A question for the doubters

If the .223 is as superior as claimed you might want to let the guys over in Aus know that the wound channel and trauma is awesome and they can shoot their Rusa and Sambar with them.
I've shot a fair few animals with the .223, thousands, and this Rusa in particular took three 75gr eldms to die and made it quite a way. Quietly confident if I had one of my other rifles it wouldn't have made it far at all. Ended up in a prick of a spot. Was so sure of the shot placement that I didn't even reload, just watched it through the scope until I realised that it wasn't going to give up that easily.
Just one of several times I have learned that the .223 with good projectiles still isn't as capable or trustworthy as something bigger running good projectiles.

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If you miss a shot then that shot could have just as easily been a wounding shot. Like I have said before, seen plenty of deer wounded with the .223 never to be seen again, plenty of those animals wouldn't have made it far at all with the right projectiles in a larger caliber. Argue all you want, I have a few videos of deer being shot where they shouldn't and quite a few of them drop on the spot. Haven't seen that yet with the .223 to be honest.

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Originally Posted by Lucky

If you used 80gn ELDX at 2800 the 93.6gn bullet out of a .260 would have to be going 3276 to be its equal , that’s hauling ass .

Fair to say the .223 is an impressive for size caliber .

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Not quite jacket thickness doesn't increase typically with calibre size. Similar construction bullets act similarly across calibre ranges. Sectional density is what is ensuring sufficient penetration with the more explosive match projectiles.

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Originally Posted by Hunter_Nick

On the contrary - all power to you if you can shoot your big gun well! I can’t, so I use a small gun and feel more confident of a hit with it.

Apologies the start of the thread gave you the impression that I was hoping to belittle anyone. I was interested to know what physical evidence it would take to get others to believe what I and some others do. I think it’s probably about as difficult as convincing someone there are moose in NZ, even if you killed one.

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I think, judging from what I have read, that No one is doubting the 223 works for you and others. The unknown factor is how each of you chooses too use such a rifle and if it differs from how id use my, bigger rifle. Subconsciously bullet placement might well be different for. Gimp Talked about high shoulder and spine for example.

But I have a question in return. I dont suffer from recoil weariness, or flinch etc. Ill shoot my 270 just as well as I will my 223, when I had it. As far as I can remember, Ive only lost 1 animal in the last 7 years wounded.
What calibre would you recommend I pick up to take hunting, and why?

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Originally Posted by whanahuia

I think, judging from what I have read, that No one is doubting the 223 works for you and others. The unknown factor is how each of you chooses too use such a rifle and if it differs from how id use my, bigger rifle. Subconsciously bullet placement might well be different for. Gimp Talked about high shoulder and spine for example.

But I have a question in return. I dont suffer from recoil weariness, or flinch etc. Ill shoot my 270 just as well as I will my 223, when I had it. As far as I can remember, Ive only lost 1 animal in the last 7 years wounded.
What calibre would you recommend I pick up to take hunting, and why?

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That's an easy one. Bit like my decision to take 270 today. Bush stalking equals normally a quick shot and not perfect placement and windy as fook. If goats and or fallow your MAIN target species,yip take 223. If going for quiet walk on calm day to target meat for freezer,so not really after big staggypooh,yeah if want to take smaller rifle go for it,but be prepared to wait for good shot placement. Watch any of the videos tahr has put up.....that wait for good shot is a common theme,I'd just about bet rushies left nut a gun camera on gimps rifle would show the same delay/wait for best shot to present itself

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Originally Posted by Bushline

On private land? I’m assuming 204 calibre is illegal on DOC administered land?

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yes, will have mainly been private land knowing this Falla.... not sure about the rules there as I've never hunted doc land, I know you're not allowed rimfires (in most cases)

What caliber? The biggest one you can shoot well.

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Originally Posted by whanahuia

I think, judging from what I have read, that No one is doubting the 223 works for you and others. The unknown factor is how each of you chooses too use such a rifle and if it differs from how id use my, bigger rifle. Subconsciously bullet placement might well be different for. Gimp Talked about high shoulder and spine for example.

But I have a question in return. I dont suffer from recoil weariness, or flinch etc. Ill shoot my 270 just as well as I will my 223, when I had it. As far as I can remember, Ive only lost 1 animal in the last 7 years wounded.
What calibre would you recommend I pick up to take hunting, and why?

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If you haven’t previously used a 22 centrefire with 77TMK, 73, 80 or 88gr ELD-M, then take one of them hunting. Why? Well it’ll do the job, and you may just enjoy it.

And if like me,you still got slow twist barrel. The 63 grn sierra or 70 grn Speer might just let you dip in ya toes to see what all the fuss is about lmfao

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Originally Posted by Barry the hunter

well I believe we could all at least agree 223 will do the job but is not really ideal not compared to 308 270 7mm08 etc

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No. I much prefer my 223 over my 708 or my 308

Yip personal PREFERENCE...like blonds or redheads. Boobs vs bums. If it works for you and your comfortable with it,don't change just cause someone else says thiers is bigger than yours.

Faarrrrk I hope this 223 thing actually works, I've got my "ultimate" one in build (if you're listening Hardys hurry the fuck up with my barrel - please!)

I've shot fallow bucks, sika stags, red stags and a sambar stag with my .222 and .223. Also will top of neck and headshoot with the .223 to 300m (best conditions ) and expect to hit. Free hand top of neck and headshoot deer to 60-80m.
But i still wont take my .223 roar/rut hunting, especially in the bush or rough tight country. That would just be asking for a screw up. Tough, swollen necked, pumped up stags, scrub/brush before the animal or mental pressure to take the "trophy" antlers are all factors that will ruin an otherwise easy shot. Human ability and 224 projectiles arent up to
all of those challenges. Your discipline of when not to shoot would have to be bloody solid!
Also lack of exit wounds on alot of shots would make tiger country blood tracking a nightmare.

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Originally Posted by Roarless20

I've shot fallow bucks, sika stags, red stags and a sambar stag with my .222 and .223. Also will top of neck and headshoot with the .223 to 300m (best conditions ) and expect to hit. Free hand top of neck and headshoot deer to 60-80m.
But i still wont take my .223 roar/rut hunting, especially in the bush or rough tight country. That would just be asking for a screw up. Tough, swollen necked, pumped up stags, scrub/brush before the animal or mental pressure to take the "trophy" antlers are all factors that will ruin an otherwise easy shot. Human ability and 224 projectiles arent up to
all of those challenges. Your discipline of when not to shoot would have to be bloody solid!
Also lack of exit wounds on alot of shots would make tiger country blood tracking a nightmare.

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Wow.
You're going to be in trouble for saying that.
I'm starting to get the feeling 223 users are a bit like vegans.
How do you know they use one?
Don't worry, they'll tell you. (Don't take it too seriously)

In the back blocks of NZ, on rough hill country farms aways from people that worry about stuff like this, more deer are shot with the .223 Remington every year than all the other cartridges put together.

^^^ Oh deer, that's nailed it.