Thread: F-Class

Originally Posted by steven

I wish they had kept the 155gr, they can still do by regualting that but usually the ones with the most money make the loudest noises, and have I think ruined every sport Ive had a go at for 40 odd years.

I was using Bergers to cull goats but we are getting through a huge number of them. I have just gone back to Hornady. I'd hate to be shooting Bergers at targets at $1.00+ per pill that would make me cringe.

@steven, if NZ decides to go 155, it will be a move backwards. 185s give you a good 10% margin in heavy wind, and at international level it would be crazy to use something that is not optimal. To be effective, an entire team has to shoot the same weight projectile, otherwise you expect the wind coaches to perform miracles..

The only way it will be feasible is if ICFRA does it worldwide, and I can't see that happening. But it is a numbers thing, the Yanks shoot in high-value winds and want the heavier projectiles, and they have the numbers to support change. The total number of FO and FTR shooters turning up for NZ Nationals is probably a small weekend club in the states... Will be interesting to see how it pans out at the next worlds in Canada. The UK team has already chosen 155gr according to their website...

@zimmer, yep and hence why I am seriously considering going in a different direction. On top of that there is a drive for NRA NZ to host the Palma in 2019, just how that is paid for is a "mystery". Since the NRA is supported by clubs which in turn means membership fees, I am rather worried that some big bills might finish "us" off.

Originally Posted by Bugger That

I was using Bergers to cull goats but we are getting through a huge number of them. I have just gone back to Hornady. I'd hate to be shooting Bergers at targets at $1.00+ per pill that would make me cringe.

Hence why with 223 service rifle 13.5cents is so appealing.

--edit--
if we get some serious Ar15 / 223 long range FTR type shooting in Wellington its bye bye 308w for me I think...

Would be really keen to get into f open shooting, sadly I haven't got the 5000$ to set up a rig, and all the reloading gear and then travel to shoots during the summer months. In terms of shooting my interests lie mainly aside from hunting are in advanced reloading ,wind reading and shooting/positional techniques like the field shoots I've been to. I'd be keen to do the odd 3 and 6 at trentham for a bit of wind reading practise but in some ways I'd rather spend my hard earned dollars and get out hunting. Never really been fussed shooting target rifle class, tried small bore and shooting with a sling and jacket wasn't me, I'm not keen on the 308 either really in my opinion it's just pissing into the wind if it wasn't a nato round it wouldn't be near as popular.

From the sidelines as a few others might of said yes there may be a demise of target shooting in nz however I see little advertising or promotion to get into the sport probably to do with the country's interior politics in the nra along with a local joker here who is mad set on getting rid of trentham as a shooting facility. Obviously I'm not just going to show up to a club shoot and walk up to some random and ask if I can have a go sort of thing if clubs want shooters then maybe it's time they get off their arse and show what the great sport it is . for example the national champs at trentham this year I didn't see that many spectators and I was thinking to myself how many of these crack shot shooters have actually tipped over a deer.

But hey just my opinion as everyone does, you gotta accept people move on and maybe the sport is not meant to be. Most young guys or people getting into hunting would be more likely to get into long range or God forbid 3 gun, pistol and the like rather than shooting paper

As an outsider looking in it's seems to be that accessibility is the problem.

When I first bought my 308 I was initially keen to shoot targets out to longer distances. However everything I hear puts me off with all the rules and requirements and the endless politics that I hear being complained about whenever someone talks about it. I wouldn't even know how to start out to be honest.

Compared to shotgunning where you can just turn up at a club night and have a go and get someone helping and coaching you.

Last time I was at the range I was giving the gun a good clean before leaving and two guys were just shaking their heads and talking about the politics and how they were sick of it. Then one of them mentioned may as well just give it away and do Tuesday nights and Sundays with the shotgun. "No bullshit, everyone has a laugh, nobody gives a fuck about what gun you're shooting, etc."

Bruce Rifle Club in Dunedin is extremely accessible and good these days. They just don't shoot much long range.

Originally Posted by scoped

Would be really keen to get into f open shooting, sadly I haven't got the 5000$ to set up a rig, and all the reloading gear and then travel to shoots during the summer months. In terms of shooting my interests lie mainly aside from hunting are in advanced reloading ,wind reading and shooting/positional techniques like the field shoots I've been to. I'd be keen to do the odd 3 and 6 at trentham for a bit of wind reading practise but in some ways I'd rather spend my hard earned dollars and get out hunting. Never really been fussed shooting target rifle class, tried small bore and shooting with a sling and jacket wasn't me, I'm not keen on the 308 either really in my opinion it's just pissing into the wind if it wasn't a nato round it wouldn't be near as popular.

