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Originally Posted by hunter308
minding the c word because i find it offensive and uncalled for. i agree that those types stuff it for everyone and sadly it happens on both sides of the fence. it is a nice attitude you have unfortunately not all people share the same view. dont see to many commercial guys on coastwatch mind you heaps of recos with excess fish and under sized ones.
the good shit wont;)Quote:
Originally Posted by hunter308
i will stop winding up now i just wish poeple were a bit more open minded and stop blaming other people for shit that happens. for those recos the do care :thumbsup: keep it up
It would seem the problem still lays squarely with a quota system that is being exploited for commercial gain?
Nail on the headQuote:
Originally Posted by Maca49
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Yeah no worries mate will try to minimise my use of the c word it just every time I see someone keep an undersized fish or take more than what they are legally allowed to it enrages me quite a lot when I see it. Hell even the mussel population on the rocks has taken a hit with all of the raping that goes on there by joe public don't even get me started on that.Quote:
Originally Posted by mucko
Culture differences are screwing the world
Exactly , perhaps the commercial boats should be made to use baited hooks too.Leave the trawling and or pair trawling off for a year or two. There is a trawler goes past Whiritoa every day just over 1km out with its gear down. You can't tell me that's good for our in shore fishery ,more like rapping the stocks. Spring early summer they're in a lot closer than 1km in the small hours,are they perhaps targeting the spawning fish? Certainly looks like that being the case ,so think its time these people played the game & everyone will benefit .Quote:
Originally Posted by Maca49
Lets cut the commercial quota or keep the trawlers out past the 10 km & give the inshore fishery a chance to regenerate for the common good .
And here is the crux of this issue. I'm hating reading comments which waver away from the root fact that this fishery is in trouble and the only serious threat to it in the first place is a big export industry arm wrestle.Quote:
Originally Posted by veitnamcam
My position is fiercely rigid that any fish caught in NZ waters should stay in NZ. If the rest of the world want to deplete their resources for a few short term dollars, fine. Ten years ago, I used to be able to go out for a land based fish and usually catch one or two eaters by casting a rod. Nowadays, the only way I seem to catch legal size fish is on a longline by kayak, over 100m from shore.
Maybe a rec limit of 9 is too many for a single day, but I've never caught that many to start with, so haven't had to start putting them back!
The reduction of fish stocks available for the recreational enjoyment and dietary benefit of resident kiwis hoping to go out to a wharf, headland, or in a boat for a few hours of family time half a dozen times a year and catch a reasonable dinner for the family is of paramount importance to our kiwi lifestyle and if that means commercial fishing for export needs to take a reduction (or STOP!), then that is the right thing for Parliament to do. So sick of dollars for a few ruling over common sense and lifestyle for the masses!
If any of you care about your own fishing rights, or even care about the rights of other average kiwis, please visit the LegaSea website and sign a submission to Minister Nathan Guy. It takes two minutes and maybe you could buy some clothing or donate a few bucks to these good bastards while you're there.
All hunters shouldn't kid themselves that this commercial preference bullshit won't come to threaten our wild animals too some day. Stand up and be counted boys
I strongly believe that the commercial sector should take a hit not just be approached but TOLD that they are going to get a reduction whether they like it or not instead of targeting the easy meat (recos) too much back scratching and money talks these days and it needs to stop. And those bloody commercial boats should not be allowed within 10K's of any coastline getting within 1k is starting to get a bit too cheeky.Quote:
Originally Posted by 7mmwsm
Watch Seven Sharp on TV One right now boys. Might be some good facts on this topic
I thought the guy from Legasea came across pretty well, pity the same can't be said about the Clown, self opinion orientated reporter's alongside of him
Refer to Bully's thread re the definition of an expert:thumbsup:Quote:
Originally Posted by 7mmwsm
From memory X is the unkown quantity & Spert is a drip under pressure .Quote:
Originally Posted by Maca49
We have to many of them!
Missed it on TV but caught it on the 7 sharp site. Some very good points raised on the subject.
Have actually been pondering this tonight and here is my thought if we took a drop in our catch limits to 3 -4 or even 5 snapper per person per outing as they propose which would bring the recos in under that 30% allocation that was being talked about as we are supposedly exceeding the 30% that is allocated for recreational purposes the other 10% for the customary gathering and if say the commercial sector took a 20% reduction from thier 60% quota allocation then there would be 20% of total quota not allocated and reserved for the purposes of conserving fish stocks by making them unavailable for use I would be happy to see that sort of thing happening but only if the commercial guys came to the party agreed to a reduced quota and reviewed catching methods to reduce amounts of unnecessary fish wastage right down but also agree to have an exclusion zone imposed where they can not operate within a set distance from shore. A percentage that is never allowed to be used for any form of fishing but soley for the purpose of conserving fish population would be more of a win - win situation even making a few more areas marine reserves would also help to conserve the snapper population. I know it sounds hair brained but it is only an out loud thought.
There is a legasea meeting in hamilton tomorrow night a the central baptist church in charlemonte st at 7:30pm if anyone from the waikato is keen to go along.
Get some facts, attend a LegaSea meeting, watch this video ( SOS_Save_Our_Snapper_LegaSea - YouTube ), make a submission and share with others. Or do nothing and let the pen pushers take away/reduce another right.
Did you see on the news key is in nelson to discuss this?
Now why would there be a conference on commercial takes of snaps in the north island in nelson?
I am pretty sure I can guess exactly where the conference will be held too :rolleyes:
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Um in Nelson?Quote:
Originally Posted by veitnamcam
If that's your idea of exact then if we should ever go hunting together i am in charge of nav. K ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Gibo
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Circles are fine as long as you get there aint they?Quote:
Originally Posted by veitnamcam
Im not fit enough to waste energy on circles.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gibo
Back to topic...
