What sort of 223?

OK, I have a little 223 I can sling on my back for the odd bigger critter when rabbit shooting but I'm not overly fussed with it. Looking at options for something slightly better. The big question is what to look for? I want something I can carry all day, so obviously not a three day long heavy varmint barrel, I'm a weedy little chap and not as young as I used to be. So that takes me more into the sporters: Marlin, Savage, Remington, Tikka, Howa, and possibly stretch to the Browning at $1399 (A-bolt?) ... or anything else. It will be suppressed with a Gunworks over barrel and probably shortened. It is likely to be used on wallabies, pigs (some a fair size), fellow, maybe goats, ... whatever else I come across. There are bigger calibres in the safe that I'd take for a deer hunt. I reload.

Points I've noted: The Tikka is available in 12" or 8" twist, the American stuff seems to be 9" twist and the Japanese 12" twist. I like the Savage 3 stage safety and the barrel nut arrangement. I don't overly like the look of the T3 bolt release, looks like an afterthought, but I have no experience with it. have heard good things about the Howa but think a higher twist rate might be better; thinking could have 55gn pills loaded for usual small game but slap in something bigger for a big pig or deer.

What are everyones thoughts?

I've had the following .223s

Savage 110 1 in 12"
Tikka T3 Varmint 1 in 8"
Miroku M-Bolt (A-Bolt in drag) 1 in 12"

Before settling on the current Sako 75 1 in 8".

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c1...MG_0410low.jpg

I've shot from 55gn to 80gn projectiles in it, but have settled on 69gn SMK and 65gn SGKs.

good on ya for getting a sako! cant beat them 75 s

I have a marlin for the kids rifle... Not to bad considering the price I paid, Shoots accurate, 1:9 twist so will run the 69's OK any thing I would like is a hinged floor plate to drop the rounds

Most of the Rem's are 1:12, SPS tactical 20" is 1:9 and they are good

Howa make a nice rifle.. Try a few in the shop sto see what fits you nicely and has the specs you want (twist etc) :)

Just had a fondle of a cz ebony edition with the spiral forged barrel. Apparently once you have adjusted the trigger they just the bomb!
not a bad price at $1459 i think with good rings in 223

If you are going with the Gunworks suppressor it would pay to talk to them about the whole deal. Robbie/Amanda can do sharp deals with rifles included, they've bought a rifle for me in the past and it was cheaper than I could find it ;)

CZ 527, unfortuately only in 1 in 12 twist but the varmint versions 'apparently' have a 1 in9. Great solid rifles, no plastic shit!

do you carry two rifles? A bit out there but you could load some sub-sonic 223 and get the same performance as a full power .22 and quieter. And put in full power for bigger game. Or you can buy my single shot H&R .223 1:9" suppressed ... :P

I have a sako Vixen in .223. Great shooter.

I've been pondering a similar question for replacing my varmint 204 once it sells - Savage and CZ are leading the race in my head.

I just got my new howa , houge stock scope and rings threaded for can . Is a very nice rifle nice trigger and finish , ncice and lite and 20 inch barrel. And gun bag under 900. You got to consider one . You are welcome to have a play with mine and see if you like it . Pm me if you want . Can put you on to where I got my deal as well .

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Originally Posted by Vapour

do you carry two rifles? A bit out there but you could load some sub-sonic 223 and get the same performance as a full power .22 and quieter. And put in full power for bigger game. Or you can buy my single shot H&R .223 1:9" suppressed ... :P

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Yes, two rifles, sometimes a 22lr and 12g shottie! :thumbsup:

Often walk 4-6 hours busting rabbits and have the second on a sling. Too many rabbits to load up the 223 for so really need to use the 22lr. Top options would be Savage, Marlin, Tikka at this stage as I would like to try a fast twist (I think). What are the trade off's with the fast/slow twist rates. Does a fast twist limit range on lighter lead tablets (I like delivering medicine)?

I'm in the market myself for a 223 for a varminter. Something to fill the gap between my 17HMR and my 7mm-08.

The leading contenders for me are a Savage model 12, a Howa 1500 (lightweight compact) or a CZ527.

Savages are tack drivers, the Howa is a hell of a gun for the money, and a CZ 527 is probably out of my price range, but damn they're pretty rifles (can't hate a 223 that's built for that size round, so it's small. Plus the set trigger and wooden stock... gotta love it).

My preference would probably be the Savage, but I'm half tempted to get the Howa and spent the extra $$ on a better scope. Plus it's already threaded so that saves me throwing more money away getting that done.

Ive had a howa and an sps tactical. The tac was an absolute tack driver with any ammo I put through it. But for a rifle that size was HEAVY. Howa was a good compromise and shot fine aswell but not aswell as the sps tac.