From the sidelines as a few others might of said yes there may be a demise of target shooting in nz however I see little advertising or promotion to get into the sport probably to do with the country's interior politics in the nra along with a local joker here who is mad set on getting rid of trentham as a shooting facility. Obviously I'm not just going to show up to a club shoot and walk up to some random and ask if I can have a go sort of thing if clubs want shooters then maybe it's time they get off their arse and show what the great sport it is . for example the national champs at trentham this year I didn't see that many spectators and I was thinking to myself how many of these crack shot shooters have actually tipped over a deer.

But hey just my opinion as everyone does, you gotta accept people move on and maybe the sport is not meant to be. Most young guys or people getting into hunting would be more likely to get into long range or God forbid 3 gun, pistol and the like rather than shooting paper

Two good examples of the difficulties facing the NRA. I guarantee you that if you rock up to Trentham with your hunting gun and 24 rounds of ammo (actually you may need more to get onto the target if longrange) the guys will welcome you onto the range, help you with getting onto the target and you will leave with a marked score. Because that’s exactly how I got involved I took my 308 along with its Tasco scope and approached the first person I saw they directed me to the Petone president he was helpful and arranged some one to help me and the range officer gave me a bit of a briefing. No prior contact with any of them at all. I shot 800y I didn’t care about my score I was amazed I hit the very big black bit in the middle. The only requirement for a better rig is that hunting guns despite all the shit you read here are not competitive. We can all fluke a .3moa 3 shot group occasionally. That said a heavy barrel varmint gun may do alright but the guys currently shooting would put anyone right on the thought.

If you want to gain experience with your hunting gun you can shoot it every weekend at Trentham and no one will care about your score but you. By all means join a club and have ago. You will learn heaps and meet some good people.


As for the deer remark I guess shooting animals is a relevant to them as shooting targets to most of the guys here. Each to there own.

Originally Posted by Bugger That

As for the deer remark I guess shooting animals is a relevant to them as shooting targets to most of the guys here. Each to there own.

Agreeing on this, the firearm culture in Nz is too hunting-centric, even down to the licensing process - questions about "what would you do if you were hunting on private land?" etc. There are other legitimate uses of firearms than hunting.

@scoped, nothing stopping you from bringing your hunting rifle and having a go. You can also use one of the club rifles and see if that makes a difference. You might learn a thing or three...

very different skillsets between f-class and gong shooting/hunting. The one is about absolute consistency and shooting 10/15/20 shot groups to high degree of accuracy, trying to make wind the only variable. The other is massively variable in terms of position, terrain, angle etc. some of the skills are transferable, but I think that without trying both, most guys completely underestimate the huge differences.

some f-class guys hunt, some don't. Some are into benchrest, some aren't. Like most sports these days, once you get to the sharp end, it is a very specific and specialised thing.

Sounds like Scoped enjoys problems rather than soloutions, like the others have said, the NRA clubs are very welcoming to newcomers regardless of their gear.

As for the deer comment, I wonder how many of the crack hunters have hunted something that isn't dumb and shoots back. They're both different and can't be compared, having tipped over a deer doesn't make you a better shot/man.

Originally Posted by scoped

Obviously I'm not just going to show up to a club shoot and walk up to some random and ask if I can have a go sort of thing.

Why the hell not? There isn't a golden ticket or lucrative membership hazing.

I had the Secretary's rear bag and shooting mat and the President laying next to me reading the wind at Cheltenham during my first shoot. I brought along my $600 Marlin and factory Corelokt rounds, shooting off a Chinese bi-pod and not one shit was given. Even surprised myself with a couple of V's. Spent the rest of the afternoon chatting to F, F/tr and FO shooters, all willing to share knowledge.

Late in 2013 my (then) 14 year old said he wanted to try target shooting.
We went to a local range where I knew someone. A lot of help was offered to my son to get him started and hooked.

Once I was sure he'd continue advice was ask for and given about the next step and what might a good learner rifle - a heavy barrelled Savage Varmit rifle in 223.

Don't be afraid to approach your nearest club at your nearest range as almost all will offer you great help to get you hitting the target. After that it's up to you.

We went to the Nationals in January 2014 and received even more helpful advice from people we didn't know. Great people, very helpful.


We still get helpful advice - now it's about how to build up a FTR rifle in 308 around a Barnard action.

@zimmer @Bugger That

Can you guys fill in some blanks for me regarding F-class history in NZ.

I read an article in GB Target Shooter magazine recently that gave the following info:

2001 : 1st F-class Worlds, Canada
2004 : US F-class Nationals, Camp Butner, 1st major comp where FTR recognized
2005 : 2nd F-Class Worlds, South Africa
2009 : 3rd F-Class Worlds, Bisley, 1st FTR worlds (4-man teams)
2013 : 4th F-Class Worlds, Raton, FTR moved to full 8-man teams

Where does NZ fit into this ? When did guys start shooting F in NZ, when was the first nationals that included F-class ?

@scoped I went to take my 14year old to shoot full bore to see if he liked it, not much but I enjoyed it heaps. Still dont know what took my so long to get back into shooting, apathy? too busy? dunno but I regret that now.