I'm no expert but that seems quite reasonable? Can anyone call out any fish hooks?
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I'm no expert but that seems quite reasonable? Can anyone call out any fish hooks?
That's a 10/10 result for us I reckonQuote:
Originally Posted by Gibo
:thumbsup:Quote:
Originally Posted by Tommy
I agree good result all things considered and how it could have gone.
The committee got a real slapping. Looks like the government is realizing the number of votes walking away. Now to give the nz police an equal slapping over their antics.
:thumbsup:
Yes, excellent result.
https://www.policeassn.org.nz/newsro...-firearms-cont
The scaremongering continues...
I'd be interested to know what number are air rifles or toys. Also glaringly conspicuous by its absence in this press release is the word "semi-automatic".Quote:
Originally Posted by Police Association
Id be more interested to know how the lying bullshit artist cahill, thinks that placing restrictions on the law abiding will magically stop criminals form having firearms.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan
We know he just makes shit up, wouldnt surprise me if those numbers were too.
Well that part's easy. He doesn't have to because crime reduction is not the purpose of this whole palava - it's only being window dressed as such. It's simply about control. Meth is a far more serious problem in this country and causes infinitely more societal and structural damage than illegal firearms, the latter tending to be readily associated with the former.Quote:
Originally Posted by Danger Mouse
#priorities.
From the Police Association's media release: “The Minister’s concern about ‘over the top’ rules and restrictions on hunters and shooters ignores the reality that New Zealand is awash with firearms and the majority of them are stolen,” he said.
Mr Cahill should be freaking fired for what is an absurd blatant lie. Majority of firearms are stolen!? Wtf man.
And as for calling us out saying: “Minister Bennett appears to have bowed to the pressure of the gun lobby which we believe represents fewer than 10,000 of the 240,000 licensed gun owners.
Bullshit You wish it was that low but I bet you my socks it is much, much higher then you have fabricated you absolute fruitcake.
http://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/on-air/l...nz-being-shot/
I thought they didn't want a register? Only to 'record' the details upon licence renewal or security inspection. ...
[emoji23]Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Cahill
I think Chris Cahill may have a mental condition that causes him to compulsively lie. He should ensure he doesn't handle any firearms, as he shouldn't be deemed a 'Fit and proper person '.
Apparently, those of us who submitted objections to the Select Committee report are the NRA style gun lobby, and not 'good gun owners'.
I disagree. This is not a good result. Here is a reply I sent to the minister today setting out my immediate objections.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mauser308
"The minister keeps referring to "Arms (Firearm Prohibition Orders and Firearms Licences) Amendment Bill". This I know nothing about.
This report is a disaster for firearms owners, as it legitimises current illegal activities inflicted on us by police. Increases the potential for further persecution, while giving the public a sense of relief that, "well, that wasn't so bad after all".
The mail-order process doesn't need clarification. It is clearly set out in the legislation. The minister needed to instruct police to obey the law.
A stand-down period after licence revocation. Where the hell is that going? Given that most licence revocations are the result of acrimonious relationships or police punishment for a citizen insisting that police follow the law, will this be used to further intimidate the licence holder, should they show any semblance of developing a spine?
Recording of serial numbers- voluntary process to continue. There is no voluntary process. There is only the police assembling a dysfunctional registry to condition the public to accepting registration. Where is the secure storage for this illegal process and why are public funds supporting it.
Determine appropriate security standards for A licences. That is just weasel words for increasing the cost to licence holders though increased security costs. Something the police are doing already through illegal policy and bullying. The legislation is quite clear as to the security requirements to deter children and opportunist thieves.
Licence suspension Just another tool for the thugs and bullies to use against the dissenters to their vision of a police state. No proof required, just the word of the blue thug.
Require the police to consult with the firearms community! How do you do that, when there is no body that represents licence holders. FCAF? how well does that work out? There is a power imbalance. the police hold all the cards. Dissent is ignored and only agreement is allowed.
Nowhere in this report is there a rollback of the intrusive and obscene conditions imposed upon licence holders by the 1983 act and it's amendments. The imposition of the need to prove ones innocence goes against the basis of our Westminster justice concept of innocent until proven guilty. The arms act in itself is a direct affront to our justice system and society.
Nothing the minister is proposing will address criminal offending with firearms, or criminals acquiring firearms. The only thing that will achieve that, is for police to get back to catching burglars, instead of persecuting the victims of burglary. A return to the principles of policing as devised by Robert Peel might be in order as the police clearly lack direction."
