A word to the wise re safety!

We all can make mistakes and I made a sort-of mistake last evening.

Mrs Finnwolf and I were out after rabbits, shot one with my wee Sako 22, worked the bolt and put it into the half-cocked position and walked up to the rabbit, folded down the bipod legs to prop the rifle while I gutted the rabbit.

Due to being paddle-footed at times I knocked the rifle and tipping it downhill onto its side.

Propped the rifle back up, finished gutting the rabbit then picked up the rifle and carried on looking for more rabbits, after five or so minutes I decided to check the status of the rifle only to discover the wee bolt fully closed!!:wtfsmilie:

I guess when I tipped the rifle onto its side it landed on the bolt and fully closed it, luckily with firm self imposed rule of no finger inside trigger (2lb pull) I wasn’t likely to accidentally fire the rifle but hey, ‘shit can happen’

Be careful out there people, stuff like that doesn’t always happen to ‘someone else’

In that situation (putting the rifle down) I would have had the bolt fully open, or closed and uncocked on an empty chamber. I only use half cock when I'm carrying the rifle and expecting to see game.

These sorts of reminders are good for us all.

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Originally Posted by jakewire

These sorts of reminders are good for us all.

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Exactly why I posted about this event - if it saves it happening to somebody I’d be happy.

My boo-boo was while carrying my Win M94 leveraction with one in the chamber but uncocked, I climbed over a log and semi-fell into a hole filled with supplejack and sticks. Once I climbed my way out I noticed the hammer was now cocked. It could have been very nasty if the supplejack etc had also held the lever against the stock and bumped the trigger.

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Originally Posted by Finnwolf

We all can make mistakes and I made a sort-of mistake last evening.

Mrs Finnwolf and I were out after rabbits, shot one with my wee Sako 22, worked the bolt and put it into the half-cocked position and walked up to the rabbit, folded down the bipod legs to prop the rifle while I gutted the rabbit.

Due to being paddle-footed at times I knocked the rifle and tipping it downhill onto its side.

Propped the rifle back up, finished gutting the rabbit then picked up the rifle and carried on looking for more rabbits, after five or so minutes I decided to check the status of the rifle only to discover the wee bolt fully closed!!:wtfsmilie:

I guess when I tipped the rifle onto its side it landed on the bolt and fully closed it, luckily with firm self imposed rule of no finger inside trigger (2lb pull) I wasn’t likely to accidentally fire the rifle but hey, ‘shit can happen’

Be careful out there people, stuff like that doesn’t always happen to ‘someone else’

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....are you still going to be walking around with your rifle on half cock?

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Originally Posted by Nickoli

....are you still going to be walking around with your rifle on half cock?

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In easy paddocks and expecting to shoot? - mostly yes, done so for last 35+ years.
But now will open bolt when putting rifle down.

And remember, when you shoot your stag of a lifetime (or of the weekend) this roar, to double check that you haven't chambered another round on autopilot in case it jumps up again.

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Originally Posted by Kimber 7mm-08

And remember, when you shoot your stag of a lifetime (or of the weekend) this roar, to double check that you haven't chambered another round on autopilot in case it jumps up again.

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i totally disagree

one up the spout and carefully walk in with the safety off and finger on the trigger

I shot a stag for a farmer and to save meat damage I shot it in the "head"
went down like the proverbial sack of potatoes
when I was a meter from it it got up and chased me

now everything gets one in the brain as soon as I walk up to it

any time I put my rifle down or climb a fence while stalking I unload the chamber, but definitely not when walking up to something with antlers and a 300kg weight advantage, haha

Yep that's true, the reload is automatic and it should be. Next we will have to stop shooting things because it means loading the rifle.

As for a "half cock" bolt position - it should be done away with. In the event described if the OP had used his safety there would have been no issue.

The half cock position for a bolt rifle is a leftover from the old .303 days and is senseless or more dangerous depending on the rifle. Some rifles will decock themselves when the bolt flips shut. (Sakos, Tikkas and others) meaning you get a primer strike and the firing pin is then against the primer waiting for a knock to the butt until the operator notices.

There is no point in using the bolt of the rifle as a really large safety catch, if you already have an actual safety catch.

