Printable View
Yeah couldn't agree more some suppressors manufacturers don't have very fine tolerances on there threads I've seen one well known suppressor brand of with 3 different threaded cans fit snuggly on a completely different threaded barrel.Quote:
Originally Posted by Coop
I’ve been dealing with GC and Dave Tipple since his early days. Haven’t had a bad experience yet but like all businesses it might happen. Like any business they do have the odd employee that talks a load of shit, just smile and move on. Just remember DT supports gun sports and didn’t throw certain firearm owners under the bus like another outfit did a few years ago.
A 15x1 suppressor will "tighten" onto a 14x1 thread - you wouldn't want to torque it up too tight but it will definitely screw on thereQuote:
Originally Posted by Huntn
Because it just turns into a whining bitch fest and we have heard it all before....Quote:
Originally Posted by John Duxbury
Yep sure was we checked thatQuote:
Originally Posted by Barry the hunter
It just seems an obvious thing to do in checking the threads Its really not that hard. The people I shoot with know their firearms, they know what thread is on their barrel, then all I do but most probably dont do this, is inspect my suppressor what Im looking for is damage etc (I have had one that had a little bulge in it and it got thrown away) give it a shake look through it and make sure its not blocked and hey there's the thread its got stamped on it does it match my rifle? Then screw it on being careful not to cross thread it, seen that done a few times. and its really that easy. Yea yea I know you shouldn't have to.........but look what can happen if you dont.
Interesting. I just tried my M15x1 suppressor on 3 of my rifles threaded M14x1 and with all 3 rifles the M15x1 suppressor just slid straight over the full length of threading, no winding involved just slid on and off.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shamus_
I can "tighten" a 15x1 A-tec suppressor onto a factory threaded 14x1 Tikka - there wouldn't be much in the way of thread engagement and it doesn't feel "correct" but it definitely doesn't slide on and off ...
I bet if you give it a good tighten it will pull the threads in the suppressor
Plenty of suppressor don't have their thread marked on them.Quote:
Originally Posted by blip
That's because most of the H&F whinge fests are in the now hidden 'Firearms Law Changes' section. Hidden 2 years before you joined.Quote:
Originally Posted by John Duxbury
The thing is, it would be fair to say most owners of a threaded barrel wouldn’t know by looking at it, what thread it is, if I ask a gunsmith to put a 14x1 or a 15x1 thread on a muzzle, I would assume that the thread is correct because the suppressor fits.Quote:
Originally Posted by blip
I had had four different muzzles threaded successfully before I found out that the gunsmith should have the suppressor at hand to do the job. And that was from a highly reputable gunsmith who I admittedly put in the situation but there was no mention of it at the time.
I guess one takeaway from this thread is that it is important to know what you’re buying and fitting together, satisfy yourself and don’t take the word of anyone who has a financial interest (this applies across the board not to only one retailer) in reassuring you. Yes items may have a good warranty, but a paper promise doesn’t mitigate the loss of driving hours to a range and firing upwards of $50 worth of ammunition to find out something is broken. Or worse still, having gear fail after helicoptering into somewhere in the South Island.
Good on you for front footing this with your reply on here. Credit where it's due.Quote:
Originally Posted by SEdan
Like buying ammo does anyone check the packet, or do you just go and buy a pack and throw it in the rifle?
Guess I might be a bit ocd on checking stuff now after doing all the dumb shit in the past. Forgot bolt, forgot mag took wrong bolt for rifle, took wrong ammo, wrong suppressor. Yea done it all in the past so I check check check now
yes Blip good advice packing for even a one day hunt rifle bolt ammo knife boots first - and last thing check again - but gunsmiths and shops - had a good run except for one bloody muppet in Gisborne - took my Rem BDL .222 in for new barrel - fitted a Hawken barrel - to my horror when I picked it up from shop he had polished the jewelling of the bolt - I was mortified - why ohhhhh why
Half by 28 us hard to confuse with anything else
If i wander in those doors i seem to hear a voice in my head that says "JUDAS!!!"Quote:
Originally Posted by Dama dama
But i might add i do like that GC always have popular smokeless powders much longer than all the other shops.
