The Zero Check Thread

I check zero every so often. Like when I have an unexplained miss on an animal I'll either do a proper target test or shoot something like a pine cone etc after checking range with rangefinder. Invariably it's operator error. Anyway, as I use my rifles on a weekly basis I'm pretty confident they're pretty good at maintaining zero and I'm happy with overall accuracy. Don't have any fancy Ballistic x photos or anything but a few photos from a range shoot in Westport a couple of weeks ago. Two rifles, a 223 and a 6.5CM. Both hunting rifles shooting F-class FPR. The odd sighter out of groups is due to calibration not being quite right on individual targets so had to adjust but same for everyone who competed. Bad shots are just operator error/not reading wind right. Anyhow, I don't get too serious with stuff but I'm reasonably happy with my setups. They get me animals ok. Hope pictures/captions load ok.

223, 55gr v-max Attachment 271657
223, 73gr ELDM Attachment 271661
6.5CM 147gr ELDM 600yd target shot @ 700yds. Attachment 271662
6.5CM 147 ELDM Attachment 271658
6.5CM 147 ELDM Attachment 271663

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Originally Posted by woods223

I check zero every so often. Like when I have an unexplained miss on an animal I'll either do a proper target test or shoot something like a pine cone etc after checking range with rangefinder. Invariably it's operator error. Anyway, as I use my rifles on a weekly basis I'm pretty confident they're pretty good at maintaining zero and I'm happy with overall accuracy. Don't have any fancy Ballistic x photos or anything but a few photos from a range shoot in Westport a couple of weeks ago. Two rifles, a 223 and a 6.5CM. Both hunting rifles shooting F-class FPR. The odd sighter out of groups is due to calibration not being quite right on individual targets so had to adjust but same for everyone who competed. Bad shots are just operator error/not reading wind right. Anyhow, I don't get too serious with stuff but I'm reasonably happy with my setups. They get me animals ok. Hope pictures/captions load ok.

223, 55gr v-max Attachment 271657
223, 73gr ELDM Attachment 271661
6.5CM 147gr ELDM 600yd target shot @ 700yds. Attachment 271662
6.5CM 147 ELDM Attachment 271658
6.5CM 147 ELDM Attachment 271663

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Your groups will kill deer,thats all that matters.

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Originally Posted by nor-west

20 shot groups should be the minimum, hot barrels be buggered. I guess I'll keep being a dinosaur and consider 5 shot groups is all I need. I cannot recall ever having to shoot 10 shots while out hunting. Tell me again why we need to burn powder, primers and barrels because someone decided its now necessary to have 10 shot groups for a hunting rifle?

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because some people need to boost their egos...

In case of shifting poi check your suppressor if you have one. carbon build up will add mass... which will alter harmonics...

same as a tuner essentially

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Originally Posted by STC

In case of shifting poi check your suppressor if you have one. carbon build up will add mass... which will alter harmonics...

same as a tuner essentially

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How much carbon weight have you see produce this? How much POI shift ?

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Originally Posted by gimp

How much carbon weight have you see produce this? How much POI shift ?

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I’d like to see some figures too. Of the various suppressors I’ve had over the years can’t say I’ve noticed any significant hunting accuracy shift with suppressor carbon build up. Couple of CJA AR15’s the suppressors hardly ever came off rifle, Gunworks can’t clean anyway. By the time the suppressor was getting carboned up (4000+ rounds ) the rifle was getting worn out anyway, still shot good enough for pest control work. As an aside, I still don’t clean suppressors, they run quieter with a bit of carbon buildup and I can’t be arsed with cleaning all the time. Each to their own though.

