Wanted : Clarification on grazing rights on DOC land

Hi team, I'm just looking for some clarification around what complications grazing concessions on DOC land might cause. Am I right in assuming such a concession doesn't give the farmer exclusive use of the land? I'm just looking at a spot where the road buts right up against the DOC land according to LINZ, walking access, and doc maps but it looks like a farmer may be grazing the easiest access point. Am I within my rights to walk through this part? Obviously would never even consider messing with livestock or anything that even remotely looks like it might be the farmer's property. Thanks in advance!

Depends on time of year, lambing and calving can cause issues for farmers....contact the farmer then you will know....

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@Barry the hunter

what has your local DOC had to say???

Also have a chat with local DOC, they should be able to advise...no one likes a run in with angry people, at least knowing what you can do and being in contact with farmer will help

Hamish

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DOC hasn't responded. It looks more like a loading yard for stock trucks so likely no stock in it. Would literally be walking across that yard (approx 20m). Should be able to walk around without crossing that even but won't know til I get boots on the ground.

Ring the farmer and ask him. I hunt an area with the same arrangement except two farmers have grazing rights on the same stretch of river banks. I always ring both to check it is okay, although I do have to cross a short section of private land to access the public land.

Both farmers have always been great to deal with, even to the extent of allowing me to use their private huts. Another advantage in talking to them is that they can inform you of any other hunters in the area (that have bothered to phone them), and also let other hunters know you are there.

Been unable to find any details re farmer otherwise I would. Will circumvent the questionable bit this time as plenty of roadside access, will just have to cross stream.

A response from DOC about an OIA request i did ages ago as the local office wouldnt get back to me.

Regarding the grazing concession in the Rawhitiroa Conservation Area and Waitotara
Cosnervation Area, both concessions are listed as a license. Under the Conservation
Act 1987, a license does not grant the concessionaire exclusive possession of the land.
Therefore, both hunters and the general public are allowed to access the land. This is
also reiterated in the concession grazing contracts “the land is open for public
access”.
However, for hunters, they must have the appropriate open area permit to hunt. The
Department does have the authority to put restrictions on hunting in the area. Please
confirm with your local DOC office if hunting or other access restrictions are in place

TLDR. Grazing concession doesn't grant exclusive use of that land. So they cannot restrict the general public access to that area. BUT can restrict hunting. That should be covered under your hunting permit/ restrictions for that block.

If there's access that doc have arranged with farmer.There should be a sign there saying so with map on it.

So to me i interpret that as.
If you have a hunting permit for that area, and there is no restrictions you are good. - double check with a call to doc office before going there is no restrictiions.

I had that email and permit in my pack for one farmer who is quite hostile and thought he had exclusive use of some area.
But just like paper roads. - Just because you have a right to be there sometimes it isnt worth the hassle and drama with the landowner / farmer tho thinks otherwise.

Cheers that sounds right. DOC site lists no restrictions, is there anywhere else they'd be detailed? Says open permit area, which I have.

Will pop into doc with the map on my lunchbreak

Interested to hear how you get on. That farmer is known to be less than helpful

I think I know the farm you guys are talking about but no different spot sorry. No concession over where I'm going but will tread lightly. A lot of old handshake arrangements around here that never got documented. Tricky when not even DOC know for sure.

Bit of info here.https://www.herengaanuku.govt.nz/typ...d-legal-roads/ Handshake agreements and paper road misunderstanding should go down the shitter.

Yep some of that information that's publicly available (like if you just treated a doc map as gospel) could cause safety issues if relied on 100%

With my grazing concession I can keep people off during lambing/calving from August to December. I don't actually keep people out during that time but it's nice to know I could remove someone if they were causing trouble. Like others have said ask doc or the farmer with the concession. The walking access commission has said it's to complicated to incorporate it into their website so it would be up to me to let people know.

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I think you’re overthinking this.
If doc have issued you a permit to hunt the area, and you can drive right to it, then you’re good to go.
If you weren’t allowed in there doc wouldn’t give you a permit.
If there’s conditions or restrictions, they will be on your permit.