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Originally Posted by Bill999

i totally disagree

one up the spout and carefully walk in with the safety off and finger on the trigger

I shot a stag for a farmer and to save meat damage I shot it in the "head"
went down like the proverbial sack of potatoes
when I was a meter from it it got up and chased me

now everything gets one in the brain as soon as I walk up to it

any time I put my rifle down or climb a fence while stalking I unload the chamber, but definitely not when walking up to something with antlers and a 300kg weight advantage, haha

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Ah, for sure. I agree with what you said regarding approaching a shot stag.What I tried to get across but failed is to make sure once it's down (dead), to check if you have a round up the spout that you may have forgotten about in the heat of the moment.

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Originally Posted by Kimber 7mm-08

Ah, for sure. I agree with what you said regarding approaching a shot stag.What I tried to get across but failed is to make sure once it's down (dead), to check if you have a round up the spout that you may have forgotten about in the heat of the moment.

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yep id emptied my gun and locked it in my vehicle then climbed the fence to go 150-200m over and inspect my good work

bad move

Thanks for sharing @Finnwolf
I no longer use a half-bolt. I had a number of times when the bolt would either be knocked closed (very dangerous) or knocked open (very noisy). I now use the safety instead, as the rifle was designed to do.

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Originally Posted by Dama dama

Thanks for sharing @Finnwolf
I no longer use a half-bolt. I had a number of times when the bolt would either be knocked closed (very dangerous) or knocked open (very noisy). I now use the safety instead, as the rifle was designed to do.

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@Dama dama - in my growing up days Dad used to tell me not to trust a safety (possibly because in older guns some were pretty weak and/or unreliable.)

Being left handed the bolt handle is (normally!) easy to shield with my body and visually check.

With the Finnwolf I’ve no option as it doesn’t have facility for a half open bolt!

Thanks for posting, and glad nobody was injured. I love to learn when someone else has paid the school fees! :thumbsup:

Couple of things here.
First one was Finnwolf admitting to a whoops and learning from it.
Second is a combination of things
I was taught never to trust a safety as it is a mechanical device and can fail but therein lies the rub.
Always treat the firearm as loaded (especially if it is).
A safety is that last line of defence after you have loaded the firearm and in the case of stalking after an animal and think you are going to fire very soon
I do realise half bolts have had that distinction for years but it does come back to the 303 reference earlier
No one else in the world does this like us.
A half cock is obviously fine if designed properly but as we've seen it doesnt always work in the case of a whoops.
A safety also doesnt count in the case either as it could also be bumped just as easily.
Dont worry, had a couple of woops In close succession with a half notch on a lever action that had me that angry with myself it nearly got thrown out to sea (at stewart island). This was something I had done countless times with no incident and did it twice in two days. The second time was worse as I mistakenly thought I was being even more careful.

Thanks Finnwolf.

You need to know your own rifle.
Half open bolt is for SMLE.
For Sako I use the safety:
Close bolt in safe direction.
Apply safety (pull back)
Check bolt is locked closed.
Point rifle in safe direction and pull the trigger real hard.
This is a “previously tested safety catch”
Carry with safety on till I get back onto a track or fire it.
Recheck after crawling through thick scrub as Ive had it flick off twice and the gun was live.

For those with the three point Mauser style safeties on the bolt (e.g. Kimber), what do you guys use? I tend to hunt with an empty chamber these days or half cock if approaching a known animal then clear chamber if no shot taken.

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Originally Posted by Bagheera

Thanks Finnwolf.

You need to know your own rifle.
Half open bolt is for SMLE.
For Sako I use the safety:
Close bolt in safe direction.
Apply safety (pull back)
Check bolt is locked closed.
Point rifle in safe direction and pull the trigger real hard.
This is a “previously tested safety catch”
Carry with safety on till I get back onto a track or fire it.
Recheck after crawling through thick scrub as Ive had it flick off twice and the gun was live.

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Pretty much my approach when hunting by myself. Unload if I have an obstacle to negotiate (steep bank etc). I generally run an empty chamber when hunting with others unless there is a reason to be "on point".

mate bought a 6.5x55mm off this forum and that to runs with a cock on opening bolt like the SMLE so open bolt just as relavent... the old SMLE safety wasnt safe..it could be knocked and fire,WHY the WHOLE OPEN BOLT THING WAS STARTED AND ENDORSED..... I still use open bolt with modern bolt actions,Im a dinosaur but thats OK.
I put shotgun down 40 years ago,climbed through fence,picked up rabbit and looked back at shotgun,laying on ground pointed at me...lesson learnt-muzzle control.
the wee 7.62x39mm would close bolt if trigger pulled,but didnt fire,did cock ourselves up with it one day ,bolt closed and it didnt fire,but only happened the once,must have pulled trigger and it stayed off striker when bolt shut...that is the one and only issue Ive had in 40 years of using the system.
one day the method of altered safety/bolt that the Duleys do/did will be come standard...the safety altered so it will lock bolt open and unable to fire or move bolt.