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Originally Posted by woods223

I’d like to see some figures too. Of the various suppressors I’ve had over the years can’t say I’ve noticed any significant hunting accuracy shift with suppressor carbon build up. Couple of CJA AR15’s the suppressors hardly ever came off rifle, Gunworks can’t clean anyway. By the time the suppressor was getting carboned up (4000+ rounds ) the rifle was getting worn out anyway, still shot good enough for pest control work. As an aside, I still don’t clean suppressors, they run quieter with a bit of carbon buildup and I can’t be arsed with cleaning all the time. Each to their own though.

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Actual real world experience :thumbsup:

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Originally Posted by STC

because some people need to boost their egos...

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No. Different strokes for different folks. Some people prefer a science/evidence based approach. Not everyone's' cup of tea but you don't have to drink it.

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Originally Posted by gimp

How much carbon weight have you see produce this? How much POI shift ?

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on my rifles? none... because I clean them. on other peoples suppressors that I serviced (because i got the clamps to separate stuck baffles) a surprising amount. layers that could be measured in mm...

Without knowing the exact density of the built up carbon the added weight would be multiple grams.

given that barrel tuners (which essentially shift a small amount of mass fractions of a mm) have a measurable effect on harmonics (poi, group size) this might simply be one of the contributing factors to shifting pois or peoples hunting rifle "suddenly" stopping to shoot well...

Now add to that that many suppressors (hardy) can't be opened to clean them...

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Originally Posted by STC

In case of shifting poi check your suppressor if you have one. carbon build up will add mass... which will alter harmonics...

same as a tuner essentially

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I ran 1 DPT [ 223] can wet recently. It means the wd40 peels off the carbon. But found it was louder and defeated any purpose so going back to dry. No real drama with cleaning because we run a regular strip and clean. 2C. Oh yes it had a powder discharge each round which was somewhat disconcerting probably because running wet.

The 223 on deer thread has urged me to set up an 18' 223 to run on general pest control.

I picked up a 8 twist barrel off of a mate recently, cut it back to 18" and have been running the same load my tikka varmint likes.

has only been on some small missions, not rough pack in pack out type stuff. checked zero over the weekend.

Date: 18/03/2025
Range: 100m
Rifle: Tikka t3 .223
Optic: Vortex PST Gen1 2.5-10
Mounts: Nightforce ultralight 30mm 6 screw
Ammunition: Hornady 80gr ELDm Relaods - GG Brass - 2206h - CCI450
Context: Last zero checked 5th march after installing barrel. has since been rattled around in the ute and been taken out on the farm. nothing strenuous.

Attachment 271871

Here is the result of Zeroing a new to me Kimber 84M 308 this morning. Attachment 272060

Im pretty happy with this group from a light rifle like this. The load is a @gimp special, just pick a good projectile, put a suitable powder behind it, enough to give you the velocity you want, seat to mag depth and go shoot. In this case is a load that is "safe" in most 308s, I do carefully monitor the first few bangs, and chrony them. However the crony got left at home today so lucky me, Ill just have to go back and recheck it before dark.

Attachment 272114

This mornings effort with a wee variation on technique for lightweight rifles.

Left is S&L, 8 shots 77 TMKs. Middle is Kimber 84M 308 with 155 TMKs and a LVR ladder. Right id the 84M again, 5 shots with Hornardy 155 ELDMs at 2600. The 84M has a non dial scope so is sighted in 60mm high at 100M for a 200M zero.

Swap scopes back to the Maven RS 1.2 on the 6mm CM and a different load with 108 Berger elite hunters just because I like to fiddle plus I haven’t gotten round to buying more 108 eld-m’s yet.
Only 5 shots, adjusted 1/10th up then out to 371m
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...ca38d7e9ac.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...a4e671aa3d.jpg


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223 64gn Berger, the left group is with some Hornady brass I had from that old training ammo they used to sell that I loaded up to try.

The right group is with my normal load (American eagle brass, think it’s federal and there’s not a centred flash hole on any of them :D )

Both just under an inch, interesting that the Hornady brass was quite a bit slower, ES a bit average on both but I really shoot past 250 with it so I’m not worried

Attachment 273154