Thread: Barrel length considerations

Kia Ora Te forum.

After you all convinced me to ditch my 6.5x55 musings and knuckle down to a .308, I have spent the last couple of months weighing up which rifle I should get

I have largely settled on a Tikka T3X Lite. I know it's a little cliché, a little light and a touch more expensive than some, but its reputation for accuracy and the great action have won me over.

As I'm still waiting on the FAL to walk into the letterbox, I took a little research trip to some outdoor stores. One I saw had a T3X carbine. I've combed through Tikka's website for a month or more and haven't seen that term used. The salesman told me it was exactly the same except it had a 16 inch barrel instead of 20.

So, based on my little bit of knowledge - always a dangerous thing - this would make the rifle shorter (duh!) and lighter. But I'm worried about what I don't know. Namely, how will the shorter barrel affect accuracy, bullet speed, loudness and felt recoil? I will be fitting a DPT suppressor which makes it near enough to a 20 inch barrel again. Though, I suppose, if I just got a standard 20 inch barrel, the suppressor would extend it to 24ish inches.

Also, is the "carbine" designation legit? Has this outfit just gunsmithed a rifle, voiding the warranty?

For context, this will be a mostly bush and clearings rifle with the occasional shot over open farmland courtesy of some friends of friends. I will not get into long range shooting: 250 to 300 meters will be the maximum on game.

Thanks in advance.

.308 works very efficiently out of 16-20" barrels. 20" is about the max I'd run in 308 for a hunting rifle. 16-18" is the sweet spot for firepower and length.

Was it the lack of full pressure factory ammo that deterred you from the 6.5 x 55?

308s are good. I'd trim down a regular tikka to 18 or 19inches myself with factory ammo.

A 243 might also suit your purposes. They are easier to shoot well for some and plenty enough out to 300m.

6.5 creedmore or 7mm08 have reasonable amount of factory ammo as well.

The lack of full power factory ammo was the major factor.

I spent a lot of time considering the .243. In the end I was convinced by Nathan Foster's observations that there are no prizes for knocking down an animal with the smallest bullet. Particularly as a beginner, I will be grateful for the greater leeway afforded by the larger calibre.

As for the other calibres, the near ubiquity of the .308 is most of the reason that it feels like a good calibre for a new hunter.

Furthermore, sorry if it feels like constant nonsense updates...

But, I think I'll be shooting a 150 grain bonded bullet: either a Federal Fusion or a Sako Super Hammerhead. Whatever it is, it's definitely factory ammo. Any feedback, whānau?

Chur.

Originally Posted by iambatman

Kia Ora Te forum.


So, based on my little bit of knowledge - always a dangerous thing - this would make the rifle shorter (duh!) and lighter. But I'm worried about what I don't know. Namely, how will the shorter barrel affect accuracy, bullet speed, loudness and felt recoil? I will be fitting a DPT suppressor which makes it near enough to a 20 inch barrel again. Though, I suppose, if I just got a standard 20 inch barrel, the suppressor would extend it to 24ish inches.


For context, this will be a mostly bush and clearings rifle with the occasional shot over open farmland courtesy of some friends of friends. I will not get into long range shooting: 250 to 300 meters will be the maximum on game.

Thanks in advance.

so your three concerns : will it effect accuracy ...... no bullet will land whereever your scope is setup for
will it effect speed maybe but a 308 out to 300 would still be effective i dont believe 308 needs to maintain the high velocitys at range to suit your purpose
recoil and loudness will be cancelled out by the suppresor

so have at it

Iv had four 308s over the yrs,22in,20in,18in,16in.All with gunworks suppressers.The 16in quiet loud even with the suppresser on.Settled with the 18in tikka,nice ballance,quietish,little recoil and accurate.No problem tipping deer over out to 400-500yds using Hornady Superformance 150gr ssts.

In principle, shorter barrels can be more accurate but not enough to notice in a hunting rifle.
A shorter barrel will have less muzzle velocity than a longer (about 25 fps per inch) so some people try to make up for that by diligent reloading. Waste of time in my opinion. Just shoot and enjoy. You have energy to spare with the 308.
As you already know a short barrel is lighter, making it harder to hold still and having more recoil. The T3 is already a light rifle and will kick.
The main effect is that a 16" barrel is VERY LOUD. You will be committed to using a suppressor. If you have 22" you will be able to use it comfortably without a suppressor.
Once you use a suppressor, recoil and noise are sorted. So is any worry about shortness.

Originally Posted by iambatman

The lack of full power factory ammo was the major factor.