Might seem simple but good to get a proper understanding of things if you are unsure. And especially if people are unfamiliar with the doc permit system

Much better than making the assumption you're allowed to be there when your not.
Especially if he runs into the farmer who likes to think otherwise.

if any of you guys in Taranki want some advice on grazing etc DOC land give me a phone call ( 0276733881 ) leave text and I can give you a time to call me - very busy on tractor at present - in past life I was DOC and part of my job was to inspect grazing concessions across Taranaki and I have visited most of them some more than once - I don't know of any in Taranaki that have restrictions on them but have been gone from DOC now 10 years so someone may have arranged one for lambing - The only area that has one in place is Murumuru Conservation Area that has a lambing restriction - that one really needs challenging as its pretty dodgy as to risk - any way in general a grazing concession only gives the stock owner the right to graze and nothing else - as stated on here anyone with a hunting permit can hunt it - but some regard it as a exclusive lease which it is not

Confirming the above, in 1988/89 all Govt departments moved away from issuing multiple year grazing LEASES over Crown land to annually renewable and reviewable grazing licences. The former came with the ability to exclude the Public. The latter permit the grazier to only "depasture livestock" The end. Only occasionally may a farmer be able to exclude the public during lambing.

Kind of interesting. In the mid 90s i was farming in the Taranaki and doc wanted me to pay grazing on a block along one boundary. I never took up the option so never saw the document, but it was always talked of by Doc as a lease, not a concession.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by whanahuia

Kind of interesting. In the mid 90s i was farming in the Taranaki and doc wanted me to pay grazing on a block along one boundary. I never took up the option so never saw the document, but it was always talked of by Doc as a lease, not a concession.

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definitely a concession now - at a quess I looked after 20 in Taranaki_ cheap grazing

Yeah they were. At the time, DOC had a couple of managers who, to be fair were quite combative when it came to dealing with the farming community and they did quite a bit of harm relationship wise. The guy that looked after the grazing concessions/leases, was a nice guy and if I had have only had to deal with him, I would have probably taken it up. But the other two seemed to think that because it was there it gave them an access and use right or excuse to my place. I felt that signing an agreement was putting my self at risk.
It got so bad, that I went from allowing doc to use my shearers quarters, too stipulating that they fly over my place rather than drive through, just so that there was no misinterpretation of what I would allow on my place.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by whanahuia

Yeah they were. At the time, DOC had a couple of managers who, to be fair were quite combative when it came to dealing with the farming community and they did quite a bit of harm relationship wise. The guy that looked after the grazing concessions/leases, was a nice guy and if I had have only had to deal with him, I would have probably taken it up. But the other two seemed to think that because it was there it gave them an access and use right or excuse to my place. I felt that signing an agreement was putting my self at risk.
It got so bad, that I went from allowing doc to use my shearers quarters, too stipulating that they fly over my place rather than drive through, just so that there was no misinterpretation of what I would allow on my place.

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yes they turned to shit just before I left - all done from Taupo without any local knowledge - the bee side of it was worse - they were just giving out bee concessions to put hives on DOC land based on a paper map exercise from Taupo - a lot of cases neighbouring famers did not know a damn thing until either truck turned up with hives or helicopter flew over with hives - where was your land I probably knew it

End of Marco rd.

The bee one was a classic! First I knew of it, and this is some years later when I moved too the King country, I see a chopper flying hives onto the back of my farm. I investigate and it turns out one of the big bee companies was knowingly flying hives in right next too the small family company hives that were on my place. We are talking a family of beekeepers who did things really well and were local and had not too many hives for the area in a sustainable manor- 16 hives on this location- the big company landed 40 hives within 150 meters just too destroy the opposition.
But the DOC concession area they had had no clearings and the only place they could put the hives was along the outside of the boundary fence. Which actually was inside the title boundary by 10-20 meters. They all, Doc and the big company went into a tailspin when I gave them a week over Xmas to remove them before I started burning hives, as I was an organic farm and they were threatening my status through not being or having certification.

Big read but covers some stuff for this post.https://newsroom.co.nz/2023/12/04/af...q93i0zpisCvB3g