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Sounds like Scoped enjoys problems rather than soloutions, like the others have said, the NRA clubs are very welcoming to newcomers regardless of their gear.
As for the deer comment, I wonder how many of the crack hunters have hunted something that isn't dumb and shoots back. They're both different and can't be compared, having tipped over a deer doesn't make you a better shot/man.
Why the hell not? There isn't a golden ticket or lucrative membership hazing.Quote:
Originally Posted by scoped
I had the Secretary's rear bag and shooting mat and the President laying next to me reading the wind at Cheltenham during my first shoot. I brought along my $600 Marlin and factory Corelokt rounds, shooting off a Chinese bi-pod and not one shit was given. Even surprised myself with a couple of V's. Spent the rest of the afternoon chatting to F, F/tr and FO shooters, all willing to share knowledge.
Late in 2013 my (then) 14 year old said he wanted to try target shooting.
We went to a local range where I knew someone. A lot of help was offered to my son to get him started and hooked.
Once I was sure he'd continue advice was ask for and given about the next step and what might a good learner rifle - a heavy barrelled Savage Varmit rifle in 223.
Don't be afraid to approach your nearest club at your nearest range as almost all will offer you great help to get you hitting the target. After that it's up to you.
We went to the Nationals in January 2014 and received even more helpful advice from people we didn't know. Great people, very helpful.
We still get helpful advice - now it's about how to build up a FTR rifle in 308 around a Barnard action.
@zimmer @Bugger That
Can you guys fill in some blanks for me regarding F-class history in NZ.
I read an article in GB Target Shooter magazine recently that gave the following info:
2001 : 1st F-class Worlds, Canada
2004 : US F-class Nationals, Camp Butner, 1st major comp where FTR recognized
2005 : 2nd F-Class Worlds, South Africa
2009 : 3rd F-Class Worlds, Bisley, 1st FTR worlds (4-man teams)
2013 : 4th F-Class Worlds, Raton, FTR moved to full 8-man teams
Where does NZ fit into this ? When did guys start shooting F in NZ, when was the first nationals that included F-class ?
@scoped I went to take my 14year old to shoot full bore to see if he liked it, not much but I enjoyed it heaps. Still dont know what took my so long to get back into shooting, apathy? too busy? dunno but I regret that now.
Where can i shoot this in Christchurch? Can i turn up to a club day/practice shoot with my stock standard 300wsm with a capable scope to get to 1000m, harris bipod and rear bag and shoot to see if i like it?
Perazzi, pretty much yes. Most of the clubs take a break over winter, and the serious season starts around Sept.
Welcome to the NRA NZ | National Rifle Association of New Zealand has all the club contact details, @Cyclops and his son shoot in CHC, have a chat to him
FTR is 308 or 223 only, so 300wsm will put you in F-Open.
We generally shoot yards not meters, from 300yds to 1000yds.
The only issue I can think of is if you have a loundner/brake on the rifle. It causes problems for other folk on the line, so not allowed, but check with the local club to be sure. Suppressors are fine.
Na don't have a break or suppressor. Ok will look into it thanks
Its probable that the club wont let you shoot 1000yds straight off due to cone of fire/regs. So you turn up for a 300yds (or maybe 500yds) to prove you can shoot and then extend the range in 100yds increments.Quote:
Originally Posted by PerazziSC3
@ebf, i started f class in 2008 i think and it had been going a few years already then. i would guess 2004 or even earlier.
Perazzi the fullbore outdoor season is pretty much over. It will resume again from August.Quote:
Originally Posted by steven
There are three clubs that shoot in the greater Christchurch area, Malvern Rifle Club, Christchurch Rifle Club and Ashburton District Rifle Club.
They accept new shooters with firearms licences. All have club rifles that can be used.
A club member supervised my son while he shot until I got my licence.
Ashburton and Malvern have active FB pages.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hades
didn't mean it like that, more of a personal thing I guess especially when these are people you don't know and are all dealing with firearms! l.. I don't doubt that clubs are helpful for new shooters and stuff, its just stink that there is little publicity or more of an effort to get people into the sport. if they ran a hunter class????
at the mo I have occasional access to a farm which we can scrape 950 metres on a bit of steel, but if worst comes to worst then I would probably try trentham!
Cheltenham runs a hunters class on occasion and also invites the local DeerStalkers to stretch their legs from time to time.
Remember that the majority of the club members (from my experience) are over 50 and have not heard of or use Facetube or Youbook. Modern forms of publicity will catch up when modern people make it accessible. The old school way of finding info is to talk to someone. That would work spectacularly in this situation.
gutted bro!! one morning we went to check if there were any boats in the red zone, there was one further out which was a bit nervy but ok. thought we should head closer to the cliff and check nobody was in close to shore....... there was a boat right in the red zone, dead straight in line with the targets. a chap had to head home to call up the boaties with on his radio.Quote:
Originally Posted by lost
Quite a bit earlier in fact. The person largely responsible for getting things going was Andre Doyle who was an Army ? sniper instructor at the time. I remember him shooting a suppressed .260 at Trentham. Tracy Short had a good go at one point- threw a few resources at the problem but sure got the resultsQuote:
Originally Posted by stuart165
Andre is still around, dropped off some stuff with him this morning :D He is also the driving force behind electronic targets...
