Thread: Mountain Safety out of firearm licence equation...

heard today on Radio NZ that the Mountain Safety people will be dropped out of the safety lectures...seems a silly move to me...maybe I missed the point?!?

Nope it would be very silly, but the poly techs will pick it up you'll end up with a student loan, but should get you qualified in 5 yrs.
I think this has been on the cards for a long time.

So who does it?

From NZDA President via email

Restructure of Mountain Safety Council threatens Firearm Safety Programme

I need to inform you of the recent and completely unexpected sacking by the Mountain Safety Council of the well-known Firearm Programme managers Mike Pyatt and Nicole McKee, and the termination by MSC of the Firearms Technical Committee. The NZDA National Executive believes this undermines the long standing firearms programme.

As you already know, that programme has for many ears been delivering safety instruction and administering the licence test under contract to the NZ Police. This delivery is actually done by volunteers, many of them members of the NZDA as is consistent with our position as the premier hunting organisation in New Zealand. The instructors remain fiercely loyal to the programme and the managers and believe MSC is jeopardising all the goodwill built up between these willing volunteers and the organisation charged with directing them. Instructors all around New Zealand are discussing a walkout, which would likely spell the death knell of the whole programme.

Nicole and Mike had the pivotal job of Programme Managers for this work. They liaised closely with instructors to conduct training, collate firearm incident reports and carry out other firearm-related tasks, and to ensure consistency of training standards throughout the country. The Technical Committee was made up of nominees from national hunting and shooting organisations, firearm instructors, Defence and police. It provided advice to the Programme Managers and helped to develop training programmes.

All this is now in jeopardy despite the MSC’s assurances over the past year that the firearms programme would be unaffected during the disestablishment of the other MSC outdoor disciplines and the regional committees.

The police had been given vague assurances that the programme would continue and the quality would be unchanged, but as a result of restructurings that were made, the National Executive believes we must ask the police to cancel their contract with MSC for delivering the service. We cannot remain confident in an organisation that has made pointless changes without consultation – not even the police! Meanwhile, the police have moved to ask their Arms Officers to reassure instructors that police value their services and will ensure that the provision of resources and resolution of any issues will be a priority.

But without the leadership of credible programme managers and an expert technical committee, the consistency and quality of instruction will inevitably degrade across the country.

So where does NZDA stand on this?

• NZDA is the largest shooting organisation in the country and has a vested interest in maintaining a credible firearm safety programme.
• We have a particular interest in hunter safety and the current safety lecture and licence test emphasise safety in a hunting context.
• It is from the ranks of our membership that many (perhaps most) of the current firearm instructors are drawn.
• We ask firearms instructors to stay with the programme and work with the District Arms Officers to continue providing the services that licence applicants and the general public need for their competence and safety.
• The NZDA National Executive will ask the police to cancel their contract with MSC, take over the direct management of the programme, employ managers with relevant qualifications and reinstate a standing Firearm Technical Committee.

The new CEO of MSC is gutting the place, they have dropped all the outdoor courses that were run by volunteers, going to replace it with online info & pamphlets. Have laid most of the staff off.

Initially they said there would be no changes to the delivery of firearms training, MSC are contracted by the police to carry out the lectures, etc. now it looks like that is changing too, they have sacked the two firearms coordinators & disbanded the firearms technical committee. There's been no consultation with the police, firearms instructors, etc

Today NZDA have called for the police to cancel the contract with MSC & give it to them along with the volunteer instructors.

Sanity hopefully will come to the fore! These volunteers do a great job

Nothing quite like a new CEO coming in and reducing costs. Usually it ends up in reducing income as well

Sent from my workbench

Originally Posted by outdoorlad

The new CEO of MSC is gutting the place, they have dropped all the outdoor courses that were run by volunteers, going to replace it with online info & pamphlets.

Computer screens and pamphlets are a poor substitute for a human being with knowledge and experience.

wow, wasn't expecting that, cause for concern...

Originally Posted by distant stalker

wow, wasn't expecting that, cause for concern...

Definitely, sounds like a Night of the Long Knives at MSC. One must question, why?

Originally Posted by kmak

Computer screens and pamphlets are a poor substitute for a human being with knowledge and experience.

nooooooooooooooooo......................did you not know "that moving forward we hope to have a positive outcome with win-win situations for all involved stake holders"


I'm afraid I'll never be a "Suit" as soon as most of the ones I have met in the course of my job open their mouths my "bullshit meter" goes of the scale.

I hate to say it but is this what happens when people bitch publicly about the licensing system?

Sent from my SM-G800Y using Tapatalk

Originally Posted by veitnamcam

I hate to say it but is this what happens when people bitch publicly about the licensing system?

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People bitch about stuff publicly all the time. If that is the reason why this particular system has fallen away, then we have far bigger problems to contemplate.

Originally Posted by Ryan

People bitch about stuff publicly all the time. If that is the reason why this particular system has fallen away, then we have far bigger problems to contemplate.

Like when our right to hunt is taken away.

That's an irrelevant slippery slope fallacy. If someone has legitimate and clearly communicated concerns with the licensing system, why shouldn't they bring them up ("bitch")?