Not kiwi...Quote:
Originally Posted by norsk
just a bunch of ignorant old farts with little else to do...
Sounds like a very interesting proposition, eleminating the one weakness the 7prc (and rem mag) has...
but time will tell if it will catch on.
Printable View
Not kiwi...Quote:
Originally Posted by norsk
just a bunch of ignorant old farts with little else to do...
Sounds like a very interesting proposition, eleminating the one weakness the 7prc (and rem mag) has...
but time will tell if it will catch on.
prices in markets that actually count (i.e. the us) will be much more reasonable.Quote:
Originally Posted by caberslash
There is fuck all hunting in the States if you look at their seasons.Quote:
Originally Posted by caberslash
Really? He's a guy that gets to play with guns everyday. I'm jealous of that, but wish him the best. One of the few US YouTubers I watch because he doesn't go on about 2A bollocks and isn't prepping for a zombie apocalypse.Quote:
Originally Posted by caberslash
Nailed itQuote:
Originally Posted by norsk
I think going to higher pressure cases, is more sensible and worthwhile than simple change of shape on the same rough powder capacity, that we have seen up till now.
I like that's its kept a classic case head diameter and retains a 5 shot capacity on standard actions.
I like that it has a decent range of bullet weight options that makes it semi sensible for guys wanting to get the most out of high BC, long range, while also having a reasonable more traditional projectile option for guys like me that just want flat trajectory as possible at under 500 meters.
Im not sure that it will make a heavy projectile at those sort of velocities, any more shootable or comfortable for the average hunter. And Im unsure if the extra will be needed in most guys cases.
But it seems well thought out and developed.
Name one who isn't. I suspect its more about you disagreeing with his opinionsQuote:
Originally Posted by caberslash
Ron Spomers take.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G-cChdulaKY
Generations of the Scottish losing to the AB's hasn't done much for your mood, has it :) :)Quote:
Originally Posted by caberslash
If high pressure brass becomes a thing what would you build?
I'll finally get a 18" Dasher and shoot 105s ...
I didn't say it was shit. I called bullshit on marketing hype that says it will have less recoil than other same calibre rounds firing same projectile at same velocity.
spooner covered that though and it does because it about the amount of powder being burnt rather then pressure like most people think uses alot less powder so makes senseQuote:
Originally Posted by Micky Duck
either way you look at it and its a bigger step forward then what the 7mm PRC was promised then turned out to be so pretty exciting pushing higher pressures with less powder in these steel cases is pretty interesting
my 300 win mag shooting 180gr bondstrikes is more then enough to satisfy my needs and shooting to 500ish
Quote:
Originally Posted by MB
I listened to him on a podcast a while back, came across as a smart guy whos figured out how to make Youtube pay for the lifestyle he's always wanted. He hunts overseas too, mentioned taking his kids to Africa to hunt.
If we don't support new idea's they will cease to be developed. Sure the driver behind this development is sales,it has to be simple as that.
I am most excited at where they could go from this neich cartridge technology when applied to existing chamberings,using special actions and cases.
Can you imagine the push back when nitro powder was developed, people had to throw away their existing guns and buy special projectiles that they could no.longer case in the open fire in their parlor?
The ammo cost in its biggest market will be much less because of economy of scale,anyhow the cost of that single vital round is fuck all compared to all the other stuff involved in a hunt.
I wonder how suppressors will handle the extra pressures from this cartridge
I can't agree with that, Newton's third law says that when two bodies interact by applying force to one another, in this case the gun and the bullet the effect is equal on both but in opposite directions. It's the mass of the bullet and the speed it reaches along with the firearms weight that determines recoil not the amount of powder burnt to do that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Carbine
The mass of powder is taken into account because it is also being pushed down the barrel just like the projectile, even if it is also in the gas form.
wrong.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jus
exhaust gas (velocity, pressure,...) contributes significantly to recoil.
otherwise muzzle breaks and suppressors would not have an effect...
The recoil claim does have merit, as powder has mass and is being thrown out along with the bullet.
Graph below from shooterscalculator.com... 175gr bullet at 3000fps in a 9lb rifle. Only change being an increase in powder charge weight... 60gr for a 7BC, 70gr for a 7PRC, and 80gr for a 28 Nosler.
Attachment 266569
Obviously with the different performance characteristics of the above cartridges, the three rifles would have different length barrels to get the same MV and keep it apples to apples. But it shows that there's a useful recoil reduction to be had by using less powder.
I'd take another 4 inches of your old rifle. 12 inch barrel throwing those 80eldms at almost 2700fps.Quote:
Originally Posted by SPEARONZ
https://youtu.be/pvC-GYFE2SI?feature=shared
Refreshing to see a manufacturer not bend over for the big boys.
Yep suppressors will HATE this cartridge with a short barrel, the muzzle pressure will be way higher than normal & higher than most magnums especially given the powder burn rates most likely being usedQuote:
Originally Posted by Jus
Brakes will LOVE it, tons of pressure to work with, even an inefficient design will work acceptably
Will be interesting to see how the whole concept progresses including reloading, assuming its possible
That's what I was thinking, wouldn't be surprised to hear of suppressors blowing up.. maybe an ultta magnum suppressor may work?