Too many new laws are being passed that make the citizen prove innocence. Especially H&S prosecutions. And has any one challenged the 4 km/hr holiday tolerance? Arn't speedo's only required to be accurate to 10%?Quote:
Originally Posted by JWB
Speedos are allowed to over-read by up to 10% but not under-read IIRC. Not sure what the accuracy spec of the police radar/laser units is though.Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve123
To be honest the 4km/hr tolerance has failed to achieve anything for the road toll because its just another case of stricter enforcement on easy targets who aren't the problem, to make bureaucrats look like they're doing something without having to deal with the more difficult real issue (which is mostly down to poor driver training in that case).
Have you noticed that when the road toll is down the spin is "the policy is working" and when the road toll is up the spin is "people aren't obeying our policy well enough". Head I win, tails you lose!
I agree. There's some shocking driving in Auckland but so long as your not speeding you can get away with it.Quote:
Originally Posted by GravelBen
Sent from my SM-G388F using Tapatalk
Was pissed off the other day- received a camera van fine for doing an outrageous 56km/hr!!
You'll NEVER convince me this is anything but revenue gathering.
And bloody Subaru decided in the mistaken belief of assisting road safety worldwide, purposely calibrate their speedos to read over grrrr.Quote:
Originally Posted by GravelBen
You are quite correct. If it was a safety thing they would be parked where traffic is held up by slow drivers. Instead they are waiting in the few straight stretches where there is finally a place to pass, and the slow driver speeds up.Quote:
Originally Posted by 6x47
Yep, one said something like 'an air rifle and a snub nosed pistol was stolen from a car'. That sings of airsoft all day long..Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan
"stubb nosed pistol" actually, whatever that is.Quote:
Originally Posted by MaW
Its the same as targeting crims instead of license holders. Too much hard work.Quote:
Originally Posted by gadgetman
Probably was a cap gun from the $2 shop.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan
https://youtu.be/6BRyNHkzMHwQuote:
Originally Posted by Ryan
[QUOTE=6x47;604977]Was pissed off the other day
I got one of those recently too. 58 in non residential 50 zone
[QUOTE=Pengy;605028]@Pengy The officer was low on their quota for the month.Quote:
Originally Posted by 6x47
Oh but they said they don't have quotas remember...Quote:
Originally Posted by Sasquatch
...its "performance targets" now.
.......or contacts with public......Quote:
Originally Posted by GravelBen
I think he just got fired from the firearms group today?Quote:
Originally Posted by Sasquatch
Not Cahill, Scahill. Cahill as president of Police Association (Police Union) is not a Police Officer anymore.
Firearms guy was Chris Scahill.
The NZ Police Association, under the control of ardent anti gunner and bender of the truth, Chris Cahill, has launched their counter attack to the Governments response to the Select Committee. In their recently published Police Association Election Policy Document, he makes it very clear that he still wants registration and a crack down on firearm owners. You will note that almost all of his policy targets licenced owners, and not the actual criminals.
1.2 Firearms
The Police Association believes the government policy on firearms should:
» Move quickly to introduce the required law changes in order to implement the recommendations of the Law and Order Select Committee Inquiry into issues relating to the illegal possession of firearms.
» Introduce a firearms sale registration programme that requires the seller to notify Police of the certifiable details of the purchaser of all firearms.
» Introduce a firearms register which requires all firearms licence holders to list all firearms in their possession and advise Police of any purchases of new firearms.
» Stop any form of online sales of firearms and ammunition.
» Ensure legislation requires public safety to be the chief consideration of courts when adjudicating on firearm licensing issues.
1.2 Firearms
Possibly the most concerning issue facing policing in New Zealand in 2017 is the increasing availability of firearms to criminals, especially gang members. The Association receives almost daily reports from its members of officers being confronted
by offenders with firearms. There are also regular reports of gang affiliates located in possession of firearms, ranging from handguns to military style semi-automatic (MSSA) rifles. It is now commonplace to locate firearms when executing search warrants for methamphetamine.
This increasing availability of firearms to gang members, combined with the rising threat of inter-gang violence in an ongoing turf war for drug markets, poses a grave risk to public safety. Inter-gang conflict can result in innocent members of the public being caught in the crossfire. The tragic death of Jhia Te Tua in Whanganui in 2007 should not be forgotten. Stricter controls on the sale, supply and registration of firearms are required if New Zealand is to halt the flow of illegal firearms into the hands of criminals.