I spent a lot of time considering the .243. In the end I was convinced by Nathan Foster's observations that there are no prizes for knocking down an animal with the smallest bullet. Particularly as a beginner, I will be grateful for the greater leeway afforded by the larger calibre.

As for the other calibres, the near ubiquity of the .308 is most of the reason that it feels like a good calibre for a new hunter.

FUCK! Nathan messes with a newbie again!!!!! NoNoNo and bloody No!!! Use the right pill, learn animal anatomy and .243 is a more decisive killer than .308 on deer out to 300. There are a number of us on here and in the hunting world in general that kill plenty up close and far away, and really big deer/Tahr same result as small. Yes I'm biased, but my bias is based on my results with both cartridges. Some .243 factory ammo is great, Hornady Superformance 95SST and the cheaper Federal blue box 100gn two of the best offerings, either of those will cleanly kill any normal game animal out to a sensible distance.

Don't go believing horseshit about .243 bouncing off pigs bla bla bla. It is all about where you put it, people cock up with 300 mags and injure animals, no shortage of power there....

I hunt mostly open country, and I'm more likely to grab my .243 than .270 and my freezer stays well stocked.

Whatever you wind up with, figure out what ammo it likes, then buy plenty of it while you can.

Yes, I would say Fosters observations/assertions are fairly conservative. (Which is prolly a good thing)

I've recently been 'shocked' at how well a 223 was smacking deer and pigs @~200m night shooting for instance.

Greater range of factory offerings in .308, and if you can't get it anywhere they don't actually sell ammunition. .243 is usually available, but often with less options than the .308.

With the right pill positioned well .243 will drop anything, but .308 with the right pill drops anything betterer with a bit more tolerance for poor placement (although if you shoot the toes neither will kill). I've seen a 150gr .308 break up on the wallow mud shield on the shoulder of a stag, wide shallow wound and a lost animal. But a .243 even with a top grade bullet would not achieve anything better there - going to a stouter 165gr .308 pill by comparison has returned zero failures to date.

16" barrel is fine with .308, but make sure you get a suppressor and learn about caring for suppressed rifles...

But a light 16" barrelled 308 is going to knock you around, even with a silencer.
For a new shooter using factory ammo you should look at 243 or 7m08,
Followed by the question why do you feel the need to go down to 16".

Most guys who Bush hunt do so typically with 20-22"barrels as they use 1 rifle for a range of hunting.
I have been known to leave my silencer at home Bush hunting but I was carrying low power ammo.
Z

Originally Posted by Longrun

Yes, I would say Fosters observations/assertions are fairly conservative. (Which is prolly a good thing)

I've recently been 'shocked' at how well a 223 was smacking deer and pigs @~200m night shooting for instance.

Nathan Foster's opinions are whatever he has read somewhere else on the internet. Ignore that site in its entirety.

The .243 (this is based on actual experience not reading the internet) is an excellent killer on red deer, fallow deer, tahr and chamois. The fastest kills I have ever made have been with the .243 (or the .25/06)

As for this notion that you have "more tolerance for poor shot placement with a larger caliber"- this is also horseshit. You don't. Thats the reality of shooting large animals. A bad shot with a .243 is also a bad shot with a .308 or a .303. Let me put it another way - there is nowhere you can shoot a deer badly with a .308 and still kill it, that a .243 won't have the same result.
In fact, in my experience the .243 for both velocity reasons and bullet construction, will often do more damage to a deer than a .308.

How did they manage to talk you out of a 6.5x55? Great cartridge too. Easy to shoot and will go everything you want. Use Sellier and Bellot factory ammo, or start reloading. (120 grain 6.5 bullet at 2950fps will do everything you need and more.)

Look, nothing wrong with a .308, but a .243 is a vicious killer easily its equal on deer and doesnt kick hardly at all. But you are going to want a full barrel length for that one.

Dont get a .308 with less than 20 inch barrel. And you dont need a supressor to kill deer. You've got enough to carry.

Just get a normal Tikka T3 in .308 or .243, or if you can find one, in 6.5x55. Then you are in business. Then start reloading for whatever you get.

.308 great choice for the newbie in terms of killing power, bush buck ability and availability of factory ammo. I have a cheapie marlin X7 that works great with an 18" barrel, with a DPT suppressor, works great.
Dropped a deer on the spot at 50m just last month. My .308 kicks more than my .300wsm but still very manageable.
Just my 2c

N Foster, did give the swede a bit of a bad wrap, its and excellent calibour, more capable than a lot of the new 6.5 offerings. Reloading it in a modern rifle, to higher pressures with good pills is the answer.
Having said that, I have always had a 308 and it always gets the job done, a lot to like about the 308.