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Shot a hind on Sunday night at 540 yds across a gully with a 143 ELD-X. Elevation was spot on but ended up hitting her bit to far back of the shoulder. Light southerly blowing down the gully but not so much, so experience told me not to allow for any wind.
Its got me thinking though, whats the general thoughts on the distance you start to allow for wind, and how strong does that cross wind have to be to have an effect
Thoughts???
540y is a long shot in a hunting situation and any wind would need to be allowed for. Also remember if shooting over a "gap" eg your gully windspeed will be alot higher than what you observe at shooting location and at target. Take a look at @Norway website THLR.com for some super practical how too video. Windcalls are a skill that need practice and can always be improved...
I don't think there's a clear point. Call the wind effects as they are for the conditions and your system, and correct for them. 540 yards is a long way and a little wind will have an effect - for example a 1ms breeze is pretty light, just a breath of wind, but you'd expect about .5mil of wind at 540 yards. 25cm or so.
Wind will have an effect at almost any distance.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bos
The amount of effect depends on the size of your target area, the wind strength and direction, the ballistics of your projectile, your muzzle velocity.
Spend some time on a rifle range where the centre 'X' ring is 1/2 MOA - 2 1/2 inches at 500 yards. Wind has a significant effect particularly if it is a gusty cross wind.
Your description suggests you were shooting in a cross wind and should/could have allowed for the wind and either wound your scope/sights or aimed off.
Before Easter we put up a gong "range" for sighting in. It ran from 200 to 720 yds, there was a swirling light to medium breeze from the left. Almost everyone started applying windage at 300 yds and missed. Shots were called off the left edge, aiming centre plate scored 2-3 inches right. At 4 and 500, same thing aim halfway to the left edge, one person with a dialling scope put .2 mil on and called that good.
Only one guy got the 720, 300 PRC with a sig bdx scope the rest of us ran out of talent at between 4 and 500. A lot of fun and very instructional, as we realized we over estimate wind especially without knowing the actual wind speed and paying scant regard to down range conditions.
Target sizes, 8 inch at 200, 12 at 3,4,450 and 720 yds and 16 at 500 because the target hanger got confused and wasn't going back to fix it
shooting rabbits up in Mackenzie country one night 30 ish years ago with bunch of guys from Timaru deerstalkers...howling norwest wind...five of us in wagon and three just gave up...two of us were still getting consistant hits at 25-30 yards..when asked how I was managing to hit them...aiming off by a half bunny length!!!!
Makes sense GimpQuote:
Originally Posted by gimp
Probably 1 - 2 m/s so 25- 50 cm roughly would be about right
Shawn Carlock, a US long range guru said he always dial for the wind, even if is a 0moa dial.
Always dial wind
Ah snap @stug :D
This makes sense- wind accelerates uphill. But even if the gully is lined with trees?Quote:
Originally Posted by Hunty1
Identify your target beyond all doubt because you never miss (right?) and I'll be missed.
At 540 yards id hold 1 minute min with what I call a light wind(who knows what you call a light wind).wind is such a tricky thing to get right, a puff early on in the bullet flight will send it way off at long range.
This is a great resource
https://defensiveedge.net/wp-content...G-THE-WIND.pdf
Print out some range cards with a ballistic calculator. Windage Depends strength of wind and on calibre , 22lr from 20m , 338lap mag 300 gr 200. Go shoot F class or fly blokes adjusts at 100 on
I will correct myself, you'd be looking at about .25 mil at that range with 1ms which is closer to 12.5cm, all very approximate.
If shooting at these ranges it's very difficult to avoid the odd cockup even with all due diligence and thorough preparation.
Come down to the forum Ultimate Hunter shoot at Sparrowhawk in Sept...
Unprepared, uneducated and poorly proficient hunters, such as myself, are also able to make multitudes of cockups at substantially closer ranges too.Quote:
Originally Posted by gimp
I'm surprised a SIG BDX got it done at that range, I haven't seen them work all that accurately past 500+.Quote:
Originally Posted by Marty Henry
Can't remember the exact podcast episode, I think it's this one but the dude has a lot worth hearing about accuracy in the field and he gets right into the nitty gritty on precision of a rifle and ammo vs practice using it, he had a good one on windcalls in the mountains.
https://open.spotify.com/episode/10m...RaW95Xhpdanbhw
I've got the 3-18 sierra 6bdx and have shot goats / deer at a variety of ranges, the longest was 475m. Shot target at 500m as well to the check drop. I won't be using it further. I think the thickness of the reticle covering the target is the problem with the bdx compared to the normal long range optics. The wind is always hard to judge. The NW can certainly blow when it wants to.