All the cool kids dis the big sheds, when in reality some small traders who operate away from scrutiny are more likely to put one around you. We champion the little guy, but there are some sneaky ones. The big sheds at least know there are eyes on them.
14x1 male thread has a allowable outside diameter of 13.862-13.974mm
15x1 female thread has a allowable inside diameter of 13.917-14.153mm
A 14x1 male thread at the high end of the range attached to a small end of the range 15x1 will absolutely feel tight - at least until the .06mm lets go.
I've had both good and very bad experiences in GC, so no interest in this other than putting the facts out there.
Because it only belongs on a 22 Rimfire ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Marty Henry
Ars were 1/2×28 some t3s are as well
And for all the guys that like to bag gc and tell them how to do it, Im yet to see any of them actually do it them selves and show us how its done....
Good to see a machiness tool maker on here.I just rely on gun smith,if it don't work I take it back.Havnt had to do that yet in the last 20yrs.Had no problems with GC in the last 20yrs either.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ross Nolan
Just a grumpy fitter and turner, but I do know how to read Machinerys Handbook.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trout
Attachment 267795
It's what the internet used to look like.
All credit to you Dan and GC for owning this. There's not enough of this honesty in today's critical world.
I looked that up too, as I said I was surprised to see 15x1 on rifles (but then thinking about it why am I surprised haha - it seems like a good way for a manufacturer to try to ring fence buyers into their own gear sales stream a bit like Ruger mounts or Weatherby ammo back in the day).Quote:
Originally Posted by Ross Nolan
One thing I do tend to do after having an issue in the past with a slightly undercut thread on a rifle barrel is I give the can a wiggle before it's tight and screwed home. This will show you instantly if it's the right can, as noted not all cans and not many rifles have the thread specs on them and this is something that I feel is a bit of a trap. Especially the cans as it is bloody hard to measure an overbarrel can's thread! Certain metric and imperial threads can cross over as well, and this can be dangerous as they can screw up out of alignment and not fly off under pressure which can result in strikes and worse damage. I feel the shooter with this one got away with it and was quite lucky in reality that there wasn't any damage and it actually parted company at the first opportunity and didn't hang around and develop a worse problem over time.
All I go by is the 2 guys I've used for the last 25 years won't thread without the suppressor in their warm little hand, must be a reason?
Same with the guy I useQuote:
Originally Posted by tetawa
not the only area that threads can catch u out.
i get customers bringing in hydraulics hose with a female flare fitting and with some wear and corosion and crap its posible to wind in a 9/16 unf (14.2mm) a 3/8 bsp 13.5mm at the larger end of the tapper and M14x1.5 at aprox 13.8mm. JIC, JIS bsp & ISO/JIS metric.
easy if you are onsite and have the male to test or measure.
Z
I'd second this opinion! Buy all my firearms related stuff from them, always good advice and service.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tahr
Even when I'm in blatant tire kicker mode they are more than happy to have a yarn.
The whole "suppressor needs to be in hand" to cut muzzle threads is due to piss poor understanding of thread geometry and quality control from suppressor manufacturers. There are thread standards for a reason and in my experience only a couple of manufacturers get this right. As a result, if a muzzle thread is cut perfectly to spec, it can still be loose as hell on a poorly made suppressor, hence many smiths insisting on needing the can in hand.Quote:
Originally Posted by longshot
We should all be using a taper behind the thread instead of a square shoulder, this would negate all requirements for accurately cut threads. The locking and alignment comes from the taper and the threads are used to just lock and unlock the taper.
Unfortunately, getting worldwide manufacturers to agree on a standard for something like this is pretty much impossible.
