Eastern F&G Ballot holders to be charged a "maintenance" fee

Got my reconfirmation letter today, and it seems that from next year, successful ballot holders will be charged a fee for "Annual Habitat Management".This is to give them funds to "subsidise the costs of employing short term staff appropriately qualified and experienced to undertake all of the weed spraying and physical maintenance works required".
This is being done because many ballot holders don't do a bloody thing to leave their stand and surrounds in a better state than when they got their ballot. So now those of us that do the work each year, are going to subsidise the lazy bastards, who will do even less now! There was a rule that allowed F&G to kick out any ballot holders who did not keep their maimai and surrounds in good condition, but I guess the definition of good was totally subjective, and too hard to enforce.
I sympathise with F&G, as they need to do something to maintain their wetlands, however, I fear that now that there is no requirement for the ballot holder to do any work, there will be even less respect shown for the wetlands.
Also of concern is the statement " .... DOC, which has an interest in the reserves also, has concerns in relation to the unsightly nature of some of the maimais..." . I shudder to think of the ramifications of that statement should DOC chose to become heavy handed.
The fee is proposed to be "set at as conservative a level as possible, and would apply to [U]each[U]of the hunters holding the stand".

I think a bit of consultation would have been good on such a contentious issue.!

I agree ...consultation would have been a very good idea on such an issue ... 'the unsightly nature of some of the maimais" ... what does good condition of surrounds actually mean, perhaps collection of spent ammo? So just how much is this going to cost the ballot holders ... mmmmmm?

Lentil, is there a fee associated with the ballot in the first place...

Like most of these things, they are probably testing the waters to gauge the reaction. There are so many questions that need to be answered, and the whole thing is open to interpretation.
To me it would have been more sensible for F&G to inspect every maimai each year and recommend remedial work for those ballot holders that need to do some work. Give them plenty of notice, and after 2 strikes, they are out!
I can imagine that our extra payment will all go on a couple of stands each year ( unless the charge is quite substantial). If a couple of stands is all that gets sorted each year, then surely there is a better, more cost effective way.

I notice that on the wetland that I shoot, some stands have mum, dad and 3 kids as ballot holders. F&G say they are going to charge each ballot holders. How is that fair?

Hence your very valid statement re consultation with the ballot holders ... sorry, Lentil, I am not a waterfowler so I do not know the ramifications of this issue totally but the example you give re the stand where the couple with their three children are ballot holders ... if the father was to become the only ballot holder does that mean that his family cannot be present? I imagine the children would be made ballot holders for their use later on ... a generational aspect ...

physical maintenance work ... I wonder what that means ...!!

Building consents and planning permission for maimais, drainage and sewerage and traffic management for access sites. These may sound funny but from what you say its not a great leap as once you start regulating one thing others add on very quickly. The question should be asked how much of these fees will be spent on the admin the new system requires, how much on actual inspection and will it achieve anything.
I have a very low opinion of f&g their aspirations are to be commended but their delivery is severly flawed.

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Originally Posted by Marty Henry

Building consents and planning permission for maimais, drainage and sewerage and traffic management for access sites. These may sound funny but from what you say its not a great leap as once you start regulating one thing others add on very quickly. The question should be asked how much of these fees will be spent on the admin the new system requires, how much on actual inspection and will it achieve anything.
I have a very low opinion of f&g their aspirations are to be commended but their delivery is severly flawed.

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I agree. There are some very good people in Eastern F&G, and the intentions of this new system - on the surface - seem fine. After all, any improvements in the wetland that enhance our waterfowl, has to be good. I have seen some parts of the Kaituna wetland choke up with raupo and weed over the last 10 years. However, I cannot see how a "conservative" fee will be enough to pay for manpower to do enough work to maintain all stands. I believe that they will use the fund to clean up some stands that never get maintained, and that brings us back to the rest of us paying to get lazy bastards stands sorted. I say no. Sort out the real problem!

[QUOTEThere are some very good people in Eastern F&G][/QUOTE]

yea where were they when some idiot put in a hen pheasant limit ??
most of easterns counsillors probably to busy poking thier snouts into hawkes bays coffers and bizz.
im kidding sort of :D ofcourse there are good people in eastern thers just been very little evidence of thir influence in the last year or 3.
our ballots down here at boggy creek, the land now in docs hands but formerly f&g owned, is admisistered by f&g.
the ballots are given to one person and are redone yearly who we have as well in our maimai is only restricted by its size.
im more than a little suspicious and nervous of thier motives given they get a 100 buks a year already to look after wetlands, gamebirds from you already.
have you been asked who you have in your pozzy besides the ballot holder yet. that would make me cringe???

