Thread: ERMA-WERKE Model E M1-22

A mate owns a German ERMA-WERKE Model E M1-22 and has been having trouble with rounds not feeding smoothly and jamming.

I rather foolishly offered to dismantle it and clean it for him ("Fools rush in where angels fear to tread!") based on the fact that is was filthy dirty and had possibly NEVER been dismantled and cleaned. Also with my experience with dismantling and cleaning my Brno 581 and Ruger 10-22 it should be a breeze? Right? WRONG!!! What a fricken complicated firearm!!! Makes me real appreciate the simplicity of the engineering of the 581 and 10-22! I've got the main parts dismantled and clean, but am hesitating to dismantle the actual trigger assembly following warnings of YouTube about (at least two) springs which are under tension and if they go "PING" you will never be able to buy a replacement! So I've just soaked the trigger assembly in white spirits, brushed and air blasted it as best I can.

Google saved the day and I have found a very detailed PDF of dismantling and assembling the ERMA. Up until that point I had a "spare" piece sitting on my work bench, after the rifle was fully assembled! WTF!!!!???

The question is, "What Brand, weight, velocity of ammunition, do other ERMA-WERKE owners find cycles best in the M1-22?" This rifle is not threaded for a suppressor, but the owner has been firing sub-sonic ammunition. Does the ERMA work better with super-sonic? What is your experience please?

The Gunsmith has told me, "You can frick around for hours with one of those ERMA's and never get them to cycle well! They are basically a turd in a bird bath and you might at as well chuck it away and buy a decent firearm!" What's your thoughts?

Your just going to have to try a bunch of different ammo. Got a sportco a bit like that. Thought Id found the ammo it liked but then a box and a half later it decided it didnt like it anymore, and of course the other ammo it liked you cant get it anymore. At least this one is easy to clean...

The honest answer is even different guns of the same make can vary. The first thing to check is the mag, if the lips look worn then that is quite often the problem.

As to ammo simply try lots of different types, including hi and low velocity and hollow point AND solid points, a lot of these older guns were designed for an old solid round nose.

My guess is that the rifle is designed to shoot high-velocity ammo and using standard velocity ammo means that you dont get the recoil impetus to operate the bolt in the required manner. Its a common issue with many semi autos - they are regulated to shoot high velocity and just dont like low powered ammo.

Trial and error with lots of makes of ammo is your only real answer.

Thanks for the feedback and suggestions.

Yes, I agree with Isaac Newtown, "For ever action there is and equal and opposite reaction." Which in firearms speak means there must be an optimal combination of bullet weight, powder charge, velocity and therefore, rearward inertia to operate the the semi automatic action.

In additional to the operation of the action, there is also smoothness of round feed from the magazine to the breech, this could be impacted by projectile shape, then the final part of the equation is accurate grouping and knock-down effectiveness.

I've dug deep into by squirreling and have found six different 22LR projectiles to try:
- Winchester Subsonic 42grn Max HP @ 1065fps
- Winchester 555 HV 36grn HP @ 1280fps
- CCI Subsonic 40grn HP @ 1050fps
- CCI Standard Velocity Target 40grn SOLID @ 1070fps
- CCI HV 40grn Segmented HP @ 1235fps
- Browning BPR 40grn HP @ 1435fps

So within that sample of bullet shapes, bullet weights and velocities, I hope to find the sweet spot.

Can you report back on the results of HV vs LV/ Standard V ammo please

Originally Posted by sportco62

Can you report back on the results of HV vs LV/ Standard V ammo please

Will do

Germany makes good quality firearms that last a long time and give little trouble right? yeah sometimes, ermas .22's were never high quality rifles and wear out as quick as the next mass produced, diecast crap from other countries. They were never known for accuracy or reliability.
To have to try all sorts of ammo to find 1 that would function would erk me no end. Sorry, rant over. Excellent advise from the gunsmith!

@sportco62 Long delay in reporting back, but I did get the Erma back to the owner within 20 days, so no need to shift it from one registered owner to another.

CCI HV 40grn Segmented HP @ 1235fps was the most reliable and grounded like a shotgun. I still found it wouldn't pickup the first cartridge from the magazine, using the charge handle. The was around that was to manually insert the first round inthe the breech with your fingers. One that round was fired it would happy pickup rounds from the magazine reasonably reliable.

I think there is a fundamental design defect in that the 22 magazine is centrally position in the original 30 CAL magazine, which means the incoming round has to leap a gap which is 12 -15mm wide. That leap could have been reduced it the 22 magazine was further forward.

Also the tounges on the top of the magazine were bent and or flared outwards.

Anyway the client is happy and can hit rabbits out to 50m reliably.

Note to self: Never buy an ERMA!

I had ann erma lever action 22lr. Nice little rifle and was accarate enough for possums etc. Just didnt use it enough so sold it and was surprised what I got for it. The 30 day thing looks easy to get around, take it over to him hand it to him explain what youve done so far he hands it back youve got another 30 days?