Here are the details. Please make an effort to attend.
Attachment 125304
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Here are the details. Please make an effort to attend.
Attachment 125304
Protests don't achieve anything. Quite often whether intended or it makes it worse for the cause you are trying to protest about. Waste of time.
Have you seen the reaction via TV...... a lot of sniggering behind hands, is my opinion. I dont think it portrays the shooting fraternity well, its hard to "ramp up" a firearms protest too ....then it just escalates via media into "shocking" and "threatening" behaviour
I think public meetings such as what is happening in Tauranga tonight are a more realistic way forward.
Lets just curl up and die
why the fuck are we supposed to be protesting outside a school? this is how you make yourself look bad. You decide to move it outside the PMs electorate office I'm in.
its a hard one if we cant get media onsideQuote:
Originally Posted by Maca49
personally i will never fly air nz as a form of protest n i let them know,,if you take the dollars from the big boys they will soon note their displeasure with the authorities
its a hard one if we cant get media onsideQuote:
Originally Posted by Maca49
personally i will never fly air nz as a form of protest n i let them know,,if you take the dollars from the big boys they will soon note their displeasure with the authorities
Jacinda is going to be there.Quote:
Originally Posted by coltace
I know she's going to be there, but a school? jesus, do the math, you want to be seen right?, do you think people are going to be sympathetic to our cause if we protest about guns at a fucking school? I would no more protest a children's school than children's hospital. The PM doesn't care about us, she has made that clear, so you're not doing it to make her change her mind, so you must be doing it for the media to see you right? So why in gods name would you want to do it in front of a fucking PRIMARY SCHOOL!
THINK OF THE OPTICS........ put these two words together and ask a member of the public to make a sentence with it and see what you get : GUN - SCHOOL
Or worse yet, get a Liberal Journalist to give you one....
I agree. It is creating a scenario that could come back to bite us.....Quote:
Originally Posted by coltace
Absolutely stupid location for the protest. Writing submissions etc is a way more productive way to get your point across. I really hope no one turns up for these as it will be way more harmful to firearms owners. Not well thought out, very knee jerk reaction.
I'm going to keep on hijacking these types of threads, and each time the message will be the same:
Written submissions to the Select Committee on the Arms Amendment Bill are over. Submissions in person are wrapping up (if they haven't already).
Labour and Green will not be moved on this.
National and ACT will oppose.
Sure, discuss 'til the cows come home who you will be voting for November next year as a protest vote. It won't make any difference to whether the Bill is passed. National will repeal legislation around employment conditions, resource consent etc... the usual. They won't touch arms legislation again - even if they vote against it in the current parliamentary term.
For now the happiness continues...
Attachment 125342
All of our attention should now be directed at New Zealand First.
The only person who can derail the Arms Amendment Bill from this point forward is the Rt. Hon. W. Peters.
NZ First need points of difference to separate them from the other two coalition partners. His recent speech to the Party Conference reiterated this. There is real danger for NZF as a coalition partner to be seen as too compliant, not having their own identity, given that the NZ First support base was split close to 50:50 on whether they should have supported Labour or National.
It is Winston who decides which issues are the points of difference. We've already seen this with Capital gains, Refugee quotas, Crown/Maori relations, and now Tobacco excise tax. We've seen how this works; the "Agree to Disagree" clause. We need Winston to decide that it is in his - and the Party's - best interests that NZ First oppose the Arms Amendment Bill in anything like its current form. We need Winston to put his foot down on this one. See below: Serious Winston. We need Winston looking like this when he tells the Country that the Arms Amendment Bill is completely unworkable and that NZ First will not be supporting it through its second reading.
Attachment 125343
If you are going to write to anyone, write to NZ First.
If you are going to protest an event, protest one of Mr. Peter's events.
Be aware that for now Winston's office is re-directing correspondence on the Arms Amendment Bill to the Minister of Police. This, in spite of him being the Minister for Disarmament. Clearly the Coalition currently view the Police as those who should be creating this law as well as enforcing it. This needs to change. When you write to any of the NZ First MPs - particularly the Rt. Hon. W. Peters - be sure to include that the letter is written to him in his role as either the Minister for Disarmament, or as the Leader of NZ First and on a Party matter, and not to an MP in their party spokesperson or unrelated ministerial roles.