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Got my reconfirmation letter today, and it seems that from next year, successful ballot holders will be charged a fee for "Annual Habitat Management".

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who physicly owns the wetland f&g or Doc personaly i think they got a fuckin cheek considering if you have multiple ballot holder then you have multiple licence buyers to.

We get checked by rangers every year (twice this year), and police accompanied them this year also. I have nothing to hide, but get annoyed that we get targeted, because everyone has a licence ( a condition of getting a ballot), so just an easy way of stacking up licence checks/ticking boxes? The chance of finding any non-compliance on balloted wetlands is very low.

I'll bet DoC has had a lot more to do with this than is readily apparent. don't forget their attempt a few years back to bring in regulations to have all dogs leashed on their "estate". I contested this at a Taupo Council meeting some years back.

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Originally Posted by Woody

I'll bet DoC has had a lot more to do with this than is readily apparent. don't forget their attempt a few years back to bring in regulations to have all dogs leashed on their "estate". I contested this at a Taupo Council meeting some years back.

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No mate read the minutes for Easter F & G ...... DOC hardly attends meetings have minimal contact with F & G

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Originally Posted by Lentil

We get checked by rangers every year (twice this year), and police accompanied them this year also. I have nothing to hide, but get annoyed that we get targeted, because everyone has a licence ( a condition of getting a ballot), so just an easy way of stacking up licence checks/ticking boxes? The chance of finding any non-compliance on balloted wetlands is very low.

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I have only been checked once in Thirty Years then the numpty couldn't spell my name as the licence was in my truck I had to fill out his compliance book for him

Bonecrucher Is that 2 words or 1, is it a K or a c for crusher? Is it your first/second or third name. According to Google you don't know how to spell your own name. There are many ways to spell the same name, so yes we do ask how do you spell Graeme at times. Not all Game bird shooters speak so clearly and eloquently as you do. Who in their right mind would walk around in the quick sand and God forsaken spot that you shoot in. People do get checked in Balloted areas, it a very quick way F?G can access numbers being shot, Maimai's that are not being used but were balloted for, hunter behavior etc. I think F/G management of ours and certainly Bonecrushers area has a lot to be desired. Will I renew this year? probably as for us it's not about the ducks. Will I range this year probably not. I have rebuilt every Maimai that I have won in a ballot at some cost to me. I'm really suspicious on what F/G are considering.

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Originally Posted by Gapped axe

Bonecrucher Is that 2 words or 1, is it a K or a c for crusher? Is it your first/second or third name. According to Google you don't know how to spell your own name. There are many ways to spell the same name, so yes we do ask how do you spell Graeme at times. Not all Game bird shooters speak so clearly and eloquently as you do. Who in their right mind would walk around in the quick sand and God forsaken spot that you shoot in. People do get checked in Balloted areas, it a very quick way F?G can access numbers being shot, Maimai's that are not being used but were balloted for, hunter behavior etc. I think F/G management of ours and certainly Bonecrushers area has a lot to be desired. Will I renew this year? probably as for us it's not about the ducks. Will I range this year probably not. I have rebuilt every Maimai that I have won in a ballot at some cost to me. I'm really suspicious on what F/G are considering.

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"Bonecrusher" was a race horse my nickname is horse / hoss so why not be the best horse that ever ran around a race track.
Over the thirty years that I have shot includes the Manawatu, Canterbury, Eastern + at least two other area's I have only ever been checked the once ;-) I'm always legal buy my license and spend fair too many dollars on gear every season my girls reckon I'm the ultimate consumer
No quick sand in the area I shoot at Aniwhenua Gapped Axe just a 400 metre wade in with the waders on float the deeks in on a plastic sledge mate

I think Eastern have just looked over the Kaimai's at Waikato F & G ballot system and followed that nothing new in what they propose, the issue with the Council make up in Eastern is that most of the Councillors aren't active duck shooters majority fish only so hence lead by the nose so to speak

I have rebuilt every Maimai that I have won in a ballot at some cost to me.

This year (with a new ballot) is the first year that we have had to do bugger all work. The last place was the worst we have had for work to be done. Raupo pulled out (not sprayed) for 80m each sideof the maimai, and the maimai completely remade. Was a lot of work, and I kinda missed that this year. Never bloody happy eh!

I will be writing a letter to Eastern F&G and voicing my opinion regarding their new proposal.

