Thread: 303 bullets tumbling

Corrosive CAC is certainly corrosive, not to be triffled with. Those salts get into the steel where it inevitably has microscopic heat and pressure fractures and while pouring boiling water and then oiling helps it never gets it all. Over time the steel darkens and erodes faster than otherwise. I have a pristine barrel and I'll never put corrosive ammo through it. I have black barrels with plenty of rifling and still won't put corrosive ammo thru them. Tried it once but gave up when 2 out of 5 failed to fire. Waste of time IYAM. But each to their own.

When I get hold of old CAC ammo these days I pull the bullets and use them after tumbling clean. The cordite goes under the lemon tree and the brass to the recyclers.

My guess is your .311 dia military projectiles are rattling down a much larger dimensioned bore. They can go as big as .318. And no, the military was not that interested in accurate squad fire from the old battle rifle. The best were reserved for marksmen/snipers the worst for squaddies trained to achieve volume of fire. A bullet traveling sideways will still result in a casualty. While the British Army preferred them to tumble on impact they were not however designed to travel sideways.

Recommend as above that you slug the bore. If its shiny and the throat is reasonable it may be a very worthwhile cast bullet rifle. But I guess it depends what you are after as to keeping it.

Originally Posted by Jhon

Corrosive CAC is certainly corrosive, not to be triffled with. Those salts get into the steel where it inevitably has microscopic heat and pressure fractures and while pouring boiling water and then oiling helps it never gets it all. Over time the steel darkens and erodes faster than otherwise. I have a pristine barrel and I'll never put corrosive ammo through it. I have black barrels with plenty of rifling and still won't put corrosive ammo thru them. Tried it once but gave up when 2 out of 5 failed to fire. Waste of time IYAM. But each to their own.

When I get hold of old CAC ammo these days I pull the bullets and use them after tumbling clean. The cordite goes under the lemon tree and the brass to the recyclers.

My guess is your .311 dia military projectiles are rattling down a much larger dimensioned bore. They can go as big as .318. And no, the military was not that interested in accurate squad fire from the old battle rifle. The best were reserved for marksmen/snipers the worst for squaddies trained to achieve volume of fire. A bullet traveling sideways will still result in a casualty. While the British Army preferred them to tumble on impact they were not however designed to travel sideways.

Recommend as above that you slug the bore. If its shiny and the throat is reasonable it may be a very worthwhile cast bullet rifle. But I guess it depends what you are after as to keeping it.

Your bore is significantly oversized which is creating the tumbling.
Your only
Option would be to use oversized cast lead pills.

Originally Posted by grandpamac

Greetings,
That projectile is really sideways. Mk VII projectiles had a reputation for tumbling after impact but were not supposed to tumble through the air. Similar things were said about the early M16 projectiles but once again they were not supposed to tumble through the air. Reports of the latter are where someone has got things confused.
I believe that your rifle is a No1 Mk III. I have a Lithgow No1 Mk III* that was made in 1943. No1 rifles were not marked that way and neither was the No 3 (usually called a Pattern 14). People get the No and Mk numbers jumbled up quite often. Australia only made No 1 rifles and all No 3 rifles were made in the US.
Most military rifles have a two stage trigger with a heavy first stage and an even heavier second firing stage. You do get used to this and it is important not to snatch (or pull quickly) the trigger as this will result in wide shots. You won't notice the latter with the pills going sideways. The Greek pills seem rather hard to me and I wondered if they were under size but measurement showed they were not at least mine were not.
Regard Grandpamac.

Yes, from doing a bit of research, your right, this is a No1, MK3, I got mixed up with the numbers too, still not sure what the difference is between a no1, no2, or no3, I always thought that a no3 was the same thing as a mk3.

What is the idea with the 2 stage trigger? From how i find this gun, it has quite a bit of travel and then stops, and takes quite a bit more pressure to actually fire the gun.

Ive also had someone look at it from the store and says the barrel is stuffed, he showed me how to check and put a 303 round in through the muzzle end, it dropped right in, he said it should have stopped about 3/4 the way in, which means its worn out.

now I need to find another barrel. Where do i find a spare one? I believe there was lots of surplus lithgow parts that alot have been used into making new guns, but with serial numbers that dont match up.

Originally Posted by Jhon

Corrosive CAC is certainly corrosive, not to be triffled with. Those salts get into the steel where it inevitably has microscopic heat and pressure fractures and while pouring boiling water and then oiling helps it never gets it all. Over time the steel darkens and erodes faster than otherwise. I have a pristine barrel and I'll never put corrosive ammo through it. I have black barrels with plenty of rifling and still won't put corrosive ammo thru them. Tried it once but gave up when 2 out of 5 failed to fire. Waste of time IYAM. But each to their own.

When I get hold of old CAC ammo these days I pull the bullets and use them after tumbling clean. The cordite goes under the lemon tree and the brass to the recyclers.

My guess is your .311 dia military projectiles are rattling down a much larger dimensioned bore. They can go as big as .318. And no, the military was not that interested in accurate squad fire from the old battle rifle. The best were reserved for marksmen/snipers the worst for squaddies trained to achieve volume of fire. A bullet traveling sideways will still result in a casualty. While the British Army preferred them to tumble on impact they were not however designed to travel sideways.

Recommend as above that you slug the bore. If its shiny and the throat is reasonable it may be a very worthwhile cast bullet rifle. But I guess it depends what you are after as to keeping it.

OK, I will be careful with the stuff, I guess there is no harm in putting some rounds through this old barrel anyway.
Is all CAC corrosive?
They made the stuff right through the 70s in NZ, the stuff ive got is from the 1940s and 1950s. Im assuming their later ammo had non-corrosive primers? Im not sure when they stopped using cordite either.
Im not sure how to tell if its British CAC or NZ made CAC, as it doesnt have any markings to identify, only the year.

Your right about re-using the projectiles, they are supposed to be really good, some of this CAC stuff ive got is soft point and the rest is all FMJ.
Any reason you throw out the brass? I thought it was some of the best brass for reloading?

Looks like suitable projectiles are not easy to find and no longer made, everything is all boat tail which is harder on these barrels.

Shame no one can manufacture the stuff again to this quality, I wonder what happened to all the old CAC tooling? Someone someday may have an incentive to make better projectiles again?