Acknowledgement now given to the original source of these two fine photographs, since permission to reuse was not obtained prior to posting.
I am not justifying the protest. Just telling people why that is the location.Quote:
Originally Posted by coltace
i never thought ron marks would vote for this crap
He's not at all happy about it. His priority though has to lie with the Defence Force and seeing the $20 billion upgrade plan put in place. I can understand that. Anyhow... it is Winston who will ultimately call the shots on this one, as applies to all things NZF.
@Russian 22. Sorry mate for being a bit rash. I had put that opinion elsewhere and got told "you're a fudd"
So I was way too defensive. Sorry about that.
Yeah, nah. Someone who won't stand for something will stand for anything.Quote:
Originally Posted by Puffin
You are right though, the media is going to have a field day, especially if they see that then someone bringing in shotgun stocks designed to make the USAs favorite pastime at schools easier.Quote:
Originally Posted by coltace
From your perspective Mr K, is the Kiwi media ever not ever having a field day anti-LFAOs?
And I see you repeating the tired old meme that 'USA's favourite pastime is shotgunning children'.
Getting acquainted with the facts may change minds.
- The majority of gun deaths in the US by suicide (close to 2/3) - I know, doesn't fit the narrative.
- The gun murder and gun suicide rates in the U.S. are both lower today than in the mid-1970s - again doesn't fit the narrative.
- The gun death rate in the U.S. is much higher than in most other nations - but for example it is still far below the rates in several Latin American nations. Narrative, oops.
- Regardless of the definition being used, fatalities in mass shooting incidents in the U.S. account for only a small fraction of all gun murders that occur nationwide each year.
- By 2016, Chicago had recorded more homicides and shooting victims than New York City and Los Angeles combined. Chicago's biggest criminal justice challenges have changed little over the last 50 years, and statistically reside with homicide, armed robbery, gang violence, and aggravated battery.
- The majority of one-on-one shooting murders are disproportionately perpetrated by one group. Political correctness has buried this. Hint: nothing to do with the profile of Kiwi LFAOs.
- Profile of mass school shooters (of which even one is far too many) shows that most don't have fathers in their lives, and they have demonstrated over and over again their intentions, and again because of political correctness these intentions are not reacted or responded to, and almost all acquired their guns illegally.
For those interested in an objective review:
Mass shootings aren't growing more common – and evidence contradicts common stereotypes about the killers
So to infer that LFAOs demonstrating outside one of the many places that the Prime Minister visits is going to encourage some sort of outbreak of mass shooting is, in my view, not just wrong, not just disingenuous, but actually attacking your fellow LFAOs.
In case you're wondering (probably not) most of the above was included in one of my submissions to Parliament to provide context for people who seem to get their soundbites only from biased media.
i dont know what all the rates has got to do with school shootings which is generally the only thing abfout USA gun crime that we see in the media here (along with other mass shootings) this has all happened due to a mass shooting, not at a school but still it is the root cause. Coming in and spouting well known facts (the media dosent care) dosent change that someone who was excitedly advertising a shotgun stock which only has one purpose of concealment or room clearing is also advertising a firearms protest outside of a school is a really bad look. extreamly baad.
If we as shooters want the media and the public on our side, which will change politicians minds, then we need to look closer at crap like this. Currently it is playing right into nashs 'gun nuts' comments. The media is on this forum, im surprised the above hasnt been picked up on yet.
What would you do instead?Quote:
Originally Posted by Konev
Use a bit more common sense for that protest. thats the least that could be done. go protest outside a labour part electorate office that isnt by a school (or a mosque for that matter)Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan
Is this a COFLO supported protest or kiwigunguys own independant event?
The point we're making is that the data leak, and the "buy-back" in general, put us and our families at risk.Quote:
Originally Posted by coltace
For all we know, the dad or mum of one of those Grey Lynn kids might have just had their details leaked by the police, putting that child in danger.