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Originally Posted by Bonecrusher

I think Eastern have just looked over the Kaimai's at Waikato F & G ballot system and followed that nothing new in what they propose, the issue with the Council make up in Eastern is that most of the Councillors aren't active duck shooters majority fish only so hence lead by the nose so to speak

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That is why I always vote, and I pick out the waterfowl/upland game enthusiasts - otherwise they may as well call it "Fish and Fish", as the trout licence fee generates most of their income, so gets the most of the attention.

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Originally Posted by Bonecrusher

"Bonecrusher" was a race horse my nickname is horse / hoss so why not be the best horse that ever ran around a race track.
Over the thirty years that I have shot includes the Manawatu, Canterbury, Eastern + at least two other area's I have only ever been checked the once ;-) I'm always legal buy my license and spend fair too many dollars on gear every season my girls reckon I'm the ultimate consumer
No quick sand in the area I shoot at Aniwhenua Gapped Axe just a 400 metre wade in with the waders on float the deeks in on a plastic sledge mate

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I know you shoot Aniwhenua , as I did for 15yrs above Rabbit bridge. I used to range Aniwhenua, but after getting stuck in quicksand on the true left below the bridge ,I vowed never again

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Originally Posted by Gapped axe

I know you shoot Aniwhenua , as I did for 15yrs above Rabbit bridge. I used to range Aniwhenua, but after getting stuck in quicksand on the true left below the bridge ,I vowed never again

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Big flood has cleaned it out now :-)

Bonecrusher won the Melbourne Cup, didn't he?

I have only ever had my licence checked twice by rangers ... both were very pleasant to talk to ...

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Originally Posted by Bonecrusher

No mate read the minutes for Easter F & G ...... DOC hardly attends meetings have minimal contact with F & G

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Good riddance to DoC. At one ERFG meeting I attended there was a DoC "observer" present. He referred to trout as Possums of the Waterways. The guys would'nt let me follow him outside after that meeting.

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Originally Posted by Woody

Good riddance to DoC. At one ERFG meeting I attended there was a DoC "observer" present. He referred to trout as Possums of the Waterways. The guys would'nt let me follow him outside after that meeting.

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did he have a bird and sandals and introduce himself in maori:D

theres something deeply troubling about easterns direction.
they were the 1st and only region to think a wild hen limit for pheasant was a good idea??
they poke thier noses into hb ,s finances including accounts,
they were among the 1st to try to legitimize payed put and take ducks.
thier were rumours of a merger ??
is eastern run that well that it is an example to the rest of the country??
i think not otherwise why the revenue gather from people who already pay a licence and a 40% markup and 15% tax on everything the buy for thier sport.
is it a flat rate theyre going to charge or is it divided amongst the multiple ,if there are multiple ballot holders.??

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Originally Posted by EeeBees

Bonecrusher won the Melbourne Cup, didn't he?

I have only ever had my licence checked twice by rangers ... both were very pleasant to talk to ...

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Most rangers who has been to our balloted stands have been very good. A couple were obviously more fish than game, and I had to correct them on whether the birds were hens or drakes. However, they have all been pleasant enough guys, and I'm damned if I would want to be checking licences on Opening Day!

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Originally Posted by Lentil

Most rangers who has been to our balloted stands have been very good. A couple were obviously more fish than game, and I had to correct them on whether the birds were hens or drakes. However, they have all been pleasant enough guys, and I'm damned if I would want to be checking licences on Opening Day!

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I have no problem with rangers even know a couple most are part time volunteers.
Haven't seen bugger all of them but...?
I've asked eastern about the charge amount how it will be split if theres multiple ballot holders on one stand .
Let's see what they say.

got the email reply which says basicly each person registered at the stand will pay either 30 or 40 bucks.
The tone is pay up or piss off ,lovely.
Soon as I figure out how or find somone else to do it I,l post it
be aware the replier to the email reckons lots of other regions are considering the charge??

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Kevin,

Regarding your query about reserve
contribution fees, I attach the paper that was presented to
Councilor's (Eastern Region F&G) for consideration at
the 2017 August meeting - which they accepted. This paper
explains most of the details, and clearly states that the
ballot holders will still be responsible for their own
maimai / stand maintenance. This contribution will be for [HERE,S A NOVEL CONCEPT TAKE IT OF THE 100 BUKS A YEAR YOU ALREADY GET OF GAMEBIRD HUNTERS???]
wetland habitat* - e.g. Spraying pest plants, track
upgrades etc. Please appreciate that we are struggling to
keep up with wetlands that are perched and massive influxes
of pest plants blocking water ways and invading ponds. We
also have to seriously take into consideration Health &
Safety requirements placed upon us.

