I have made a start to discuss with Taupo electorate MP but she is currently at a conference in Nelson. Secretary has a message from me to pass on. May hear more next week.
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I have made a start to discuss with Taupo electorate MP but she is currently at a conference in Nelson. Secretary has a message from me to pass on. May hear more next week.
Reply from DOC Turangi today:
Kia ora xxx,
Thanks for contacting us. Yes both Waipakihi Road and Rangipo Intake roads will closing. The land is privately owned and the owners are closing the roads.
If you have enquiries please contact Lake Rotoira Forest Trust PH07-386 8834 https://www.lrft.co.nz/
The Kaimanawa Forest Park can still be accessed via other access roads such as Tree Trunk Gorge Road, Kaimanawa Road.
How inconsiderate of DoC public servants to not advise public back at least two years ago. Lots of us need to get to MP's asap. The public has used these access roads for at least 56 years going by my experiences.
I'll wait until I see the title.
On the one hand we have the Maori Land Court map showing one thing, and on the other we have someone who will benefit commercially saying another. They may well be correct, but the facts here matter more than anybody's opinion.
I would be gob-smacked if the Lake Rotoira Forest Trust and Heli Sika (and DOC on the side line) lawyers have got this wrong.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ross Nolan
Lobbying and public opinion may result in changes but I doubt very much if there is a legal remedy.
How about one of you guys with all the legal knowledge about the maps etc write us a letter that we can then send to our MP.
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Maori Freehold land map.
https://www.maorilandonline.govt.nz/gis/title/19948.htm
Rather than everyone putting their 2 cents forward, Shouldn’t this be taken up by the local nzda branch? NZDAs national office lawyers can then write to the crown/minister with an accompanying media release as part of their hunter advocacy function.Quote:
Originally Posted by 25/08IMP
Astounding that PGF money is being used to block public access.
Weird. Looks like Waipakihi Rd is not Maori free hold but free trunk gorge is.
Would make a tresspass notice from police interesting. It would read do not know land owner pick from the following list.
Left a message on NZDA HQ answerphone this afternoon. Also Sika foundation and taupo nzda.
No one available anywhere at present it seems.
One of our members has already been in touch with the president of NZDA who is a lawyer him self so im sure something will be done about itQuote:
Originally Posted by omark
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CEO is a lawyer.Quote:
Originally Posted by 25/08IMP
CHIEF EXECUTIVE OFFICER AND GENERAL COUNSEL
Gwyn Thurlow is from Wellington and joined NZDA as CEO and General Counsel (in-house lawyer) in June 2020.
Gwyn has taken on the role to transform NZDA into a modern and professional organisation. He has been a long time member of NZDA where he is the treasurer of Wellington Branch and volunteers on the NZDA National Heritage Trust as secretary.
Gwyn is a keen alpine hunter and particularly enjoys hunting tahr and chamois.
Yip that's what I meant.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tahr
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I ll see him on Thursday night and over the next weekend for our annual conference.
I put that map up earlier this week, and it shows the road as not being part of the block.
I've asked the Maori Land Court for clarification.
I'm inclined to agree.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tahr
And on the advocacy front, I kinda suspect it would be useful to collaborate with other representative groups, like FMC , maybe? If nothing else, that may help assuage the general low regard the authorities et al appear to have for hunters, and their passtimes?
Waipakihi Road is owned by the Crown full stop. Any closure needs to be approved by the Crown agency, which in this case to be confirmed but should be LINZ. When Shane Jones was travelling around with his PGF roadshow many applications were approved without due diligence. The minister of LINZ is Damien OConnor so send questions to him asking if his department have approved the establishing of a gate to stop public access along Crown owned land.
Go here https://www.taupodc.govt.nz/ Click maps/mapi/scroll down/go to mapi/scroll and adjust for area/zoom in.I used junction of SH1 and Rangipo Intake Rd. Left click on road for info then click arrow and three lots of info show up,click on info.
Thanks for that. Shows it clear as day.Quote:
Originally Posted by PillowDribbler
Down in the central south island when we had access issues denied, reduced through tenure reviews on farms/Stations sold to overseas interests or we were locked out by new owners we lobbied/wrote submissions to Central Govt and formed a South Island Access Committee with NZDA as main stakeholders. When labour got into Govt 5 years ago they stopped further tenure reviews and made LINZ take into account future access guaratees which was great but a bit late for many properties that closed access to the public land out the back. FMC stepped up too over these issues - worked together with NZDA. In the meantime we have gained access to some public land that was difficult prior.