He is now shooting TR with an outrigger sight system. Part of the Palma team off to the States next month.
Andre Doyle is currently the President of Petone Rifle club at Trentham (my club), I think he has 'retired" from the NRA side of things and yes we run 5 electronic targets.
Attachment 37197
The late Tony Loughnan (google to see his engineering achievements) was probably one of the main proponents of electronic targets within the NRA. Somewhere I saw a report of his including his opinion that for the ongoing future of the organisation it was essential that electronic targets became widely introduced. From memory he also put forward things like the analysis of the accuracy of electronics systems versus manual marking. The electronic system, in his opinion was the most accurate - something I would agree with considering the some of the dodgy marking I have experienced in the past. :omg:
Electronic targets are the way to go, I lost quite a few points shooting full bore with a .223 even the .308's can be hard to find had them slip down the spotter's dowel pin with out leaving a trace, electronic's stop all that.
mite have to give this a crackQuote:
Originally Posted by Cyclops
although have spent too much on guns lately so maybe i shouldnt:D
Cheltenham is having 2x rounds at 600 yards on Saturday. 100 yard sighting available from 12. $5 for sighting and $8 for the 600y shoot.
Spent too much on guns? Is that an oxymoron? It's like the wife saying she's got enough shoes.Quote:
Originally Posted by longrange308
See you on a range in the new season.
I started shooting F-TR in Decmeber with a Rem 700 varmint after not shooting at all for about 8 years, once I started reloading and sorted a good load for it I was reasonably competitive, 4th of 14 at Cheltenham at my last shootQuote:
Originally Posted by Bugger That
http://i.imgur.com/VUxqwML.png
Hey @Kurt, nice to see you on here. You had a good run at Chelty, solid improvement over Wairarapa.
Epic brain failure on my part that day, cruising along nicely at 300 & 500, then shot on the wrong target twice during my 600 string, doh !
Hope to see you down at Seddon next season, so you can come experience some of the famous "pain" :D
Cheers, I actually did a bit better than that on the 2nd day :D
Wairarapa was before I started reloading.
Just lobbed on to this thread. Interesting to see that 'ageism' has reared it's head again. I can understand resistance to change, but the only 'constant' in life or any activity is - CHANGE. Having been a 'very amateur hunter' in my youth (66 and counting at present), age has caught up with joints and strength, so target shooting has become 'an aim'. Went to Cheltenham (from Carterton), on Saturday 2 x 500 yard shoots. Should have phoned first, as weather was really CRAP - only just made it back through the Manawatu Gorge before it was closed. Was going to 'pick brains, ask questions, be a nuisance', but rain was so heavy, left without going in. Pity - would have been very instructive. This thread has been helpful, and I concur that every shooting organisation and it's members, have been EXTREMELY welcoming - in Aistralia (28 years) and NZ. Mostly claybird shooting - but the help was always given freely, and helped improve technique and results. F Open is my choice (Ballinger Belt is too stressful - not a 'true competitor' LOL), have received a lot of help from Frank at Masterton. Pity that the Brancepeth range is weather dependent - never mind, shit happens. Looking forward to completing the licensing process and getting started.
@WallyR, some very, very good shooters over at Brancepeth, you could do a lot worse :thumbsup:
Nice range as well, we shoot superlongs there once a year. Hopefully see you amongst the competitors next season.
@ebf - I shoot for the fun of shooting LOL. Any idea of what I should be looking at - calibre, action, barrel length, stock/chassis, glass. Being retired, is a 'bummer', as anything I might want (260 Rem seems to be popular), has to pass the 'keeper of the purse strings' - oh, and the kind gentlemen of the NZ Police at Masterton (still in the process of getting my License). I've seen a couple of interesting opportunities on TradeMe, that would get me well on the way to LR shooting, but price is a little 'steep' for the missus to swallow - got to set up the reloading system as well (more.....discussion LOL). Probably the wrong thread to ask these questions on, but a guy's got to start somewhere eh.
I'm looking at similar to you and probably looking at the same stuff on trademe haha. 260 is leading the pack for my first choice and first barrel.Quote:
Originally Posted by WallyR
That 260 Barnard on trademe would be nice but barrel may be a bit past its best which makes the package not very well priced if a rebarrel is required shortly....
The interesting thing is, both Matt and Micheal have expensive top end FTR rifles. Ewan probably had the Petone club FTR also top end and @ebf correct me if Im wrong, is rocking along with an Omark gun he bought for $400 and worked on himself (plus a new barrel?), So $400 v $5000+ and showing similar scores.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kurt
:thumbsup:
I am so looking forward to September.
"I shoot for the fun of shooting LOL." I do the same, 303 <=600yds, >FTR. I'd suggest staying with 308w and FTR rather than F-open. Finally got a Pattern 14 PH5b rear target sight!
