Want to know if the security is exactly the same as E-cat ie, do you have to show an engineers certificate for your safe to hold pistols in?
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Want to know if the security is exactly the same as E-cat ie, do you have to show an engineers certificate for your safe to hold pistols in?
Yes same rules so engineers cert needed if asked for.
Had my B for 17 years and never been asked for a cert. My B (and E) safe is the same old bank safe I started with.
Gonna buy a new one eventually but fir now it works for me
Yep same rules for B & E safe. and yes I have been asked if my safe was certified.
Oh true, so do they check you every year onced your endorsed with a B or E?
Is it just a visit to the endorsed person or all of the refeeres aswell?
Just a visit to check the safe, confirm if it still complies, check the building, doors, windows, security, who lives at the premises and see if all complies. Write all this down on a sheet of paper to be filed and signed off. Then a check to see the serial numbers of the inspected firearms match their records...............often they dont. All this every 2 years but as stated above, B and E means a visit pretty much every year for one or the other.
I'm not sure on the current policy for checking Endorsed licence holders.Quote:
Originally Posted by 7mmwsm
I've had my security checked once since 1992 and that was only because I notified the AOS of a change of address.
However I do know that they check the range book every year to make sure you have completed your 6 shoots.
Our secretary also makes everyone complete a statement every year listing our range days attended in that year which is then forwarded onto the AOS for their records.
Also a Police Officer can check your security anytime they feel like. You may have a knock on the door and a spot check will be carried out immediately.
This has never happened to me but I know of others that it has.
Cheers
Pete
Looks like its another case of every area does things their own way :|
I've had my B for over 6 years and this year was the first time they came for an annual inspection. The vetting person had a list of my pistols to check the serial numbers for but not for my endorsed rifles.
I've never been asked to show an engineers certificate but my safe was checked physically for compliance.
Are you allowed to hunt with pistols?
Unfortunately No!Quote:
Originally Posted by Toby
You an only use your pistol on an approved range.
Oh right, That's pretty dumb then
YepQuote:
Originally Posted by Toby
Hunting with a pistol is on my bucket list.
At this stage a hunting trip to the USA is the only possible way I can see how it can be done.
What are the reason's why we cant hunt with them?
IMO, I would think that hunting with pistols is a no-go because of the safety factor. Us Kiwi's seem to be pretty good at shooting eachother (people in same hunting party) with a long, bulky rifle. Imagine how easy it would be to swing around a four inch barrel and accidently put a bullet somewhere you didn't want one.Quote:
Originally Posted by Toby
I have been to the range with a few mates that had such poor weapon handling skills (with a rifle) that I refuse to shoot with them again. I would hate to see them with a pistol! They are still my mates but we won't play with rifles around each other. This also goes the same with a few friends with their E and B cats with pistols - I have only two people I trust with exceptional handling skills that I will go to the range for a pistol shoot with.
I can't really think of any good reason why a suitably endorsed individual shouldn't be allowed to hunt with a handgun or shoot it on a farm. Apart from maybe some imagined risk to "public safety", which is moot as pistol shooters get vetted to a ridiculous level. B cat holders are trained in gun handling to a very high standard, incidents are few.
Shit happens that life. people keep crashing cars but they dont take cars off people.
Yep theres plenty of muppets with firearms licences ... including B endorsements.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dougie
I've personally seen at least a dozen people DQed while competing in pistol competition for poor safety. One guy shot the ground between his feet. :(
I can't think of a valid reason why handgun hunting cannot be allowed in NZ.
Dougie I wouldn't be hunting with a 4" barreled pistol. These are more suited to self defense and close quarter use.
I'd be hunting with a 8" to 12" barreled "Hunting" pistol.
BTW I can leagally hunt with a Rossi 44mag 16" BBL rifle, why could I not hunt with a Ruger Redhawk 44mag revolver with a 12" bbl?
Cheers
Pete
I reckon it would be pretty fun chasing goats around in the Manuka with a Glock.
Hunting pistols would be pretty cool. Even still - like you said, there are idiots out there. Even if the arms officer says someone is fit and proper to own a firearm, I like to make that decision myself before heading out with them.Quote:
Originally Posted by P38
Good on you Pete. That guy seems lucky to still have two feet!
I remember when we first started clay birds at school we were at the range and one guy closed the gun and somehow shot the trap house thing, We found it pretty funny back then but now I kinda think the guys at the range were silly not explaining much about guns to us kids.
Hmm this is true Toby, but my advice to you would be to be careful. I know I don't have many years on you but there are still things that can only be learned with time and maturity. Make sure you don't get yourself into trouble. A few of your posts here have made me a little worried at times! Be careful while you're out there doing your thing and having fun! :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Toby
I am a bit rough around the edges so I have been told.
One simple reason why hunting with pistols isn't allowed is CONTROL. Police control movement of pistols by only allowing their movement between home and licensed range or home and gunsmith. Until recently special permission had to be obtained to take a pistol away from home overnight. let people take them hunting and they would be everywhere at any time, ie no control.
Police do not currently control the movement of any pistol, however there are the restrictions on movement as you have pointed out.Quote:
Originally Posted by compound
Still no reason to not allow a Pistol to be used for hunting.
I wouldn't be opposed to obtaining a pistol hunting permit to allow this sport to take place in NZ.
And lets not kid ourselves .... Pistols are ligitimately everywhere at all times in NZ already.
Cheers
Pete
Id be keen to hunt rutting sika stags with a scoped 454 cassull.