As i posted earlier and earlier before that.
There is a reason its in nelson.
I don't like it anymore than any of you do but money is influence.
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All over Rover looks like common sense prevails?
No money will look after money as it always has until there is a revolution.Quote:
Originally Posted by Maca49
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It will be done as soon as they win the next election literally months afterQuote:
Originally Posted by Maca49
It pisses me how logic and what is right disappears in situs like this . It obvious where the problem lies, go to the Greek Islands and see how many fish there are, NONE raped pillaged and gone, that's the future here all for the wrong reasonsQuote:
Originally Posted by Neckshot
Ok then for the dummies, why Nelson?Quote:
Originally Posted by veitnamcam
Yep - got a submission on the counter at work. Plenty of people signing up.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hunt4life
Cos that's sealord and talleys/amaltal home base. Sanford and sminovich also a strong hold .
That's probably over 70 percent of all quota of all species right there. That's just a guess but if anyone would like to research it be my guest.
Fishing is a very small part of talleys empire. He holds considerable political clout.
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Thanks VC. I comprende nowQuote:
Originally Posted by veitnamcam
oh dear, better think this one through Nathan Guy ... 46,000 submissions sent through from recreational fisherman.Looks like people are not gonna take what your trying to push. Might be time for a re think on your three options, or lose some serious votes. Will be very interesting to see what happens next...
Well FWIW this thread is far better than I thought it would be. Some good points all round.
Having grown up in the kenepuru Iv seen the fishing come and go. Pair trawling had the biggest effect by a long way and I think that highlighted the greed that has always existed in the fishing industry . But the damage done by some recos shouldn't be underestimated. The sounds would be full of boats over the spawning season and many would be setting nets and set lines as well as fishing all day. Some of the catches clearly showing greed and waste wasn't just the realm of the commercial.
The snapper limit here is 3 and has been for a long time, the introduction supported by most locals. The local cod fishery is good example, while there is little doubt commercial fishing contributed the demise after it became uneconomic for them to fish it was the recreational fisher preventing the fishery from healing and while I don't totaly agree with the current slot limit it is working.
On the comercial vs reco front I think its worth giving a thought to the guy whos job will go if the quota is cut just so you can take home a few more fish?
I hope all the talk about changing votes is just sabre rattling though. Deciding who calls the shots on the direction of our country,education of our children and the health care of our parents etc based on being able to take home 9 fish instead of 3 seems pretty shallow .
you are right sneeze and I do care about the direction of our country, education and health care. I don't mind the snapper limit being reduced but what I do not like and object to is the fact that one of the options is cut our limit and increase the commercial quota and that I am not happy about it must work both ways if we have to take a cut in SNA1 then so should the commercial guys plus the idea of bottom trawling needs to be heavily reviewed as those things damage the seafloor rather badly and is a practise that has been banned in other countries. To increase size limit and it has been pointed out on another site would mean there would be a creation of fish wastage from high grading in the reco arena by having to put back injured/gut hooked fish that are undersized under the new size limit if that went ahead instead of a reduction in bag limits.
I'm a bit frustrated by the 'us vs them' mentality between the small time commercial fishers who own one boat, catching for local restaurant markets, and us recreational fishers.
The real problems here is firstly, the big three driven by shareholder greed for $$ (including many politicians btw). And secondly, the ability for commercial operators to sell off quota, particularly to non-kiwi fishing vessels (not employing Kiwis), followed by the export of New Zealand's resource at international commodity pricing.
Take the foreigners out of the equation and we don't have a problem here. If the small time commercial guys want to side with the large scale greedy ocean rapists, then game on! We should attack your entire industry and your jobs
geez you make it sound so trivial... I guess you would have to ask what was next? Fishing for commercial purposes only? You may not think that this is not worth fighting for but I sure as hell do.To me its someone trying to take away one of the awesome things about being a New Zealander. I do agree with you that some reco fisherman are blatant rapists of our seas, A fact that makes me rant for an hour after each episode of coast watch, I cant believe that people can be so short sighted. Its time that we get serious with these assholes and ensure they get more than community service and confiscation of gear. For me it has nothing at all to do with the number of snapper, I can't remember a time I decided to keep nine. I do think that if commercial T.A.C increases and reco's drops, that sets a real dangerous precedence.Quote:
Originally Posted by sneeze
so yes, I do care about my children being able to enjoy this fishery just as much as I care about schooling and health care.
Trivial wasn't what I was trying for, just giving another perspective having lived through a reduction in recreational quota some years ago. The arguments I see here are the same as those presented before in our area and all I can say is they don't seemed to have panned out. My kids can still go and catch snapper in the same place their great great great grandfather did any time they like . The high grading was a discussion point around the blue cod slot limit along with the other points rasied here but while it may be happening the over all result is a fishery that is improving very well. The snapper fishing seems to be showing steady improvement so while the system might not be perfect its a lot better than doing nothing.Quote:
Originally Posted by outinabout
From a political point its nice to see kiwis stand up and make a noise but even though I like fishing how many fish I can take home wouldn't rate in the top 10 for voting issues. I also see this as a bit of a ploy really, give out the worst case for people to get wound up about then back it off to where it was intended in the first place, people will be relieved and the govt can say "hey we listened to the people"
Sneeze, I'm really hoping MOST people aren't oblivious to the political tactics 'probably' in play here. If most of the 47,000 people who spoke up are smart, anything other than a reflective equal reduction of commercial quota and responsibility will be rejected and phase two of a public backlash will commence.