The reason will be that when cutting a steel thread to fit an aluminum nut you only want to cut it just deep enough for the can to screw on. No way do you want too much clearance on an alloy thread.Quote:
Originally Posted by tetawa
Have used suppressors from DPT x1, Gun Works x6, Waitaki Engineering x1, Sonic x2, MAE x1 and a few other foreign brands i can't remember off top of my head. They've all been threaded within standard so can't say I've struck a dud one yet. I've seen a few cock-ups where people have tried putting suppressors on miss-matched threads though, especially 1/2x20 and 1/2x28 UNEF. Also the clusterfuck between 5/8x24/ 14x1 and 15x1 threads. Some people just don't look or know their threads. A bit like home handymen that can't recognize SAE, UNF, Whitworth, Metric course and metric fine. A few manufacturers put tapered face on their barrel threads but then you have to use proprietary suppressor or source a unit to match rifle. I have a Sig Sauer that uses this system and they also supply a tapered/squared face ring to enable use of common square-faced suppressor threads, something else to lose if you're not diligent.
Back when I did machining I would always machine it to the closest fit possible.
Wasn't any guages floating about as it was always generally one offs.
Repairs not production.
The end of a new hydraulic cylinder spear for a piston or vice versa.
If you are doing it all yourself all the time production wise it gets easier.
CNC lathes and taps to your spec as required.
Someone else's specs could be slightly different either smaller or bigger and on a small thread on a rifle barrel a couple of thou is heaps
As an apprentice I was never allowed to screw cut threads to suit a part, I always had to measure and make them to standard size. Great way to learn the "feel" of a correctly fitting thread, over the years we ended up with a huge cupboard of home made test gauges. When you're dealing with parts from an outside supplier it's a good idea having the component (suppressor) available because it is a great way of not only checking the fit but checking that the customer has given you the correct thread details for the suppressor, it has happened many times over the years that I've been given a part with different specs to the drawing.
Ive had a few bad experiences with GC in Auckland only, here’s the thing though all the bad dealings I’ve had were due to GC offshore made parts/component's, like most of us I have dealt with a lot of different stores and I feel when a mistake like this occurs it should be discussed and the store should be held accountable, clearly the manager of GC down here has owned this mistake which is admirable. We need to be aware of these things and keep the community informed so we can check this next time we get a new firearm, an accident like this could have seriously injured someone so educating and us all learning from it is important.
Yeah, the only way when you don't have the spec that the part was threaded to is to have the part when you are machining something up to match it. There is a SAAMI? spec for suppressor threads referenced to engineering spec for tolerance and finish - I recall Class 2A being bandied about?
The Class for whatever size thread gives the clearances to meet that spec, the interesting thing with it is you can run into 'mismatch' when parts come from different temperature areas and are made using different tooling which is not quite compatible. We had a good example of this with a fibreglass corrosion resistant nut and bolt assembly, the two materials were machined perfectly on land but in the wet environment where they were to be used they were an interference fit and you had a working time of less than a couple of minutes. The tooling making the nut was slightly different angles to the external tool on the threaded rod, which when both hit the colder temp in the water caused the two to interfere. If you were quick enough to assemble them, they were permanently fitted but if not it was a cut off and replace job!
1) Somebodys suppressor flew off because of a (silly) mistake made by a seller
2) said seller is known to make many silly mistakes, in this instance it led to a potentially dangerous situation
3) the seller apparrently rectified said mistake - this is not something that needs to be commended, but is his duty by law!
4) it is absolutely irrelevant if a suppressor is made, locally, overseas, or on mars. The seller has to confirm that the product they sell meets the quality, requirements and if they are unwilling to do that they should stop selling these products.
5) in this case it was not an out of spec thread but a completely wrong one which was not picked up.
6) personally, I deal with machined parts both locally produced as well as imported... the most grave mistakes always happen locally, and we are now only manufacturing domestically if the timing requires it. Reading a caliper or tape measure seems to be difficult for many NZers...
7) they fucked up, but atleast fixed their fuck up so at least that... it would be nice if they spent more time into overseeing their apprentices and teaching them how to do things properly... there is quite a bit of potential for improvement there.
