Picking an entry level ~600m scope

Hey folks – I’m in the market for an entry level mid distance scope (600m max). If you don't feel like reading, the short question is: What fits this list of criteria?

1) FFP preferred
2) Variable Magnification
a. Min magnification 3-6x
b. Max magnification 14-20+
3) Objective 40-50mm
4) Price???? I don’t know if that’s realistic entering this field I would love to spend under $700, but I have no idea if that's realistic
5) New or used

Optional:
6) Covered or lockable turrets; a lot of my hunting involves pushing through thick bush at some point
7) Parallax adjustment; not strictly necessary, but a nice to have



If you feel like reading, the background to my question is:

Until now I’ve mainly used iron sights, diopter, or lower magnification (1-10x) old scopes and shot to 300 yards max, however a move in location means that I not only am able to shoot out further, but am routinely encountering cross valley and cross slope shots in steep terrain where sight lines start at 100 yards and very easily extend to 300-400 and no easy method of stalking through the open to close the range. I’ve been reading about a number of brands and scopes but practically don’t have much experience with any of them, so am hoping to mine the collective input on options, and pros/cons.
My main aim is a simple, no frills, reliable, solid good quality scope. I’d rather less features and more reliability/better glass.


Leupold seem great and have good history and track record, but it seems there’s a certain premium attached to the name that might no longer be unique in the optics world. I’m wondering if other companies competing for the same niche make similar quality scopes but don’t demand the same premiums?
Pros- established, good quality, good warranty
Cons- high price tag; possibly end up with a knockoff by accident


Nikon seem to have a good line of scopes. Seems those that use them really like them and they’re a well-established optics company. Haven’t heard a ton about them, possibly because they don’t advertise as much? I’m having a hard time figuring out the differences in generations (IE 3, 5, 7 etc)
- Specifically considering the Prostaff or Monarch lines
Pros – Prostaff seems like a good entry line, Monarch seems to have a dedicated following
Cons – they never seem to really stand out in any particular field. Their reticle styles leave a lot to be desired. Unknown warranty?


Vortex have a lot of marketing, but seem to fall down in terms of quality. On paper they seem to offer a competitive product in terms of price and content, but really mixed reviews in terms of actual use.
- Specifically considering something in the Viper range. I don't think I'm prepared to spend into the Razor range.
Pros – great warranty, affordable with features I want
Cons – very mixed reviews in terms of quality, poorer glass. Stepping up to the Vipers and Razors means I may as well buy Leupold or Nikon


Bushnell, specifically their engage line, seems to have made headway in terms of a good entry level optic that ticks the boxes and also apparently is reasonably good quality.
- Specifically the Bushnell Engage FFP models
Pros – Great warranty, apparently reliable and meet requirements
Cons – Beginning to edge into price brackets occupied by Leupold and Nikon

I have a vx3 that apart from the capped turrets could fit the bill. It's in the buy sell section

Personally if my budget was set at $700 I would be trolling through trademe looking for a second hand bushnell 2.5-16 6500 to pop up. It ticks all your boxes but does have capped turrets but it’s hard to beat that magnification range at that price.

I can vouch for a weaver superslam 3-15x42.
Not the greatest glass but a pretty good scope and pop up turrets are great for dialing
If you look out for a second hand one they are usually about $5-$600
Great scope for the $$

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by burtonator

I can vouch for a weaver superslam 3-15x42.
Not the greatest glass but a pretty good scope and pop up turrets are great for dialing
If you look out for a second hand one they are usually about $5-$600
Great scope for the $$

---

I can 2nd that, i have one, I ran it on my 7mm SAUM for a few years, and now its on one of my 284's. Its done plenty of work dialing out well beyond 600. Mate has one too on his 280AI, good scopes, good at first and last light too.

Heres another option for you, with HD glass etc - https://athlonoptics.com/product/midas-tac-6-24x50-mil/

I know where you can prob get a good discount under the RRP too. I have an Athlon Ares BTR 4.5-27x50 on my 28 Nosler. The midas Tac has basically the same inner workings as my Ares BTR, FFP, hard zero stop, it just doesnt have the Illuminated ret of my Ares.

https://cameralandny.com/products.ht...evance&x=0&y=0

I have a Bushnell Elite 6500 tactical 2.5-16 that is currently getting rebuild by Bushnell under warranty after it fogged up. Im thinking about putting a 3-9 on my gun instead and selling the 2.5-16 if your interested?

There was a second hand Sig Sauer Tango 4 on here the other day for $600.

FFP
MIL / MIL or MOA / MOA
custom turret free matched to your load
Life time warranty
Dials well (to 1200m, furthest I have shot one)
Illuminated
Locking turrets
Parallax adjustable
Glass is good

pretty happy with my minox though it zooms up to 25X power. works well

go loopy....they work and will alway do so or get refitted to do so. they hold thier value...you asked for no frills....vx1 will do that but Im told the higher spec /$$$ models have much better glass (my vx1 is ok and works but older M8 beats it hands down for clarity) that said the last 3 deer Ive shot with .270 and said vx1 3x9x40 were all over/around the 300-350 mark and had no issues.

