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Looking at building a 3.5t trailer and wondering if anyone has recommendations for a decent tandem braking/axle setup?
Quite a few manufactures out there, don't really want to have a ute mounted controller so was looking at the cable setups with disks or 4 drums. Are there any manufactures to avoid?
The cheap ass in me just says put 3.5t spring, axles and wheels on it with 2.5t hydraulic brakes but I want to do it properly for a big flatdeck tipper trailer. Cheers for any help.
If you register it as the TB class (3500Kg max weight) the WOF guys should ping you if you use a 2500Kg override hydraulic coupling on it. The main reason for the difference in the couplings is the rules state that the TB Class trailers must activate their brakes if they separate from the tow vehicle - and the 2500Kg override hydraulic coupling can't do that (the trailer basically leans on the towing vehicle which pushes the hydraulic piston, pressurizes the hydraulics which applies the brakes).
Usually on the TB class you will need all four wheels braked, you won't get the minimum rated braking effort from a single pair of calipers as far as I'm aware although things might have changed.
With these, you can get electric operated braking systems which have a battery on the trailer, a breakaway switch and run of the towing vehicles headlights for power and brake lights to activate the brakes, and normally have some sort of braking effort controller and an inertia controller on the trailer so the wheels don't lock up when it's empty and you hit the brakes. Electric don't like crap or water in them though, if you go near ironsands forget them! Most people run some form of controller in the tow vehicle though and electric over hydraulic or pneumatic over hydraulic, it just depends what you want either permanently fitted or a wireless controller that runs off the 12v socket. Redarc is one brand of gear, there are others out there and most are good.
Initial thoughts was get set like this but its not going to be cheap
https://trailparts.co.nz/product/10183/tk3500tbh/
Yeah, if you piece together a setup you can do it for a lot less basically welding up your own axles etc but the thing with that gear as a kit is it all turns up ready to go (as long as it fits your trailer).
If you a willing to shop about and haunt Trademe and Marketplace you can pick up used gear and rebuild it and come out well under that, but its a lot more hassle...
I converted a tandem to braked 2500Kg for a mate a while back, and all up not including my time it was less than $500 including the calipers, discs, coupling, connection kit, and a couple of bits I had to modify and fab up. WoF guys had no idea it was never braked, so I guess I did my job right.
I managed to get good second hand coupling and caliper sets (about 6 sets of calipers in a bulk deal and sold off everything that we didn't need which reduced the costs a lot). Got a hydraulic piping kit off Trademe for under a hundy, had a set of disc hubs ex a boat that were rusty as F that just needed the discs skimmed (which was actually a bastard of a job in my lathe) and the rest was my time. Improved the towing manners of the trailer no end, when it was unbraked it surged and shoved the towing vehicle all over the road and after fitting it with brakes it became a kitten. Solved all of the surging and shoving, as every time it leaned on the tow vehicle it lightly applied it's own brakes and settled back to where it should be.
Incidentally, the TB-class gear doesn't do that, it will still surge and shove given half a chance and that's part of the reason why most people go for the full electronic in cab controllers as you have a button to hit to manually apply the brakes on the trailer independent of the towing vehicle's brakes so if the trailer gets squiffy you can give it a quick tap to settle it back into line.
Putting my own kit together would be cheaper and I might do that anyway, would be easier if it was going to be 2.5t not 3.5t.Quote:
Originally Posted by No.3
work mate has a large trailer boat with diesel engine. Was supplied with just override brakes on 1 axle, but the minute you add a tank of diesel plus some dive gear and everything else you get well over the weight for override brakes.
Being the sort of guy he is he had them upgraded to electric with a controller in the Ute.
What he has found is that with brakes on only 1 axle it eats disks quite quickly.
Z
Won't help with being dunked as well, especially if it's salt water. That was what took out the disc hubs I used on the tandem, cheaper and quicker to replace the entire axle for a commercial workboat as the axle (duratorque) was rooted as well. I threw the rest in the scrap, but kept the hubs.Quote:
Originally Posted by ZQLewis
This is part of the reason that the heavy trailers are normally set up with both axles braked, most braked axles are either rated to 1850 or 2250Kg not the full 3500Kg. It means the controller ends up winding full on every time you hit the brakes rather than a more gentle application over both axles. Having said that, increased maintenance is probably cheaper than two axle sets at build time so it's a bit of a choice thing (also how many Kms do most boat trailers do???).
I have an Ifor Williams 3.5T plant trailer. So is all kitted up with what passes for standard in Europe as over ride brakes. But works on linkages that operate 4 x drum brake setups. With a cut away cable that puts all the brakes on if the trailer parts ways with the tow vehicle (or you forget to unclip the carabiner when disconnecting.....). Never waggles, and brakes very smoothly.
