Just because I'm bored at work. This topic comes up every couple of years in the local media. $5.9 million to be spent. Opinions?
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/northern-...EV4AIOTGOVFBY/
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Just because I'm bored at work. This topic comes up every couple of years in the local media. $5.9 million to be spent. Opinions?
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/northern-...EV4AIOTGOVFBY/
ideologue vandals gonna ideologue vandal. (and siphon off vast amounts of taxpayers money into their own pockets) - its what these people do.
What I want to know is who told them? Sika are well known to be in Russell state forest, however I read in the herald that DoC were going to borrow fancy night vision from the USA to get them all. Mustn't have panned out. I thought there weren't many reds up there anyway.
"DoC’s Northern North Island director Sue Reed-Thomas said although Northland’s population of wild deer was small and scattered, immediate action was important as the animals have the potential to breed rapidly when food is abundant"
What a load of utter BS! Deer cant breed any more "rapidly" than the once per year. If that was possible the deer industry would be all over it improve their annual fawning rates, to increase production.
the worst part about it all is that the Regional Council are heavily involved - ooh well they likely end up with a very scattered population of very smart deer
"Mighty impressive northland sika stag in photo" just for some more sarcasm.
They have spent approx $6 million and intend at least another $1.5m and yet the DoC area manager Reed can only postulate that the sika herd albeit small may cost Northland a lot. Note the complete absence of any facts. Also note the hysterical timing of the media (TV) propaganda about tbis currently and coinciding with the twig and tweet attack on the fiordland wapiti herd. Rbe goats and possums in northland pose a more significant problem, including TB. Northland is fraught with lack of funding for critical infrastructure eg sewage and water and the .illions spent on a very minimal deer population point to an unrealistc allocatiln of public funds. Some conversation with Shane about regional devopement funds usage .ight be appropriate IMO. NEXT in line will be the poaka, while goats are not eradicated.
The sika cull is being undertaken by a well known pest contractor who has the most modern high tech gear and a helicopter.
Of all of the threats we face to our sport, keeping deer out of northland is probably the hardest one to argue against. Emotional responses wont cut it. And I see that NZDA are keeping out of the argument - good job.
I wasn't saying that deer in northland are a good thing or that they shouldn't be culled. I should have been more specific, I was under the impression that the people who knew which bits of private land had a red deer population on them were not publicizing it for obvious reasons. It sure is a long drive to taupo for northlanders that's for sure
One would have thought employment and roading would be better value for the money. Bureaucrats just love spending tax and rates money.
https://www.nrc.govt.nz/media/uhudli...an20172027.pdf
Pages 67 & 68
because they think they can have Northland deer free - except for the fallow herd South head ( well protected by landowners )
I would like to hear the argument that says you aren't. Just about every bit of deer related legislation and district/regional plan says you are or should be.
The horse bolted every were else years ago and deer are now unmanaged or unmanageable. "They" aren't going to let that happen up your way.
Tahr is right powers that be see deer free Northland as feasible - with Auckland as a barrier - and Northland forests are seen as unique they are not the same composition as say lower North Island - many contain kauri - - good kiwi populations in areas - a number of iconic species including endemic carnivorous snails- and many tree species not seen south of Auckland - no sorry mate I think any idea of a shootable deer population up there is a pipe dream - in saying that there are more deer around up there than people think - very small populations and some likely not going anywhere - but they are there - but their number is up - the only thing saving them is many will not report where deer are - as hunters we have to face the fact that many twigs and tweeters don't like deer and don't value them like we do
One off spring per year is no "more rapidly" than any other deer herd in NZ, hinds only cycle once a year, thats when we have the roar/rut. And sometimes, but not often, they will cycle again after the shortest day if they didnt get pregnant during the roar. And most deer mature for breeding when they are about 16 months old, or thereabouts. Theres nothing "more rapidly" about it, otherwise the roar would get earlier and earlier every year. However with more and better feed, more hinds may become pregnant when they cycle than in a lean year, and the population increase may be slightly more than other years. But then it may be lower in lean years to.
As with al things it will be a case of dimishing returns....Same with rabbits which is why I see pest free 2050 as an unobtainable own goal...(if they thought they could get rid of all pests in 25 years we would have done it a hundred years ago ......)
They will make a dent in the population quickly and cheaply initially, but as the herd thins, it will become harder to locate...They may make a 20% reduction for the budget they are quoting, but that same amount of money will not get the same amount next time and when they get below 40% the budget per animal will skyrocket....
As mentioned in another post, while these are goals they want to obtain, there are other far more beneficial things the same money could be used for that will make a bigger difference....
Predator Free 2050 is a pipe dream. We all know that.
you are right timattalon they could if they wished to do more for kiwi in Northland just get a better handle on roaming dogs which have taken a lot of kiwi in Northland - and cats for other wildlife -but they get the idea of total eradication in their heads and so often that's just not realistic - pest free 2050 is a complete joke - from the Napier Taupo road up to the Motu River is hundreds of thousands of hectares of bush almost all without any control - and they are going to have that free of possums and rats and stoats yeah right
You appear to be of the opinion that every hind will have a fawn every year regardless of the feed conditions they live in.