Get together - provide maps of the issue, accumulate your email replies from local DOC amd provide photo's of the road/gates being built. Then forward to your local NZDA branch in Taupo which may end up dealing directly with the Iwi land owners? I remain surprised Taupo branch haven't jumped on the bandwagon since this thread started? Problem is that many users of the Waipakihi Rd access and other access rds likely not in the NZDA? But want action. Its a numbers game - the bigger the group/NZDA etc the more resources you have to fight back. Work together on these matters.
I personally would have thought this gate issue would have leaked out a while back to give stakeholders a chance to formulate a reply?
DOC have a huge estate to look after with little funding change over the years - they are near the bottom of Govt portfolios as they don't make much money for Govt. Bet if Cam Speedy was the big boss for the area, we would have heard about this road change way back? Just an opinion mine you.
I have just sent a message to a local lady who is/was the president of FMC earlier this afternoon to raise her awareness of this access restriction.
Haven't had a reply yet but hopefully she reads it.
FMC have been notified.
Fair enough - all we want is guaranteed access along the road to the park boundary which due to the distance to the park more feesible by vehicle than walking from SH1. I used Cam as an example for exactly that - hunting access - game management, Iwi maintain their business side for operational interest but by default potentially get exclusive hunting access which may end up being an extension of the mountain biking? Time will tell i guess.
I expect that in the eyes of the public, and commercial operators, mountain bikers and walking access for hunters with firearms will be incompatible. Damn shame but probably a game stopper. Hope not.
If it's good enough for pushbikes then it's good enough for horses. The've been there since end of WW1 and were transport of choice for hunters traditionally. We went thru paradise valley to three kings range hunting when I was a nipper.
If you look on Google Earth and pick up the MTB track alignment on private land you will see its miles away from the Public land that the current legal access of Waipakahi road permits access to.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tahr
I walked with a rifle up the Te Iringa track this month, and shared it with a number of mountain bikers - lots of conversation, no problems.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tahr
Be the change you want to see.
So can you get all the way through to the Oamaru on a mountain bike.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ross Nolan
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I am getting the impression there are different "facts" about the land tenure depending on what source you choose. Perhaps the information given to the PGF was that which suited the applicants and it was not scrutinised thoroughly. I am watching this space with great interest.
Yes. Over Te Iringa. Not up Porinui.Quote:
Originally Posted by 25/08IMP
Awesome ill have to go and check it outQuote:
Originally Posted by Shearer
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I beat the group of mountain bikers I left with to the old hut site- 2 legs is faster uphill than 2 wheels.Quote:
Originally Posted by 25/08IMP
Came a bit second from there though....
When Helisika replied to another of my emails they were careful to point out that the land owners were responsible for the gate.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shearer
I suspect that this is a case of people believing the version that best suits their purposes, and everyone thinking someone else has done the checking.
It would be interesting to see when the resource consent was lodged to the local council for the building of the infrastructures.
And when a new business venture is opened like that, legally is there not some sort of announcements to has be made in the local press ? ( not that I read much about my local press either).
What happens on private land can stay on private land. But the road leading to the park boundary may be another story. This is the real issue we are all interested in?
Precisely, at what stage did it transitioned from a a private land enterprise going to encroach onto public land access ?(without any sort of announcement or consultation or did I miss something there?)
Of course private enterprise do pretty much what ever they want on their property.
Well defining the status of who owns the road, is and has been the issue right from the start of this thread. From an earlier statement on this thread DOC Turangi appear to be aware of a gate going up on Waipakihi Rd so that is a sure indication of private road ownership whatever interpretation of your WAMS maps. Personally i would have thought the replies from DOC on the matter would have said yeah - private road or not - since DOC are a Govt Dept and should be able to confirm this? Then someone challenge the status if they are incorrect in their WAMs interpretation? I have to suspect there are groups of interest now checking all this out behind the scenes and we will be notified in due course? Fingers crossed.
I have spoken with the land transfer office who assured me the road is public and not part of the Rangipo block
I might be completely wrong here
Last times I have hunted from the Waipakihi road end, yes there is a new gate but it is off to the right hand side of the road in the Maori owned land.
The road access was the same as it always has been.
I can’t say the same for the other roads because I haven’t been there, only been to the Waipakihi.