Customs figures show 40,000 firearms were imported into New Zealand in 2016 alone. While this includes soft airguns, it demonstrates that the legitimate supply of firearms is increasing at an alarming rate. Given there are only 242,000 licensed firearms holders in the country, and the vast majority of them will not have bought new firearms during this period, the Association is concerned about where many of these firearms end up.
In the reference for his statement of 40,000 firearms, he lists this:
NZ Herald OIA request NZ Customs (13/02/17) revealed 31 muzzle-loading firearms, 5461 shotguns, 15,836 rifles and 18,480 air-guns imported in 2016, and 94 firearms seized by Customs during that year.
So only 21,328 actual firearms were imported. Are dealers not allowed to import stock for sale?
Of 178 countries surveyed in the Geneva-based Small Arms Survey, New Zealand is 22nd in the world in gun ownership. We have an average of 22.6 firearms per 100 people, and close to one million civilian-owned firearms. However, the reality is that there is no accurate record of the stockpile of firearms in New Zealand at any given time. Nor is there an accurate record of the number of gun thefts and burglaries which are the easiest ways for criminals to access firearms.
That sounds like an NZ Police issue, not a legislative issue.
[I]While the licensing procedures for owning pistols and MSSAs in New Zealand is more rigorous than that for other categories of firearms, the variety of firearms New Zealanders can access is out of touch with similar jurisdictions such as Australia and the United Kingdom. The British public lost the right to own pistols following the 1996 Dunblane School massacre, and Australians forfeited their right to MSSAs after the Port Arthur massacre in the same year.
The Association wants New Zealanders to be cognisant of the risks associated with the existence of weapons such as non-sports use handguns and MSSAs in our communities. We have not been immune to lone wolf shootings, and we have watched in horror as terrorist threats are realised in many parts of the world. We believe the trade-off for New Zealanders having access to these powerful weapons should be better registration, and tracking of ownership and sales of firearms.
The Association believes the Law and Order Select Committee Inquiry into issues relating to the illegal possession of firearms has missed a serious opportunity to tighten up on the tens of thousands of firearms pouring into the country every year. We would have liked the committee to ask why New Zealanders need MSSAs and non-sports use handguns, and recommend much tighter controls over these weapons.
There are, however, a number of positives from the Inquiry which may mean at least the whereabouts of many firearms will soon be tracked. Amongst these is a recommended extension of the permit to procure a firearm to, in future, cover the sale or transfer of all firearms.
Maybe he can't read very well...
Attachment 71049
Over time this will allow Police to build a database of firearms possessed by individuals.
Is this supported by law Chris Cahill?
The Association also applauds the tough stance recommended with respect to gangs, and the call for the Government to categorise gang members and prospects as not “fit and proper persons” to possess firearms.
Make no mistake, this fight is not over. Particularly while Chris Cahill remains at the helm of the NZ Police Association, and continues to spread his campaign of misinformation and fear mongering.
You bet.
They do not want the public to have firearms. Lies, deception, scare mongering, ultra vires behaviour, double standards - whatever it takes - they will stop at nothing until the population possesses firearms that only they deem appropriate. Interesting that he refers to the "rights" of firearm owners in the UK and Australia.
Rights aren't rights if someone can just take them away.
The truth link actually don't work when in the page…Quote:
Originally Posted by Sasquatch
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wAXxQBIfH7I
Obviously not directly applicable to NZ but there a few "takeaways" from it.
Nice, a very well balanced informative video that didn't have to rely on "anecdotal" evidence and scaremongering to portray it's message. If only the opposition could achieve this.
"As the Minister of Police, you're responsible for the Arms Act 1983 and we're responsible for administering and enforcing it," Bush said.
"The act is overdue for amendment.
"The courts have identified gaps and the need for clarification of drafting."
Bush said the previous government "signalled its intention to deal with these issues" through two pieces of legislation - the Arms Amendment Bill and an Arms (Firearms Prohibition Orders and Firearms Licences) Amendment Bill.
"Criminal activity, combined with changing technology and marketing, have highlighted additional gaps in the legislation which, when exploited, have safety implications," Bush said.
"These gaps also present administrative challenges and we have to rely on the overall purpose of the act to inform our decisions in the absence of explicit legislation.
The previous Minister of Police agreed to introduce firearms prohibition orders (FPOs) for a small group of the most serous and violent offenders.
Should you wish to continue with FPOs, this could be progressed through a standalone amendment to the Arms Act 1983 or as part of a more comprehensive Arms Amendment Bill."
Briefings: Police urge new minister to make 'key' decisions on firearms - NZ Herald
Your 'open and fair' police. No secrets here....
Attachment 79588
Here we go again. It just doesn't stop.