Possibly, which would negate a lot of the appeal of short & light hunting rifles hereQuote:
Originally Posted by Jus
This is limited by not having the correct cartridges and not knowing what propellants are being used, but the answer to "will it be harder on suppressors" might not be quite so clear cut, based on GRT...
7mm Rem Mag (similar capacity to 7PRC), 175gr ELD-X, 24" barrel @ 62,000psi using H1000/AR2217: muzzle velocity 2940fps, muzzle pressure: 17,101psi
Attachment 266570
280 (similar capacity to 7BC, I think), 175gr ELD-X, 20" barrel @ 80,000psi using Reloder 26 (which I heard Federal bought up all they could get their hands on before Alliant sidelined the civilian market), muzzle velocity: 2941, muzzle pressure: 17619psi
Attachment 266572
The Spooner vid is with using a suppressor.
Interesting to see that even with a custom rifle and cartridge they were happy with, they still had a 40% miss probability at 800 yards.Quote:
Originally Posted by caberslash
Personally I would not find that an acceptable success rate when hunting.
Just remember how inconsistent 7PRC ammo was/is though. It would have been interesting to do the comparison with some factory 7PRC ammo.Quote:
Originally Posted by caberslash
I’m pleased to see a reputable player taking a novel or different approach to stretching the ballistic envelope & giving the boys at Hornady a run for their money. Especially if you run the 20in bbl option. The idea of using significantly higher pressure but less powder than magnums definitely has appeal. Whether existing actions & suppressors can handle those pressures on routine basis is a bit of unknown. But no doubt some one will solve these issues in due course. And brakes will be a big help or must if you want to run a light weight LR hunting set up. I’d also want to see more info on the reloading requirements. Would not want to be stuck with factory ammo option only.
I think this cartridge is being aimed solely at hunters who buy a factory rifle and factory ammo, shoot a few boxes a year and that’s it.
Which likely is 90% of the hunting market in the USA.
For handloaders this will need to have other “brass” sources or it won’t be appealing at all.
Even then it doesn’t offer any real benefit over 7PRC (or similar) other than burning a little less powder, but it’s unsure what the repercussions of that pressure will be.
This cartridge will live or die based on why factory rifles it comes in and the supply of ammo.
If the supply of ammo dries up, or has any issues then this cartridge will die very quickly.
Basically if they can do a Hornady (good factory rifles, ammo and support for handloaders) I can see it being an interesting option, if they don’t do that then there is no way it’ll last.
It’s interesting they’re advertising it being available in both very cheap rifles (Savage) and very expensive custom rifles (Gun Werks, Proof Research).
LOOK AT ALL THOSE RICH ADJECTIVES IN THAT ADVERTISING.Quote:
Originally Posted by caberslash
Many many moons ago Greg Duley made the same comment about NZ hunters. Some times only 1 packet of ammo a year excluding the opening morning duckies.Quote:
Originally Posted by Beetroot
Short barrel magnum performance?
This may sound quite predictable coming from me but nothing better than a hand loaded 7mm saum in a 20 inch barel!
Where federal could be at a big advantage, is to become the second 270 SiG fury supplier to the US army.
That would be a big win for them if they can get a contract.
So basically it could be the equivalent of the 280 vs 270 but compared to the 277 fury.
Would make sense once that is main stream for a while.
Military calibres historically do well especially in the US if they work.
Maybe beating the 277 to the punch.
Getting a hot 7mm based on the hot 270 case before it properly hits civvie street
Of note in the Spomer review.
The cases are reloadable albeit with increased case prep.= annealing??
Lighter powder charge but use of faster burning powder=pressure increase
Barrel erosion is more a factor of how much powder being burned, more flame rather than the pressure increase.
Reduced bolt thrust as that was a relationship to brass flow.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Shoot2hunt on YouTube have a video around this, they seem to have information regarding reloading, seems the cases can't be annealed, and it takes like a dozen passes through the sizing die to size these cases apparently... may be wrong in this as I was falling asleep listening to them harp on
Would be interesting to see if this technology is every adapted across other Sammi cartridges. Not sure about action strengths of current rifles vs the back country standard. Creedmore performance from a grendel, winmag performance from a 308 or 06, rum performance from a rem mag?
Probably never happen but who knows
I'm skeptical about the claims that barrel wear isn't increased with increased pressure. Yeah some guy on YouTube said that. Evidence?
I think the barrel wear thing is a bit of a moot point, if your buying this cartridge because you want 3k with a 170+gr pill in a short ish barrel, the only other way your getting there is with the likes of 7 mag/7prc/7saum/28 nosler etc with a stinking hot handload and at that point your giving everything a hard time including the brass and surely best case scenario wearing the barrel out just as fast (more likely faster) than the backcountry.
True, if you want those numbers your barrel is going to be cooked fast no matter how you achieve itQuote:
Originally Posted by 6.5 CRD
Be interesting if the current AMP setups can handle the new casing.
