Night vision 850nm vs 940nm

Hi guys,
looking for some experience with night vision scopes.
i cant afford a decent thermal scope so looking to get a night vision scope to get me going for now.

currently looking at options for the Sytong HT- 70 which comes in a 850 wavelength,
or the pulsar N455 or similar which has a 940 wavelength.

the feedback i have had is very mixed,

1 opinion: 850 is very clear and much nicer to use, can identify and shoot out to 400-500m depending on surroundings, wouldn't even touch a 940, too blurry.
2nd opinion: 850 spooks the animals, the IR lights deer up and they start moving and getting alert when the scope is directed at them compared to 940. the whole point of night vision is giving time to stalk deer and all the time you want to get a good shot, not rush it otherwise might as well use a red spotlight

keen to get some feedback from people who have used these on deer hunting.
940 seems better to not spook the animals but is it really that blurry compared to 850? will it limit the ability to even identify targets?

is 850 IR not actually that bad at alerting animals?

this isn't for rabbits and small pests, its for deer hunting so want to shoot as far out as I can

let me know what you all think so i can decide which one is best for me.

thanks

I wouldn’t by the pulsar n55 with factory light even the c50 with factory light is shit you need to up grade light, the pards are worth a look aswell message Andy Andyanimal31 for pard


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[QUOTE=buzzmann;1655513]I wouldn’t by the pulsar n55 with factory light even the c50 with factory light is shit you need to up grade light, the pards are worth a look aswell message Andy Andyanimal31 for pard

Thanks man, any experience with the different wavelengths?

I use 850 only because I want to see long way and identify stags but animals definitely see the light just like a spot light


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Originally Posted by buzzmann

I use 850 only because I want to see long way and identify stags but animals definitely see the light just like a spot light

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yeah i want to be able to see far and identify stags too but dont want to scare them off beofre i can shoot,
want to be able to pick out the right one, and take my time but sounds like they just get spooked and start moving for the bush when you point the 850 at it?
meaning a spotlight is pretty much the same??
thanks

Couple of links for you to have a look at. Top one from Pard, bottom one from Piercing The Darkness.
https://youtu.be/38vUClIG5NE?si=qRsTV3RnSYEcNN4P
https://youtu.be/34z37LX32mg?si=nJzyIOM-4rglNtcR
Personally I've shot well over 300 deer the past year and the vast majority were taken using an 850nm unit that came standard with Alpex A50T. A number were taken while using an 940nm illuminator. You do lose a bit of range with the genuine 940 but there's not a lot in it. Deer around here seem to stand in the light from the 850 unit for some time without getting skittish, certainly long enough to wait for a decent shot. Don't let them get gun-shot/ light shy and you don't need 940. Just remember Game Cameras supposedly use 'invisible' infra-red light and you often get multiple shots of animals looking into the camera. I would suggest you try and view first-hand to see what may work for you. Going by sales numbers every man and his dog has NV gear these days, you're bound to know someone who'll let you have a look through their gear.

you can put an external it 940 on whatever you get

I believe that technically, no, 850nm doesn't alert animals. But... Whilst my understanding is that no animals (or perhaps it's only mammals?) can see 850nm light, the illuminator doesn't emit 100% pure 850nm light. There's a bit of a bell curve and depending on quality/technology used in the illuminator, a fraction of the light can end up straying into the visible part of the spectrum.

If there is some bleed around into visible red light, it should only be faint. Really faint. Enough that you might catch a lens glowing red in your peripheral vision if you're a lucky deer. But nowhere near enough for deer several tens of metres away to automatically realise that they and the ground they're on are being lit up the moment it's turned on.

So if you have a deer population that is on constant high alert and has learned to associate the sudden appearance of a glowing red blob in the distance with imminent death, it's plausible that an 850nm illuminator might alert them. If they aren't super skittish, and you aren't getting close enough that they are as likely to smell or hear you as see your IR's lens, I think you'll be fine.

I have hunted heaps of wallabies with an 850nm HT-70 and they certainly pay no attention to it. Neither have the red deer I've lit up with 850nm Pards and Sytongs from 20m to 100m. My previous NV scope had a 940nm illuminator and I found the picture got much more noisy (like static interference) much more quickly at distance as the illuminator struggled - it was really only usable past a couple hundred metres on a clear night with a full moon.

Have been using the 850 for the last 2 yrs most nights, they defo are alerted, small game tho

There is an infiray just popped up on trade me I know nothing about them but seems cheap way to get into nv cheers


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i use an 850 on deer, and have not had any issues at all with the deer getting skittery, i suppose that the longer you muck around with the IR on them the more it may effect them.
up and shoot is the way to go.

I've used NV on fallow deer quite extensively with both 850 and 940 IR. the deer definitely see the 850, inside of 200m you risk spooking them, even when they don't spook you will see them looking towards you when you light them up with the 850. They do not see the 940, the real difference in performance is not that great until you get out to around 250 to 300m and more. I am talking about good quality VCEL IR lights, some LED's are Ok but they tend to be quite bulky and heavy. These days I tend to use the built in 940 on my unit and then I have an external 850 IR which I can turn on for longer ranges, this system seems to work well.

One of my mates runs Hereford cattle on two farm blocks. They definitely notice the 850 light even at 400m but usually don’t get too excited and sometimes just quietly move away though this may be because they’ve become conditioned to night shooting around them. Doesn’t really matter to me because the cattle don’t share their near vicinity with deer, not around here anyway.