Some peripheral advice:

You will need a rangefinder so if you haven’t got one then get that first.

Get plenty of practice to see what you can hit at 500m before you shoot at animals.

When you first get the scope test it out on the range perhaps on a 22.
See how it tracks up to 5 mil or 20 moa and does it return to zero ?
Check it shooots to the same point of impact over the power range especially at the top.
Do a Löw light and Resolution test to check whether you can really see more in the top 2 or 3x.
Check whether zero parallax and sharp trgetfocus coincide. This depends on your eyes whether short or long sighted I think.
It doesn’t have to be mechanically perfect, just you need to know any foibles it has.

Why do you need FFP if you shoot out to 600m which means you will need accurate ranging every time?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ultimitsu

Why do you need FFP if you shoot out to 600m which means you will need accurate ranging every time?

---

Yup, FFP for close shooting in a bush environment is not optimal either. At low magnification some of the reticles are just about unusable.

If you are going to bush hunt with the scope, I'd suggest you be pretty firm on low end mag of 3 or 4, and steer away from 6. Things get pretty wobbly when taking an offhand shot at 6 power :D

One of the other pros of Leupy is that they make scopes that are light. Significantly so compared to some other manufacturers.

Appreciate all the input each of you have taken the time to provide - lots of good food for thought here.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Matt-P.Nth

Personally if my budget was set at $700 I would be trolling through trademe looking for a second hand bushnell 2.5-16 6500 to pop up. It ticks all your boxes but does have capped turrets but it’s hard to beat that magnification range at that price.

---

Appreciate it - will look into them.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by burtonator

I can vouch for a weaver superslam 3-15x42.
Not the greatest glass but a pretty good scope and pop up turrets are great for dialing
If you look out for a second hand one they are usually about $5-$600
Great scope for the $$

---

Will look into them too, thanks burtonator.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GWH

I can 2nd that, i have one, I ran it on my 7mm SAUM for a few years, and now its on one of my 284's. Its done plenty of work dialing out well beyond 600. Mate has one too on his 280AI, good scopes, good at first and last light too.

Heres another option for you, with HD glass etc - https://athlonoptics.com/product/midas-tac-6-24x50-mil/

I know where you can prob get a good discount under the RRP too. I have an Athlon Ares BTR 4.5-27x50 on my 28 Nosler. The midas Tac has basically the same inner workings as my Ares BTR, FFP, hard zero stop, it just doesnt have the Illuminated ret of my Ares.

---

Appreciate that GWH. Athlon's been one of the brands that I've heard of intermittently as a good undervalued scope but never looked into further.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tahr

https://cameralandny.com/products.ht...evance&x=0&y=0

---

Thanks! Hadn't seen that.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 300_BLK

There was a second hand Sig Sauer Tango 4 on here the other day for $600.

FFP
MIL / MIL or MOA / MOA
custom turret free matched to your load
Life time warranty
Dials well (to 1200m, furthest I have shot one)
Illuminated
Locking turrets
Parallax adjustable
Glass is good

---

I've got a lower power sig scope that I've been happy with. Haven't found the one you mentioned yet but added it back to the list. Had done an initial look into Sig Sauer but it seemed like they were out of my budget. I'll have to look harder.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by gonetropo

pretty happy with my minox though it zooms up to 25X power. works well

---

And added minox to the list. Thanks!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Micky Duck

go loopy....they work and will alway do so or get refitted to do so. they hold thier value...you asked for no frills....vx1 will do that but Im told the higher spec /$$$ models have much better glass (my vx1 is ok and works but older M8 beats it hands down for clarity) that said the last 3 deer Ive shot with .270 and said vx1 3x9x40 were all over/around the 300-350 mark and had no issues.

---

Good to know - appreciate it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bagheera

Some peripheral advice:
You will need a rangefinder so if you haven’t got one then get that first.
Get plenty of practice to see what you can hit at 500m before you shoot at animals.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bagheera

When you first get the scope test it out on the range perhaps on a 22.
See how it tracks up to 5 mil or 20 moa and does it return to zero ?
Check it shooots to the same point of impact over the power range especially at the top.
Do a Löw light and Resolution test to check whether you can really see more in the top 2 or 3x.
Check whether zero parallax and sharp trgetfocus coincide. This depends on your eyes whether short or long sighted I think.
It doesn’t have to be mechanically perfect, just you need to know any foibles it has.

---

Yep, appreciate all of the above. Realistically animal shots will probably be limited to 300m+/-, and the rest of the capacity will be target shooting simply because it's something I've wanted to get into for a while. Will try out the testing options as you say.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ultimitsu

Why do you need FFP if you shoot out to 600m which means you will need accurate ranging every time?

---

Sorry Ultimitsu, not sure I follow the question?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ebf

Yup, FFP for close shooting in a bush environment is not optimal either. At low magnification some of the reticles are just about unusable.