In some parts of the Kaimanawas where the area is over populated, only a small percentage of hinds have a fawn(search Cam Speedys research on this. Probably available on the Sika Foundation website).
Sika in Northland will be living in conditions with abundant feed.
They will have a higher fawning percentage than average. So they will be reproducing "more rapidly".
Agreed. It's a pipe dream. But aspirational too. Its motivated an extraordinary number of people to make a huge effort. People who otherwise would never go into the trees. Its motivated thousands of elderly into exercise. It's advanced pest reduction technology and approaches. It's got people talking and thinking about pests. And killed a few zillion pests too. So far I think that it's been a stunning success.
Dead right Tahr.
I have a bit to do with the Sika Foundation Whio project.
Newby people come along with a friend and after a day on a trap line they are hooked.
And they often come from circles which wouldn't usually come across such projects.
Next thing their mates are coming too.
My main issue is a goal has to be measurable , and obtainable or it will stop being a goal and start becoming an anchor......this pest free is a goal that can be measured....success will mean NO pests at all - total eradication....however it is unobtainable....the problem here is wnow, no matter what success they have at reducing pest populations, they will be seen to have failed.
Dont get me wrong, I think the reductionand management of pests needs to be done, and what they are doing to achieve this in most cases is working, but at some point they will start to question what else they have to do to achieve their goals.....
sorry Tahr me old china stunning success no what percentage of NZ has received treatment enough to say its a measurable success 3% 5% wont be any higher - and many of the areas are so small they will not sustain viable populations of a host of endemic species no we are failing and failing badly - the best we can hope for at present is a few intensively fenced and trapped " mainland islands " and off shore islands that will show what NZ was like - but 90% of NZ bush will likely remain either untreated or rarely treated
It's a tool. Part of the mix. Useful in certain contexts like broad acre control, and the most successful with some pests - viz wallaby. In some contexts not so much. Hopefully in time it will be replaced with something more acceptable. Im not anti 1080 - but am anti its inappropriate use (which is getting less) - especially without deer repellent in the mix.
By 2025 regardless of the goal not having been achieved (an impossible goal) I think the new culture of bashing pests with every tool available and ordinary people taking responsibility ought to be well embedded and the struggle will have a life of its own. That will be a big positive.
Stunning to me is the advanced protection of iconic species and ordinary New Zealanders getting their gumboots on. Whio, Kaka etc. I like the positive vibes and new enthusiasm for conservation. Wapiti Foundation, Sika Trust, Local NZDA trap lines (the Orua) etc. They are us. Bugger being surrounded by negativity.
its funny in a way...some of us have said right from begining the only way it could possibly work IS IN small plots..wee islands of protected spots so birds have a safe haven where they are able to breed in peace....peninsulas being obvious option for fencing but just like islands you got to keep ahead of pests getting back in.
if the Africans hadnt put the likes of white rhinos behind wire years back they would be gone completely....a sustainable population anywhere is better than species gone completely with no show of ever increasing.
Pipe dream nah...
https://predatorfreesouthwestland.nz/
12000ha of some of the most rugged and remotest land in NZ predator free.
https://predatorfreesouthwestland.nz/
4min.20 where the fella says " I've watched kaka disappear ", what a horrible thing to have to say.., that's what negativity results in, extinction...
With the advance of AI in traps I truly believe we will only get better in catching the bad guys.. Imagine a trap that says nope you are a kea sticking your head where it shouldn't, but a few hours later a cat sticks its head in and the trap says yip, here is some bad news. In a few years time that same trap may only need to be serviced every 12 or 24 months, uses sounds to attract its targets ? The possibilities are endless.
We are currently only scratching the surface with our crude traps of today..
I agree that the vision of predator free 2050 will never be achieved, what it has done however is bring focus to the issue and there are large numbers of people including volunteers involve obtaining some awesome results.
The promotion of the idea has brought in a lot of people who would otherwise never been involved in predator eradication and is giving focus on some of the major issues we have in the wild.
I recently saw details of the feral cat numbers in some regions, a station where we hunt on record the number of feral cats, they kill each year and in the last calendar year it was over 500. They have a very simple trapping system which continues to work, but I couldn't believe the numbers. They do a lot of Wallaby control so this may assist with the cat numbers in regard to a food supply, but still large numbers. This shows the scale of the problem and how a population can expand rapidly, which is not surprising given that a litter of kittens is often 4 or more.
I have spoken in length to one of the senior people involved in the eradication of the Russell Forest Sika, he has a lot of experience in this line of control work and the program will give them the best opportunity to finally eradicate the herd, or the hinds, which are the main target. If you look at the full plan its comprehensive and I was surprised at the depth of information they had on the herd. I actually found it very interesting, and it changed my view on the success of the program.
I for one fully support the eradiation as these deer should never have been released.