What Parker hale rings do I need ? (No4 303)

Hi team, familiar with the rifles but have never kicked around with the PH optic mounting side of things

Recently got a nice (for me) PH no4 with a very tidy 5 groove barrel, but am looking to put optics on what appears to be the factory PH mounts

Found some PH rings that looked close but no dice, to skinny to fit on the mounts.

Photos attached of the wrong sized rings and the mounts on the rifle
Attachment 249057Attachment 249058Attachment 249059Attachment 249060

Does any one know 100% the rings I’m looking for ? AND that will allow the tube to clear the rear peep.

Also, how in the heck do you get the bolt in and out with a scope fixed, seeing as you need to lift and lower the rear sight base to get the bolt in and back out again?

Also was given what appears to be a no1 mk3 side mount fitted with a pecar light 3-7, if anyone is able to identify the mount that would be most helpful, from what I can see it gets drilled and tapped and bolted on then the pins get whacked through into the receiver as interference fit?
Attachment 249062 Attachment 249063Attachment 249064

I used a CZ set of rings (19mm dovetail I think) for both of my 303s that have a PH rail. I can't remember the model, but they fit nicely

R = Roll Off
A= 19.5mm dovetail
H= High
3= 1" tube size
S= Recoil stud
so RAH3.. or RAL3.. I think.
But can be hard to get and a little expensive now. forum member may have some?
Much better to go ahead and get it drilled and tapped for a weaver type, cheap, many options for rings ect.
Those rear mounts with peep site were not well regarded by many- sometimes due to movement and sometimes because of dimentional variations in rifle and mount. tightening up for zero movement could close up the bolt raceway, making for difficult bolt removal.

A peepsite that does not adjust combined with a scope mount that adjusts it's self....

The front base looks like a Weaver/Picatinny type base, and will be different in both height and width to the peep sight base. Flick the peep sight, they aint that flash. And replace both bases with a decent PH one piece base thats made to fit that action. Then source some PH rings to suit - there is a few around, i may even have some to fit.

Or alternatively replace both bases with a one piece picatinny type base and use any Weaver?picatinny type ring you choose. A one piece base will allow you to remove the bolt. Which is way more important than having a peep site that aint fit for purpose if you have a scope mounted on it.

Can send you the correct front base and ring parts but you will have to use the locking wedge at the bottom from your rings, you can have them free if you want them . PM name and address and I will post to you,

First question I have, is the mount and scope for sale or even the mount by itself? I have a sporter already drilled to fit one of them and have been looking for one...

The scope rings listed above are the right ones to fit your rear mount - but to clarify what everyone hasn't explicitly stated the front base on your rifle is a chopped off weaver-style and does not match the BA21 rear base.

This will give you issues unless you grab Gary's correct front base as well - this will sort out the height mismatch and the fact you need to run two sets of rings.

Your next issue that was unfortunately common with these setups, is the floppy rear base (just hanging on via a cross pin) is a really insecure way of mounting a scope. If you plan on using a modern ali tubed scope, make sure it has a good warranty on it as these setups are brutal on scopes. This is because the action is locked at the rear of the bolt, not at the front like a Mauser-derived action or a modern Remcheshowikka what have you. Every time you fire the thing, the scope will take an amount of the forces as everything stretches between the solid front mount, the rear base and the action's locking recesses. This is why the mount you have pictured lower down came into existence - to try and isolate the scope from the shock of recoil. The Pecar likely won't survive the experience of the No4 with split mounts like that just for reference. I have a damaged one loafing that is testament to this issue!

Options you do have if you want to run a lightweight modern scope, is get hold of a one-piece bridge mount or the correct sidemount scope base setup and run with that. As far as the bolt removal, the bottom of that BA21 mount should be recessed to allow the bolt head to clearance under it same as when the base is tipped up to the vertical position although some early ones were not. Easy job to create the right recess shape in it if it isn't already there. The cone shaped hole in the BA21 mount is the recoil recess designed to engage the pin in the bottom of the rings that Gary mentioned. The correct front base has one as well.

I’ve just picked up a bitzer No1Mk3 I was going to fit it to, but have since plonked a PH5A onto.

It was last on a MLE, other than that I know nothing about it, I have never seen a side mount Lee Enfield mount in the wild.

I also have no idea what it’s worth, but am open to offers

Thanks to all who replied, and Gary for offering up the correct front mount which appears to be a major piece I was unaware I needed !

I’ve done a bit of reading on the BA21 and it would appear mine is an early non recessed variant, but appears to have been hand fitted quite tight to the action, so against all advice in the name of originality to the rifle I’m going to persist and set it up as it was originally sold with the correct rings on the BA21 and see how bad it is (or isn’t) in terms of zero, and will report back here with the results.

If it all goes to the dogs I will probably just revert to a standard No4 ladder sight.

Billymavs ..... Try these guys, never had a drama them, all above board, good comms:

https://www.redstarmountain.com/shop...tegory&path=74

Greetings @Billymavs,
Fitting a scope to a Lee Enfield, especially a No4 is a road with many pot holes as @No3 has listed above. Additional to that the rings on the side mount are likely to be for 26mm scopes rather than 1", something you may wish to check. I had a No4 that was not as nice as yours that I fitted with a 5c sight but even there I struggled to find a suitable screw for the rear. A friend had a scope snap in half on his no 4 so the BA21 may have worked OK with steel tube scopes. Might be worth just using the standard No4 Ladder sight. Mine shot very well with one in spite of my 70 plus yo eyes.
Regards Grandpamac.

@No.3
I have a mount that fits on a No4, it does have some issues but is redeemable. If a No4 mount would suit your purposes, we can talk some more.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by grandpamac

Greetings @Billymavs,
Fitting a scope to a Lee Enfield, especially a No4 is a road with many pot holes as @No3 has listed above. Additional to that the rings on the side mount are likely to be for 26mm scopes rather than 1", something you may wish to check. I had a No4 that was not as nice as yours that I fitted with a 5c sight but even there I struggled to find a suitable screw for the rear. A friend had a scope snap in half on his no 4 so the BA21 may have worked OK with steel tube scopes. Might be worth just using the standard No4 Ladder sight. Mine shot very well with one in spite of my 70 plus yo eyes.
Regards Grandpamac.

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Not sure if it belongs in this thread or in 'Bubba what have you done?' but here is what can happen when someone hits one of the potholes mentioned above.....
bonus points to those who can identify what is wrong with this picture.

Attachment 249353

Well that would make it a lot harder to adjust the windage haha.

Also the bottom half of the mount is missing in action?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by No.3

Well that would make it a lot harder to adjust the windage haha.

Also the bottom half of the mount is missing in action?

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The bottom half of the mount, note that it has not been welded in place so it is not 110% rock solid. Although it is easier to remove from a rifle and revert to iron sights, which I found to be a more viable option.

Attachment 249360

Attachment 249361

Quote:

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Originally Posted by longshot

The bottom half of the mount, note that it has not been welded in place so it is not 110% rock solid. Although it is easier to remove from a rifle and revert to iron sights, which I found to be a more viable option.

Attachment 249360

Attachment 249361

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Yeah, that ain't going back to windage adjustable...