keep it under the same.....it has been requisitioned (correct term I believe) for the purpose of a road that is the best interests of the greater public to access public land.....maybe???? or charge current going rate to MAKE the road where it is as it stands to the person or persons who want the land back...its an improvement so therefore should be paid for....... couple of thousand bucks per meter was cost of Auckland footpath I believe....a raod out in middle of nowhere also has transporting heavy machinery to get it there in first place to take into account.
In view of the strong possibility that the DoC estate will be handed to tangata whenua (Te Urewera), or at least co-managed with tangata whenua, DoC will keep their head below the parapet. This has been the experience in several scenarios in Auckland recently, including tangata whenua being handed control of kauri dieback disease.Quote:
Originally Posted by XR500
If, and only if it is given back to tangata whenua it will be Ngati Tuwharetoa and administered by the Lake Rotoaira Forest Trust.
Not Te Urewera
Sent from my SM-G990E using Tapatalk
Article in Stuff this morning on the Kaimanawa Access issue. I'd say if they have gone public with this article closure is imminent but my opinion only.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/environment/...near-desert-rd
I used Te Urewera as an example of DoC managed land being handed to tangata whenua, in that case, Tuhoe.Quote:
Originally Posted by Reindeer
Yep it appears it might be closed to allow for a private enterprise with Helisika according to the Stuff article this morning
One solution is to boycott Helisika.
I suspect the vast majority of their business comes from kiwi hunters. They’re obviously branching out into mountain biking. Stop flying with them until they open up the road.
there is one statement there in that stuff article provided by BSA from DOC that makes my blood boil "the Department is not obliged to seek access across private land " DOC if you read this that is a bloody gutless cop out -no other word for it -
It still gets me how National Parks which are public land are increasingly referred to DOC Estate land. DOC doesn't own it.
The first 1 km of that land parcel commonly known as Waipakahi rd is indeed in the Tongariro National Park. That's why the bollards and gate are 1 km in off the state highway. All private businesses that conduct money making activities on or through the Public Estate managed my DoC are required to obtain a concession from DoC.Quote:
Originally Posted by Barry the hunter
Well there you go. There is a point of leverage if ever I have seen one: Manage public access along what is commonly known as Waipakahi road, or you don't obtain a concession to drive through the Tongariro National Park to run your private money making business. You'll have to fly clients and staff in and out of your base in there.
But in this day and age....yeah nah
I refuse to use the terms DOC or Doc Estate. Call it what it is Public Land(s)Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve123
Hi BSAQuote:
Originally Posted by BSA
I saw the piece this morning but found it had been removed by this afternoon!!!!!
Article is still there for meQuote:
Originally Posted by Siteline
It seemed like a balanced article.The MSM are ok when they are saying what you want. :)
The overt racism on here and other places was noted.
@Tahr; I just took time to re-read this entire thread and I did not find any overt racism in it. The thread is in general very constructive and includes repeated acknowledgement appreciating the concerns of the Rotoaira IWI.
You are correct. I had in my mind the thread about the DOC wild animal management job.Quote:
Originally Posted by Woody