I have the same but Brian James bloody fantastic bit of kit years of hard work with no issues at all.Quote:
Originally Posted by XR500
I've got one too, carries a 2.5T+ digger with utter reliability. The type is called a "Knott system" originating in Germany. If I had to build a new trailer I'd seriously consider wrecking a caravan or other euro trailer so equipped to obtain one (assuming they are not avaliable new here).Quote:
Originally Posted by XR500
Looks like you can get the Knott System new in NZ. Seems you can get it through TWL as wellQuote:
Originally Posted by Tentman
https://knottsolutions.co.nz/product...-kits&prod=688
Huh, very interesting. Thanks. I've had my Ifor 8 years, it's passed its wof first time every time and the only maintenance it's had is a set of tyres. It doesn't do big miles but is in use most days, my truck does about 15,000 km per year, I'd say the trailer does 5-7,000 Km per annum
My caravan has the Knott breaks 4 axle drums and breakaway cable set up. When purchased I had to replace all the breaks and bearings etc… did it my self.
Ordered parts off trademe (came from uk in under 1 week) and cheap.
The break shoes automatically allow for reversing with out any changes… great system
Yeah, they are good but have a slight (or maybe more correct a potential) disadvantage that the setup with the cables doesn't really like being dragged over areas with a lot of debris - but then to be fair not much really does. Just with the cable setup the cables can get caught up and either damaged or start partially applying the brakes on the affected hub. Ask me how I found that out...
Ive had mine bellied twice with big loads of posts and winched it out with no consequences but I was possibly lucky . . .
if you want to got the electric way
https://www.elecbrakes.com/
no mods to the tow vehicle, its standalone on the trailer
http://cmtrailer.co.nz/brakes-hardwa...hanical-3500kg
This is similar to the Knott system. All Brian James trailers run the Alko gear along with a lot of pommy caravans. The gear from CM is heavy duty, ready to weld into 65x65x6 SHS axle beam.
I did a lot of road testing on a trailer fitted with this kit & was amazed by its performance in comparison with hydraulic disc.
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15 years of farm use with ours disagrees with that statement.Quote:
Originally Posted by No.3
Maybe I've been lucky ?
your way to gentle bro basically a townie nowQuote:
Originally Posted by BRADS
Cheers for the recommendations guys. Been into TWL and requested a price for Knott system set, should get a decent discount through work so see what it comes back with
Or, maybe I was really unlucky. Cooked one side brake setup, had to replace a blued stub, hub and brake setup and the tyre was rooted from the odd skid. It pulled the cable out of it's mechanism so the thing couldn't release... Something to be aware of though more as a 'when you get back to the road' deal, just a quick check that all is rolling nice I think. Had no other problems since but it was expensive so worthwhile being aware of the possibility.Quote:
Originally Posted by BRADS
Looks like that Knott kit is about $6k+ gst by the time you ad wheels and springs. Tempted to look at the Hygo2 system as their quote came in around $4.5k+ even though it was listed on their website at $7k+ gst
Go to Treadway direct for a Knott price. TWL are third party in that equipment.Quote:
Originally Posted by NZ32
BNT could do a price on the CM gear.
Pretty sure the Trailparts Hygo stuff needs an exemption as it's not ECE approved like Alko & Knott.
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Cheers for the recommendations guys, just about finished my trailer. Few last things to sort out before I strip it down and get the chassis galvanized. Ended up going with the Knott system which was easy to setup and provides great braking, much less of a shunt when you hit the brakes when compared to some hydraulic systems.
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Fuk thats cool
Thought a few of you guys might like it. Taken me a few weekends to get it all sorted, as some will work out its a light truck deck on a trailer frame. 3x1.8m deck and then I have cut the headboard out so it drops down, give you 3.8m from front of the headboard to the tailgate.Quote:
Originally Posted by blip
Weighbridge last night came to 1140kg so will be a 2.3t payload with the brake setup.
Bloody nice. Did you weigh it on the jockey wheel & not on towball?Quote:
Originally Posted by NZ32
There's no allowance for proportioning any weight to tow vehicle under light trailer rules. It's known as GTM - Gross Towable Mass, which is 3500kg for you.
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Interesting thing, as I've never had a trailer separated from the combination to check it's within weight. You are right though, although in real world they normally weigh out each axle and if any is overweight you are pinged doesn't matter if it's tow vehicle or trailer. I have never been able to work out what the axle weights are for a TB-class trailer though, so have no idea what the actual weight limit per axle is.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathias
Weighed my ute then the ute & trailer and did the sums, allowed me to take the towball weight out of the mix and get the total trailer weight.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathias
Best not to take the trailer off on the weighbridge when a log truck could pull in behind.
You just wind the jockey wheel down on the weight bridge and unhitch it, leave all the chains and wires hooked up, real quick.
It works in some cases, one of our local weighbridges that doesn't work as the ramp down doesn't let you lower the jockey wheel with a lot of tow vehicles.Quote:
Originally Posted by Savage1
I just use the one at work/the mill so easy to weigh twice
Really cool rig. Love it and I hate to be that person........but but but FJ 45? max recommended tow capacity 2 or 2.5 T?
You used the escape word....recommended [emoji16]Quote:
Originally Posted by Got-ya
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Recommended ��
Got a 4L 12HT in it, 5 speed, disks, air bags in the back and power steering. Should be fine loaded up.