I have had my tikka modded with the half cock safety lock which I think is the best of the options. the bolt is locked in half cock when safety is on and the chances of the safety letting go and simultaneously closing the bolt and pulling the trigger all by itself must be tiny .
And our levers are the marlins with half cock hammer and cross bar safety , which we use both at the same time - cant get much safer than that short of nothing in chamber .

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Originally Posted by Kimber 7mm-08

For those with the three point Mauser style safeties on the bolt (e.g. Kimber), what do you guys use? I tend to hunt with an empty chamber these days or half cock if approaching a known animal then clear chamber if no shot taken.

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Half cock with the web of my thumb on the bolt for my kimbers

Usually only when things start getting serious but my typical shot is 21m so things can hear you racking your noise maker

It’s not like I get out of my truck load a round half cock and throw it over my back and spend the day walking just when you expect to take a shot

The safety seems backwards on the Kimber for my preference and harder to notice (being non intuitive) than the big knob of a bolt that in up position is safe and down is fire


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Greetings all.
First thankyou to @Finnwolf for mentioning your experience. That and the discussion it has generated is helpful to everyone. I note that there are a number who still use the part open bolt with an extra of having the thumb over the bolt to stop it popping open and to check that it is still part open. No problem here. For the balance of us, especially newbys, to my mind the regularly tested safety catch is the safest option. While I was writing this I realised that I couldn't remember what the part open position on my two tikka rfles was like so out to the shed to check, not with a live round though. Turns out they were reasonably stable with one a bit better than the other. My future hunting is likely to be limited so I think I will still use the safety when close to game, only when of the track and with the sling stowed in my day pack. I also noticed that the Tikka safety locks the bolt like my old M700 .308, a plus to my mind.
To @Micky Duck I think that the improvement of the part open bolt for the NZ market was suggested to one of the big US makers, possibly Remington, but they were not interested. I don't expect any of them will be today either.
Regards Grandpamac.

Greetings again all,
After my last post I thought I should be really sure of what was currently in the Arms code about bolt actions. The code still talks of half open action where the cartridge is partly in the chamber and is basically what was in the code 50 plus years ago when many still had a .303 as their main hunting rifle. It is a reasonably convenient way to carry a cock on closing action with the firing spring stopping the bolt from going fully froward and your thumb stopping it from falling back. This position is nowhere near as convenient with a cock on opening action as most are these days. The position I call part open and others call half cock (it makes my skin crawl to actually type that) has the cartridge almost fully in the chamber with just a downward pressure on the bolt to have the rifle rady to fire as Finnwolf discovered. For firearms that can not use the half open bolt the arms code recomends the use of a previously tested safety catch and to my mind this applies to cock on opening bolt actions.
Regards Grandpamac.

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Originally Posted by grandpamac

Greetings again all,
After my last post I thought I should be really sure of what was currently in the Arms code about bolt actions. The code still talks of half open action where the cartridge is partly in the chamber and is basically what was in the code 50 plus years ago when many still had a .303 as their main hunting rifle. It is a reasonably convenient way to carry a cock on closing action with the firing spring stopping the bolt from going fully froward and your thumb stopping it from falling back. This position is nowhere near as convenient with a cock on opening action as most are these days. The position I call part open and others call half cock (it makes my skin crawl to actually type that) has the cartridge almost fully in the chamber with just a downward pressure on the bolt to have the rifle rady to fire as Finnwolf discovered. For firearms that can not use the half open bolt the arms code recomends the use of a previously tested safety catch and to my mind this applies to cock on opening bolt actions.
Regards Grandpamac.

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Agreed, outdated, generational and an inherently ‘kiwi’ approach that in my opinion is now not best practice.
A good discussion piece.
In my 20s I took a fall and thanked my lucky stars the bolt was closed on an empty chamber as I cartwheeled with the muzzle lodged in my groin. It hurt like hell but was quite aware of the consequences for my pelvis and major blood vessels.