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2

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Originally Posted by gadgetman

Yes, two rifles, sometimes a 22lr and 12g shottie! :thumbsup:

Often walk 4-6 hours busting rabbits and have the second on a sling. Too many rabbits to load up the 223 for so really need to use the 22lr. Top options would be Savage, Marlin, Tikka at this stage as I would like to try a fast twist (I think). What are the trade off's with the fast/slow twist rates. Does a fast twist limit range on lighter lead tablets (I like delivering medicine)?

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I'm no expert but you are limited to about 60gr or less with a 1:12". If you had a 1:7" you probably will find 50 gr bullets may not shoot well. A 1:9" would be a good bet so you can use heavier projectiles on the odd occasion something bigger comes a long ...

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Originally Posted by Tussock

If you talk to Gunworks they now seem to have an office person you will have to circumvent if you want to talk to Robbie or Amanda.

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Good luck with that!! I only get Robbie's time is when he has thought of new things to call me:D
I'm lucky too have a mole that circumvents things. He is reliable and has things sorted for when I get back in country.
If they stocked Lapua brass it would be perfect. Hint Hint BD

I do drop in and see then all too often. I actually really like the Howa but think the twist rate may be too limiting. So probably looking American or Scandenavian. Any views on the 'where is my bolt' T3's?

The Savage classic is wood stock 20inch light profile barrel and is 1:9 twist. Mate has one, has accutrigger if you like those and is quite a nice looking gun. Mag fed.
I have a Rem700 Tac too which is 1:9, not mag fed, but it's heavy barrelled so not what you want.
As much as I hate to admit it, if you want a light profile barrel and fast twist get the standard blued barrel 1:8 twist Tikka T3, mag fed for $1000. Other mate has that and it shoots anything you put in it really good and probably has the best std trigger too, just don't tell him I said this.
Personally if I started again and had to buy 1:12 twist I'd get a CZ527 Ebony edition, they are pure gun porn. Pick up one and have a look in the flesh, WOW!

Had a .223 T3 in 1:8 and it shot a range of bullet weights into the same hole at 100m and my .270 T3 does the same but only shot factory 130grn in it. Some people don't like the plastic mag, bolt shroud or trigger guard but they help keep them light and seem pretty strong...though there is a company making them in metal now. The triggers on the T3's are excellent too!
I own a couple of expensive custom 700's but though a like them very much, i sometimes wonder why I spent so much on them when the T3's i've had have been so accurate straight out of the box!
Don't have much experience with the other rifles you've mentioned but you won't be disappointed if you end up with a T3!

Yes I do like the Savages, there are one or three loitering about this place. The T3's do 'leave me cold' but by all accounts they do work fairly well. It will be a working piece of equipment so I'd want to go synthetic/stainless, not that the Tikka stainless is particularly rust resistant. Might do some investigating/tyre kicking.

tikkas stainless is far better than the remington sps version. duno about the savages.

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Originally Posted by gadgetman

Yes I do like the Savages, there are one or three loitering about this place. The T3's do 'leave me cold' but by all accounts they do work fairly well. It will be a working piece of equipment so I'd want to go synthetic/stainless, not that the Tikka stainless is particularly rust resistant. Might do some investigating/tyre kicking.

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It's only $100 differance bewteen the blued/stainless so what ever you think makes it worth it.

P.S My Remington has a plastic trigger guard too and the bolt shroud might be also.....Only thing with Tikka mags is if you use high grain loads they sometimes won't fit in it. .223 mag is short.

There is also the Ruger 77 with a 9" twist. The mag issue could be a problem with the T3.

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Originally Posted by gadgetman

Yes I do like the Savages, there are one or three loitering about this place. The T3's do 'leave me cold' but by all accounts they do work fairly well. It will be a working piece of equipment so I'd want to go synthetic/stainless, not that the Tikka stainless is particularly rust resistant. Might do some investigating/tyre kicking.

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Savage stainless seems to be pretty good.

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Originally Posted by Snala

It's only $100 differance bewteen the blued/stainless so what ever you think makes it worth it.

P.S My Remington has a plastic trigger guard too and the bolt shroud might be also.....Only thing with Tikka mags is if you use high grain loads they sometimes won't fit in it. .223 mag is short.

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The Tikka mag is not too difficult to modify. The plastic blocker at the back of the mag is hollow and can be ground out. I have seen the mag that AaronB modified and it looked really good. You may have to lengthen the follower though in a 223 as there will be a pretty big empty space behind it otherwise.

Just been into a shop. There is a huge space at the back of the mag in the T3 and looking at the bolt release I can understand why so many disappear into the ether. Fondled a CZ and was quite happy to hand it back and scrub that off the list, though it was only $200 more than the T3 and had a set trigger.

Howa .223 are a fine gun with the right ammo... old 50 cent piece has 5 holes at 200m with Hornady 55gr bulk pack ammo. Haven't been able to better it with hand loads. The Howa is a bit on the heavy side. Even heavier than the 30-06 in the same model. 1 in 12 twist so not much good for the bigger bullets.

Rock River

Nah! I get bored wothout a bolt to operate.