At this stage, it is proposed that all
ballot holders be charged this fee - not stands. Therefore
each ballot hunter will be charged at time of ballot [ SO YOU ARE NOW UP FOR 130 T0 140 BUKS BEFORE YOU EVEN GET TO YOUR POZZIE??]
application or re-confirmation. Most stands have two hunters
so two fees will be charged in this example. Although not
finalised we estimate this annual contribution fee to be
around the $30 - $40 mark, at current spray, pay and vehicle
rates.

The fee will be payable to Eastern
Region Fish & Game, with a dedicated account for these
funds. These funds will be exclusively for balloted reserves
maintenance only.* As we are annually audited, very
close and accurate accountability will be made of these
funds. As I am the reserves field officer, initially I will
be accountable for where these funds are directed, but all [ OH GOODY CAN YOU ACCOUNT FOR THE LICENCE FEE SPEND AND WHERE THAT GONE /GOING]
decisions will be made in conjunction with our habitat team,
involving Matt McDougall who manages the ballots and
waterfowl bird expert, Eben Herbert who is our legal person,
Nigel Simpson who does most of the ground work, and Andy
Garrick the manager. Obviously not every reserve will see
the funds spent on it initially as some need more work than
others first.

As for your comment about this being
cheeky;* Firstly one may wish to consider what
those* licence holders get that don't use the reserves
in comparison to those who hold ballots; and secondly one
may wish to consider that our hunting season is actually
four months if you hunt other game birds (not just
mallards)(i.e. pheasants, quail, swans and Pukeko) .[ MMM MAI MAI HUNTING FOR PHEASANTS AND QUAIL WOW:D HOW MANY PEOPLE EVEN BOTHER WITH SWAN??]

This proposal was seriously discussed
and is a measured cost that we must endure to have effective
breeding, rearing and hunting habitat within our region. The
remnant wetlands we have in our region are only a fraction
of what was once there and we need to effectively manage
them for sustainability of waterfowl hunting into the
future. As stated this is also a problem that other Fish [,MMM FISH EELS AND BAIT GROW IN WETLANDS ???}
& Game regions are experiencing and similar methods of
fund contributions are being considered in these regions
also.

Ultimately, we hope most ballot holders
see this as a small cost of their recreation, similar to a
tank of gas which would normally be the cost of doing a
day's travel to their reserve stand to undertake these
works. And if current ballot holders aren't happy they can [SO PAY UP OR PISS OFF:yaeh am not durnk: EASTERN VOTERS YOU MUST BE SO PROUD??]
approach the elected Council to raise their concerns, or
alternatively not enter the ballot process and find other
places to hunt.

I hope the attached paper and above
comments detail sufficient information to answer your
questions, and if not feel free to give me a call.

Regards,

John Meikle
Fish & Game Officer
New Zealand Fish & Game – Eastern
Region
T********* 07 357 5501
M*********021 375 480
E*********jmeikle@fishandgame.org.nz

1130 Paradise Valley Road, Rotorua
Private Bag 3010, Rotorua 3046
www.fishandgame.org.nz

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here we go

I estimate that over half of any money collected will be spent on the administration needed for this and then the health and safety component needs to be factored in. What about promising to pull out some weeds every time you go it would probably be more productive.

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Originally Posted by gsp follower

they poke thier noses into hb ,s finances including accounts,

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and how did they do that?? because NO ONE STOPPED THEM ...

What a patronizing, pompous diatribe ... fair go ... how thick do these people think the rest of us are ... quote ... Nigel Simpson who does most of the ground work so where are the students ...????

I sent an email to Eastern Fish & Game outlining my concerns, and asking for my email to be tabled at the next meeting. So far, I have not had any response, so I can only assume they received my email. Just a basic acknowledgement would have been appropriate!

John Meikle one guy that doesn't impress me

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Originally Posted by Lentil

I sent an email to Eastern Fish & Game outlining my concerns, and asking for my email to be tabled at the next meeting. So far, I have not had any response, so I can only assume they received my email. Just a basic acknowledgement would have been appropriate!

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unless you go to the meeting and wait for the public questions bit.
if they allow you any then you might get some joy but dont count on it.
i know situations where they,ve declared meetings closed to the public so they can do thier sneaky secret sqirrel shit.
hawkes bay and eastern have been up to thier elbows in heaps of that .
re thier former manager and reducing councill size.

I purchased my licence for duck shooting from Paradise Valley Eastern F & G HQ one season probably the 1st year we moved to the Bay, Ranger asked me where I was shooting " I'm not telling you I replied" man did he get pompous upset made up for all the lack of service I got from them when I first moved to the Bay and had no idea where to source a possie :-)