I don't know if you're aware, but the protest at Trusts Stadium last week was directly across the road from a kindergarten, which was open at the time.
There wasn't any real negative media coverage of the protest, and some of the kids were even waving to us.
The photos from the protest even got used on articles about the data leak two days later, which was excellent timing.
We will be protesting outside police stations and electorate offices very soon, so feel free to join in.
If you join the Auckland Firearms Protest Facebook group, you'll be kept up to date. We already have over 400 members.
We had 200-300 protesters at the first event in Greenlane, and about 100 at the Trusts Stadium.
These protests are going to be a regular occurrence nationwide and for the foreseeable future.
Now is as good at time as any to join in and get on board.
You're either part of the solution or part of the problem. Pick one.Quote:
Originally Posted by 300wsm for life
If you're too lazy to get out and do the work yourself, you don't get to talk shit about the people doing it for you.
What have you actually done to stand up against gun confiscation? I suspect very little beyond the comfort of your chair.
I've attended at least six protests, four of which were just me by myself. I still made the Waikato Times, and I was covered quite favourably.
So I ask again-what have you done to help?
I've written submissions. I personally don't like protests so will never attend one. There is more power in a carefully worded submission then a protest. But yes those submissions were written from my chair.
I've written submissions, mad a personal submission, attended protests with polite, 'wry' signs, and I would not criticize those who would choose only one - or yet another option - but I agree with KGG, it's a bit much for the people who do nothing to put down the people who do something. Even if you think we're wrongheaded and / or we're engaged in a futile attempt. And we're not spreading the meme that LFAOs have any overlap at all with mass school shooters!Quote:
Originally Posted by 300wsm for life
I'm not criticising anyone for doing what they believe in. Just merely stating that protests can and are quite often used against the subject. The media will spin it however they want regardless of the intention, it only takes 1 person at a protest to stuff it completely and get spun negatively. For me protesting firearms stuff is a terrible way to do it, we are already walking a fine line.
I will continue to support our cause in any way I can, but will not attend protests.
I get the point about the schools. But I also get the point that it’s still a free society and we have the right to peaceful protest.
So those that are protesting be smart about as the post at the top of this post states.
Then no problem.
It’s also no great help to anybody to start slinging mud here....from which ever stand your looking from!
Fact is that the protests have been helping our cause. The media has been a LOT more critical of the government and has paid a lot more attention to gun owners and the flaws in these laws since the protests began.
Before the government was setting the tone, holding the press briefings, and we we just having to respond to whatever lies they made up. Now with the protests we are dictating the time, place, and discussion, and it's working. The media here is generally left leaning, but they are also businesses. They reported the government line for so long because that was the only story they had, and they need to run a story every day no matter what. Now that we are holding protests and exposing what an utter sh*t show these laws and their administration is, the media have a far more interesting story to work with. Sure it won't all go our way, and we won't get support from the hardcore lefties, but from the sound of their ever higher pitched screeching and desperate insults it looks like we're starting to get them in an uncomfortable corner which they can't seem to escape. Frankly they aren't used to, and likely weren't expecting this level of resistance.
There is a place for writing letters - I would say everyone at a protest has at minimum done that. Most have written their submissions, many have made verbal submissions, and now they're getting out in public and showing that this isn't a small creepy gun lobby hiding in the shadows like nash is desperately trying to paint us, but a large diverse demographic that looks just like your neighbor, because we are your neighbors. I get that protesting is scary and takes a lot of guts to attend - I don't think anyone at these protests wants to be there. They've got lives to lead, families to spend time with, and much more enjoyable things to do, but they wouldn't feel right about themselves letting this happen to them without a fight.
Funnily enough once you're at the protest it actually feels pretty good! Hanging out with fellow hunters and target shooters is always fun, it feels good to take some control back and take the fight back on the offensive, and frankly the amount of support from passing cars is amazing. Makes you aware of just how many kiwis are against these laws, even if they're afraid to show it openly.
This ^^^ :-)Quote:
Originally Posted by canross
Please create a thread if you are planning anything coming up in Wgtn as I dont do fuckbook
Thanks