Thoughts? it is a physical impossibility that the bullet remains unaffected if you can detect wind. Winddrift can be called "horisontal gravity", meaning it's there every time.
373 yds. Perfectly still. Allowed for steep slope. Last night. Higher BC 74 grn bullet helps.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9nqpnk5V11g
@Eat Meater as an analogy wind is a bit like water. If you think of your gully as a stream and the wind is the water flow the velocity is lowest at the banks and highest at the middle. As wind is generally invisible in empty space this can be hard to gauge. Basically the higher the bullet travels obove the ground the higher the windspeed is likely to be effecting it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eat Meater
Hopefully makes sense?
Yes makes sense (I also trout fish so the analogy is relevant). It also helps explain some of my issue on the weekend (see my post in the magazine). I assumed the wind was constant across the gap.
Identify your target beyond all doubt because you never miss (right?) and I'll be missed.
@Eat Meater good explanation below
Attachment 247233
In My ballistic app I always have a 2mile 90 degree wind set in. It just gives me an idea in a light wind what my bullet my do in the slightest puff at my given range. If I think there may be a tiny wind mid gully I will hold half the windage. Means at worst I will still only be half wrong but still a lethal shot I would only use this in a situation like yours where wind is virtually nill. Anything more and I dial for wind
Practicing in wind also helps
2mph wind is probably not enough.Quote:
Originally Posted by Remmodel7
6mph is a pretty standard light breeze, 3mph is probably the minimum most people will start thinking they need to hold for wind.
If you are only going to write down one wind value make it 6mph. Then you can double if for a strong(ish) wind and halve it for a breeze.
Wind for me is tricky to read in a hunting scenario cause it always changes. So if the wind is up I get closer, if it’s light I’ll shoot deer out to 820y. I set up a target a few weeks ago as I got a new range finder and wanted to check my drop was on. Target at 800y, I was on a ridge shooting down into a valley, was a bit gusty on the ridge but pretty calm in the valley. Shot a half MOA group so I figured my RF was on. Time to go cull some hinds.
Last roar I shot 11deer, one stag at 744y and 10 cull hinds between 400-700. I had one shot go too far back and had to follow up, but all the others were one shot kills. One animal went 20y down hill. The others all fell where they were shot. I typically practice at 800y and that’s a must if you want to shoot long range - practice long range.
Anything inside of 200m probably doesn't need any wind holds unless shooting 223, but you should always be considering it.
The wind above the gully will always be faster than what it feels/looks, wind also does funny things as it moves around terrain. It'll often be a different direction than what you think and/or contain some elevation elements.
Most people underestimate the wind, even people at shooting matches where you think they would know tend to greatly underestimate wind. Even having watched multiple shooters previously get mucked around by the same wind...
what cartridge and muzzle velocity @Bos?Quote:
Originally Posted by Bos
6.5 06
143 GR at 2850 fps
Instead of giving short'ish replies I'll just put it into a few films that hopefully will illuminate the subject.
Was kinda difficult to shape this to encompass everyone from entry level to expert, but here goes & cherrypick the info you want.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LRR3jobp7-A
I shot a stag a couple weeks ago at 230m with 7m08 140gr. Didn't allow for any wind, cause I couldn't feel any and didn't think about it. Bullet drifted from the shoulder into the neck, so very lucky.
I also happened to film the shot, and when watching back the video you can hear a gust of wind just as I shoot, and I shot from a sheltered spot across a gully. Doing the math back at home conservatively my bullet would have drifted 22cm!
Definitely a lesson for me to allow for wind even at that distance which I typically wouldn't worry about beyond not shooting in high winds.
What is your guys thoughts on using the federal blue box bullet 150 grain insted of the more expensive hornady sst 150 grain for ranges up to0 about 350 yard.
Long story short , Ive just brought a dial up scope (entry level leupold vx3) and am looking forward to shooting out a bit futher for deer.
I was using federal 180 grain for out too 200 yards and had fairly good groupings.
Oh Im shooting the federals from a weatherby vanguard 308.