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Originally Posted by zeropak

I've used NV on fallow deer quite extensively with both 850 and 940 IR. the deer definitely see the 850, inside of 200m you risk spooking them, even when they don't spook you will see them looking towards you when you light them up with the 850. They do not see the 940, the real difference in performance is not that great until you get out to around 250 to 300m and more. I am talking about good quality VCEL IR lights, some LED's are Ok but they tend to be quite bulky and heavy. These days I tend to use the built in 940 on my unit and then I have an external 850 IR which I can turn on for longer ranges, this system seems to work well.

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Thanks any chance you can send me a pic or details of what your setup is? sounds like a good way to go having both

I have both the 940 and 850. All I use are the cheap Ultrafire 850 IR torches that I add a layer of black 850ir filter over to minimalize the red glow. Can only think of one stag that spooked with it, and he was in a heavily spot lit area. Have shot a few animals and find if I walk straight toward the animal and when watching don`t move the light around they don`t seem to notice, if they look at you just don`t move. I haven`t ever used any of the over-the-counter gear so cannot comment on what that is like.

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Originally Posted by Moose

Thanks any chance you can send me a pic or details of what your setup is? sounds like a good way to go having both

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here's a couple of pics of what I mean.


Here's a Zulus with and 850 Vcsel IR. So i attach a 940 the Pic Rail on the side
Attachment 268371


Here's a Pard Night Stalker which has a 940 Vsel. So I have attached an 850.
Attachment 268372

The other thing worth mentioning is that atmospheric conditions affect how an IR light performs. Wet, foggy or very humid conditions can cut range significantly.
To My knowledge good quality Vcsel IR torches are not available off the shelf in NZ. All mine were imported from the UK. Someone please correct me If I'm wrong.

Buy the 850, if you're unable to get animals that detect your red-eye then you could be making noise / taking too long. I don't think I've seen a single large game animal instantly run when I've been detected at night by the laser.

I exclusively use 850s and have even purchased external 850s/808s lasers for tighter beams/better clarity at longer distances. Mounted the same as Zerkpak but on adjustable mounts so they can be better focused.

Years ago when I was using NV,I'd use the 850.Soon as I spotted a deer,I'd shine the torch centre just to the rear of the deer.Then its eyes wouldn't pick up the red glow dot so easily.

I think also if the animals have been hunted a bit with Night vision they pretty quickly figure it out. A bit like becoming light shy when spot lighted.
With the 850 Ir it also helps if you have the brightness level down to a minimum.

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Originally Posted by Roamr

Buy the 850, if you're unable to get animals that detect your red-eye then you could be making noise / taking too long. I don't think I've seen a single large game animal instantly run when I've been detected at night by the laser.

I exclusively use 850s and have even purchased external 850s/808s lasers for tighter beams/better clarity at longer distances. Mounted the same as Zerkpak but on adjustable mounts so they can be better focused.

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That mount is adjustable. Its a sniper Hog. This one: https://owloptics.nz/sniper-hog/

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Originally Posted by zeropak

That mount is adjustable. Its a sniper Hog. This one: https://owloptics.nz/sniper-hog/

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I can't figure out how you adjust that ! These are the types I use

Attachment 268389

Quote:

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Originally Posted by zeropak

I think also if the animals have been hunted a bit with Night vision they pretty quickly figure it out. A bit like becoming light shy when spot lighted.
With the 850 Ir it also helps if you have the brightness level down to a minimum.

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yes definitely atmosphere makes a difference, but that's true for any visibility, top of the line thermals are stumped by fog and cloud too.

i am aware aswell that deer that are spooked easy are usually like that because they have been spotlighted often.
all these things definitly make a difference, i just wanting to pick the right one for deer hunting overall.

do you rate the Pard Nightstalker highly? i was looking at them online earlier today, wish i knew someone who had one so i could try it out,
youtube videos are a bit average to know what its being compared to.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Roamr

I can't figure out how you adjust that ! These are the types I use

Attachment 268389

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Tried those and don't like them, they are heavy and don't stay properly aligned, if you bump the torch it will move and not return to where you set it. The sniper Hog has an insert in the ring which attaches to the torch you align the torch and then tighten the ring screws. Job done and it stays in place.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Moose

yes definitely atmosphere makes a difference, but that's true for any visibility, top of the line thermals are stumped by fog and cloud too.

i am aware aswell that deer that are spooked easy are usually like that because they have been spotlighted often.
all these things definitly make a difference, i just wanting to pick the right one for deer hunting overall.

do you rate the Pard Nightstalker highly? i was looking at them online earlier today, wish i knew someone who had one so i could try it out,
youtube videos are a bit average to know what its being compared to.

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You should talk to @AndyAnimal he lurks around here somewhere. He can supply you one and will give you the right advice, you can also talk to Ken @55six he can tell you about the Zulus. they are both good pieces of kit with excellent backup in NZ. Yes I do rate the Pards, I have 2 of them, the Night stalker and the earlier DS32. I am new to the Zulus but it also gets a great rap from those who use them. They both have their pros and cons but you would go too far wrong with either of them.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by zeropak

You should talk to @AndyAnimal he lurks around here somewhere. He can supply you one and will give you the right advice, you can also talk to Ken @55six he can tell you about the Zulus. they are both good pieces of kit with excellent backup in NZ. Yes I do rate the Pards, I have 2 of them, the Night stalker and the earlier DS32. I am new to the Zulus but it also gets a great rap from those who use them. They both have their pros and cons but you would go too far wrong with either of them.

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awesome thanks,
yeah if that @AndyAnimal guys around be good to talk to him, does he work for the PARD supplier in Whangarei?
thanks

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Moose

awesome thanks,
yeah if that @AndyAnimal guys around be good to talk to him, does he work for the PARD supplier in Whangarei?
thanks

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Andy is a supplier of Pard, you could also talk to Fraser at owl optics. maybe message me if you want more detail.