If you are going to bush hunt with the scope, I'd suggest you be pretty firm on low end mag of 3 or 4, and steer away from 6. Things get pretty wobbly when taking an offhand shot at 6 power :D

One of the other pros of Leupy is that they make scopes that are light. Significantly so compared to some other manufacturers.

---

That's a good point on the weight. I figured I would pare weight down elsewhere to balance it out if I had to.
In regards to FFP being difficult to use at low magnification I've somewhat accepted that as a cost, though I am leaning towards a low end magnification at 3x. I've got other options for dedicated bush or short range hunting, so this would be a 100-300 yard hunting gun, and a longer distance "learning to target shoot" gun.
I would be surprised if I couldn't get within 300 yards of an animal somehow in 90% of cases... further distance shooting than that is just something I've wanted to try for a long time.

When you get a chance.

https://www.nzhuntingandshooting.co....k-range-43315/

Hi Canross,

The point of FFP scope is that the reticle-to-target ratio remains constant through out the magnification range on the scope at any given distance between you and the target. The point of this feature is so that you can use the reticle to assess the distance between you and the target, without having to change the magnification on the scope. On a Non-FFP (as in SFP) scope, the reticle is designed to be used as a range tool at a particular magnification. Usually it is 10x (or multiplier of 10x, such as 20x and 30x).

So, basically, the point of having FFP over SFP is to by pass the need to turn the magnification ring to the "right magnification". All that you get out of it is time saving. It is useful if you were shooting targets that will disappear quickly so that you need to very quickly assess the distance, and the absolute accuracy of the distance assessment is not critical. Say for example, if you needed to shoot a human sized target between 200 to 300 metres using a 223. the drop difference is about 10 inches, easily compensatable by a hold over.

However, when you are shooting out to 600 meters, you need to be much more accurate with distance assessment because the drop difference by mere change of 50 metres will be quite big. Also at this distance it is unlikely your target will need to be shot very quickly. You would want to set up the shooting position properly, take your time to assess distance and adjust your scope before taking the shot. You should have enough time to range using SFP but you should preferably use a range finder. Therefore FFP, in my view, serves no real benefit.

FFP is a costly feature, scopes with otherwise similar features can be a few hundred dollars apart for being FFP vs SFP. I know it is quite fashionable but I doubt its usefulness in most shooting applications except quick mid-distance shootings involving human sized targets.

The Burris veracity range of scopes is FFP and their reticle is really well designed when you are down at low magnification. But the bullet drop compensator on the reticle will probably limit your shooting distance to 500 yards if you have a 200 zero with a 308.

I think ffp is useful when using the reticle to compensate for trajectory at different distances, but if you are going to click, just go sfp. A windplex type reticle is a plus and can give you a reference on how much you have to compensate for the wind.
But there is no secrets, you are going to have to practice once you have sorted out your scope.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by gadgetman

When you get a chance.

https://www.nzhuntingandshooting.co....k-range-43315/

---

Thanks gadgetman - that range being nearby is part of the reason I figured it was a good time to start practicing longer shots.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ultimitsu

Hi Canross,

The point of FFP scope is that the reticle-to-target ratio remains constant through out the magnification range on the scope at any given distance between you and the target. The point of this feature is so that you can use the reticle to assess the distance between you and the target, without having to change the magnification on the scope. On a Non-FFP (as in SFP) scope, the reticle is designed to be used as a range tool at a particular magnification. Usually it is 10x (or multiplier of 10x, such as 20x and 30x).

So, basically, the point of having FFP over SFP is to by pass the need to turn the magnification ring to the "right magnification". All that you get out of it is time saving. It is useful if you were shooting targets that will disappear quickly so that you need to very quickly assess the distance, and the absolute accuracy of the distance assessment is not critical. Say for example, if you needed to shoot a human sized target between 200 to 300 metres using a 223. the drop difference is about 10 inches, easily compensatable by a hold over.

However, when you are shooting out to 600 meters, you need to be much more accurate with distance assessment because the drop difference by mere change of 50 metres will be quite big. Also at this distance it is unlikely your target will need to be shot very quickly. You would want to set up the shooting position properly, take your time to assess distance and adjust your scope before taking the shot. You should have enough time to range using SFP but you should preferably use a range finder. Therefore FFP, in my view, serves no real benefit.

FFP is a costly feature, scopes with otherwise similar features can be a few hundred dollars apart for being FFP vs SFP. I know it is quite fashionable but I doubt its usefulness in most shooting applications except quick mid-distance shootings involving human sized targets.

---

Appreciate the breakdown - misunderstood your earlier statement.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Friwi

The Burris veracity range of scopes is FFP and their reticle is really well designed when you are down at low magnification. But the bullet drop compensator on the reticle will probably limit your shooting distance to 500 yards if you have a 200 zero with a 308.

I think ffp is useful when using the reticle to compensate for trajectory at different distances, but if you are going to click, just go sfp. A windplex type reticle is a plus and can give you a reference on how much you have to compensate for the wind.
But there is no secrets, you are going to have to practice once you have sorted out your scope.

---

Good to know on the Veracity, and yep, agreed on the practicing. Now to find the time :P