I've been hunting pigs and deer with a friend in Germany. He carried a pistol not for hunting, but for quickly, safely and humanely putting an animal down that was still alive after he shot it with his rifle.
I understand if you're an large land owner in Aussie you can carry a pistol for hunting, but you can't take it to the range for target shooting!
I reckon you should be able to hunt with a pistol here, with the right training. Sure would be handy around the farm for putting down sick animals. Will have to stick with the Savage Shorty 22 for the time being!
a pistol would also be gold for bailed pigs.
and for when you dont expect to see a deer but there may be one lurking around
both suituations fully not worth the wrath of the NZ police and court system taking all your toys away.
What I hate is that if you are trained by the government to use pistols and are authorised to carry pistols while working in the public then why the fuk do you need to get a civilian at the pistol club to say you are good enough to own a pistol. Really grinds my gears.
I can see why they aren't allowed for hunting, they aren't practical in comparison to a rifle. However shooting them on a farm I see no problem with but now I am beginning to blur the difference between the two in my own mind. Mind you some people would carry one around in their car the whole time and if caught would just say they were going hunting with it.
Making Pistols more accessible to the general public scares the shit out of me. But I do respect the people that use them for sport.
A bows not practical compared to a rifle people still do it. Pistol hunting is just another type of hunting, no one said give them to general public but open the uses of them up a bit. I would get a B cat if they were made legal to hunt with but for now I wont because I don't find all that work just to shoot paper worth while. your going to get idiots anywhere but restricting everyone isn't the best way to go about solving issues.
I honestly can't see what harm could come of it. People hunt successfully with handguns in the US, and other places. As Bill said a pistol would be absolute gold as a bail gun. My grandfather used to use one. I guess it comes down to ignorance and fear at the end of the day. It's the control thing the rule makers and enforcers don't want to lose a grip on.
I dissagree.Quote:
Originally Posted by Savage1
Hunting pistols are as every bit as practical as a rifle.
I have a S&W model 22a that shoots as good as any .22 rifle I own. It would make an awesome hunting pistol for small game out to 100m.
The HMS shooters would also dissagree ... they accurately shoot out to 100m with the rimfires and 200m with the centerfires.
All these targets are animals for a reason. The sport evolved from Hunting.
I'd love to be able to Hunt with a handgun in NZ but are resigned to having to travell overseas to do so. :(
I was having a look around the net one day and cam across this
X-Large Frame (X) - Smith & Wesson
Its a .460 S&W Magnum Its got enough knock down to take elk / Wapiti out to 250m and reading on Accurate reloading forums people have taken large brown bears over 250 metres with it.
So i decided that i really wanted to own this gun, I went and talked to the arms officer and the local gun range.
I signed up and after completing in a whole load of sunday morning shooting and doing way over the required ( 12 shoots a year ) and having the Local guy give me the thumbs up for my handling and safety practices.
I was told that i had no chance of getting it because i am classed as a boy racer.
Now tbh I do go out cruising and out to the drags and skids but my only offence / ticket has been failed to give way to a railway vehicle.
I do have a fairly modified car but its 100% road legal and a certification for everything including wheels and ride height ( no its not dragging is ass on the ground )
Now i am not all that worried about it, I only wanted it because i liked that gun but couldn't shoot it up there anyway because it was to big for the range,
I was told that a guy had a desert eagle 50cal and lost his licence a, b and c after getting court shooting it up there.
It was fun and i got to shoot a lot of members different guns maybe one day I will try again, have to take up a police friendly friday night sport like drinking and heading to town :P
P.S if someone has the above handgun i would LOVE a shot :thumbsup:
I can see the harm, wounded animals because they cannot be handled as accurately as a rifle. Sure pistols are accurate but that all turns to shit in the heat of the moment. My rifle can shoot sub MOA but buggered if i can do that on goats. I guess maybe the law sees firearms in hunting as a tool, in which case in virtually every situation the role can be filled more safely and effectively with a rifle.Quote:
Originally Posted by Beavis
It doesn't come down to ignorance and fear, it comes down to how easy they are to conceal and how deadly they are.
It's easy to say it is a control thing wanted by the the enforcement officers and law makers when you are not the one who is having to deal with it when things go wrong.
Not trying to have a go, I just think it's important to look at it from the other side to.
But they are still giving pistol's to people to keep at their house and go to the range with B-cats all ready, The only thing that should change is that B class licence holders should be able to hunt with them, If your going to trust them to keep it at their house why cant you trust them to hunt with them?
I dont agree about the killing thing, how many people with rifles still screw up shots? I have never shot a pistol but im sure a regular pistol shooter will kill deer just as easy as me with a rifle.
Personally I would consider a rifle far more deadly if used for nefarious purposes. But Ï'm talking about a B endorsed shooter using their gun for hunting. Just cuz you may not have sufficent skill to use on for hunting, doesn't mean everbody else is the same.Quote:
Originally Posted by Savage1
+1Quote:
Originally Posted by Beavis
A person walking down the street, you can see if they have a rifle, not a pistol. It's the conceal-ability that makes the pistol so dangerous.Quote:
Originally Posted by Beavis
In reality a rifle is better for hunting, so it would be hard to get any change to allow pistols to be used in hunting as there is no need for them in that situation.
Although what you saying is right about concealment it isn't making a difference, They still give pistols to people with licence's whats stopping them hiding it? Opening to hunting is just making use of them, some people like hunting not just shooting paper. once again you seem to miss that people hunt with bows when rifles are far more better suited.Pistol hunting will just become another style of hunting. It is the person not the gun doing the damage. Don't blame tools for mans failure.