Attachment 37760Attachment 37761
Bit more to it than that @steven...
The only thing that is still the same on the Omark is the action. In real money terms it has had a Nielsen adapter added, 2nd hand TF match barrel put on, been throated specifically for 185 Bergers. 2nd hand target stock with improved butt pad, and scope is close to $1k. Been lucky to have had pieces donated by club mates and work done etc. I've also just bought a new Lilja barrel for next season, and spent a fair amount on setting up a matching small bore FTR rifle to be able to practise at shorter ranges.
Big thing is that I see FTR shooting as a long term learning curve. Consistency wins when it comes to multi day matches, and it takes a couple of seasons to get up to speed with wind calling, and a lot of travel to learn the different ranges around the country. It is relatively easy to shoot well for a single string, especially when there is no real competition pressure. It is a different thing to do it at multiple ranges, over multiple days, in varying conditions, and with serious competition. I am starting to reap the rewards now, but it has been an 18 month steep learning curve, with lots of time put into it. And I still have a lot to learn... :D
@PerraziSC3 - yep mate, although 'Septic' blogs credit 260 with >4000 round life. The AICS stock could be worth a little 'pain' barrel wise, while on a learning curve. Plus glass to suit - getting out of reach - even if it stretches another 1K rounds in the barrel. Looking at starting on something that has a reasonable resale value, if this becomes my 'OCD' choice LOL, then re-investing in more match specific gear, as I improve. When I started DTL in NSW 'back in the day', was using a cheap Boito U/O off the 10 yard mark. Great help at Narrabeen Gun Club, really helpful, and happy to loan you better guns to get the hang of things. - NSW Gun Club, more intense and less help, and guns starting $20K>. Went back to Narrabeen. Whangarei Pistol Club were good guys too - back then - even had a trialist (selected in NZ's shooting team as reserve), but he was very intense. Other guys were great! Auckland Gun Club were friendly - once they realised that you were 'only' a high D grade/low C grade shooter and nothing to worry about LOL. Expect some rifle clubs will be similar - that's life, just get on with it LOL. Anybody out there that might have suitable USEFUL gear, with a bit of 'life' left in it (to learn the 'ropes'), PM me with details PLEASE. Ta.
@WallyR, startup cost is just one side of it.
FTR is cheaper than FO, it is possible to get some decent 2nd hand 308 target rifles and put a fairly basic scope on it to start. Learn to read wind, and learn to reload EXTREMELY consistent ammunition, and you could have fun in FTR for several years.
FO you are looking at some pretty specific and pricey rests/bags, plus the barrel life is shorter than 308. The reality is that FO guys try to maximize the benefits of shooting a wind-beating calibre, so a lot of them (not all) run things pretty hot. There are ways around this, several guys are moving to more moderate chamberings like 6.5x47, 260 etc.
For FO advice, PM DAF or Grasshopper on here. If you want to talk FTR, I am happy to answer questions as best as I can.
The big costs are:
1) ammo - a full season is around 1500-2000 rounds for me... when you start using Berger projectiles etc it hurts even more :D
2) comp entry fees and travel, nationals cost around $ 500 entry fees and 4-500 rounds on top of that, and I shoot most of the North Island regionals...
3) barrel - from a conservative point of view you should look at a new barrel ($1K) every 3000/4000 rounds for 308, and that can go down to less than a 1000 rounds for some FO rifles...
For anyone interested in F-class, my advice is to go to the local club, and speak to people, shoot with the club rifles and try different things before even thinking of buying anything. Realise that the costs involved are more than just a rifle.
Quote:
Originally Posted by steven
Those top 3 had a pretty good lead over the rest of us though!
Rem 700 Varmint dropped in a B&C stock on a Harris bipod and $600 scope here. I only shoot those 155gn Dyer's, because they're (I'm) cheap :D
Absolutely nothing wrong with the HBCs Kurt.
Can't blame the projectile if you miss :P
When do I miss?? :PQuote:
Originally Posted by 6x47
Thanks @ebf - will definitely follow your suggestion re: 'Try before you buy'. Having ears that are on their way out (too much noise - of every kind), I definitely need sound moderators on my rifle and on rifles nearby. $11500 hearing aids aren't all that flash for controlling excess noise :D. Budget will definitely restrict shooting to 'social activity' or being a 'detail filler' on the day. From the rules NZNRA put out for F-TR and FO, I've interpreted that moderators are acceptable. In my younger days (303, 7.62 NATO), military stocks made me a bit 'recoil shy'. Having popped some 'caps' on a 50 BMG, and a 500 S&W Magnum, in the States, I think I'm over this now :pacman:. While competition does improve your performance, LR shooting is a retirement hobby for me. So will probably have something along the lines of your Omark - without the 'upgrades' that you've put into yours. Time will tell if I have the ability - desire isn't a problem. :D.
'please' stop putting 'quotation marks' around every 'second' word
They're actually apostrophes.. ;)
