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hey guys, am sort of new to hunting and was wondering if anyone has a Howa 1500 223 I've just brought one and was wondering how it goes at ranges and how it affects shooting particularly deer, I've shot at a target from 100m but am yet to get out on a animal. and am also wondering if anyone has cut a barrel down its a 20'' barrel but was keen to cut it down to 18 possibly and was curious to know if anyone has done this and how it affected the gun and performance.
thanks
I have one of those rifles, I've shot fallow deer out to 230 meters. Just aimed in the crease where I normally would. I've found the hornady v max rounds are excellent at that range but not good at close range as they disintegrate if they hit bone.
leave barrel at 20" for now..... supress if you can afford it,to reshorten late will cost less than $150 and you can t add length back on.
when you can shoot CONSISTANTLY into a 3" area you could shoot a deer at same range but the 223 is at its best (some might say ethically only good for) under 150 yards....I will stretch that to 200 in perfect conditions for deer of pigs...wallabies hares etc as far as can make a hit.
I've got one on the mini action it's an awesome rifle I've shot fallow out to 300 yards in the right conditions.
I have used a lot of the Hornady 55 SP they are an awesome pill and cheap.
I just aim at the shoulder as they are a well constructed bullet.
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I've got a Howa 1500 in 223 with 1:12" twist. VERY accurate on range with factory Fiocchi SP 55gr ammo - well under 1" groups are the norm. Have shot this round in at 1" high at 100m which means point blank out to 170m - and needs 1-2" holdover at 200m. Used it on couple of varmint shoots so far and its accuracy very apparent in field - demolishes hares easily at 100-150 so far.
Trigger fully adjustable too.. Very effective rifle.
You’ll probably get some differing opinions on this. The .222 / .223 is the minimum legal deer cartridge on public land in NZ, and a lot of guys will say its not powerful enough for red deer in particular.
However many hunters use .223 without difficulty (me included), but you’ll find they are very fussy about shot placement and bullet construction, and rightly so.
What you need to do as a new hunter is study deer anatomy and understand exactly what you’re aiming at, and why. A lot of new hunters aim too far back behind the shoulder and that’s a guaranteed disaster with the .223. Lots written about this, it’s essential knowledge.
Bullet construction is really important. You need to look at the barrel twist which will be stamped on the barrel. If it is a new Howa it is 90% sure to be a 1:8”. This means you can select one of the 60+ grain soft points in standard ammunition, e.g. Federal Power-Shok 64gr (blue box) or Remington Core-Lokt 62gr.
Don’t select a varmint bullet like a V-Max.
It’s great that you’ve asked the questions, keep up with that. Lots to learn!
I'm in roughly the same boat, new to .223 as a hunting round. In addition to the wisdom above, there's some great info here:
https://www.nzhuntingandshooting.co....23-deer-64884/ and also found some great info here: https://www.ballisticstudies.com/Kno...Remington.html
From what I've read so far:
1. shot placement is critical (i.e. knowing where to hit and ability to hit it);
2. know the limitations of calibre/projectile (range and lethality), and;
3. be willing to let something walk on if it's not within (ethical) range, or doesn't present a clean shot.
My very non-scientific analysis has noticed that people on this forum who successfully use .223 on deer, all appear to have high levels of knowledge and experience... which sort of says it all.
Looking forward to hearing how you get on!
All good advice above.
The 223 is a capable round on deer with appropriate bullets and placement.
It does run out of energy pretty quickly tho and it doesnt have a hell of a lot to start with so while anyhing is possible a long range deer caliber it isnt.
Its a good 200m cartridge on deer and while I and others on here do shoot deer further than that I dont think any of us would recommend it for any further especially to someone starting out.
Mickys 3 inch circle is a good one.....when you can get every shot inside that circle everytime thats how far you can shoot.
Shortening the barrel will lose a bit of velocity and hence energy.....do you need to shorten it? Are you bush stalking?
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Originally Posted by Bradp
awesome thank you that's good to know, I'm currently using pmc ammo but also have some of the hunting and fishing brand ammo too have used only on targets at this stage but might have to look into that stuff at a later date thank you!
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Originally Posted by Micky Duck
perfect thank you have a dpt suppressor on it at the moment and it goes better with that on it, awesome thank you for that
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Originally Posted by 25/08IMP
awesome thank you might have to try that ammo at some point but probably need to practice shooting at shorter ranges for now anyway, good to know shoulder shot is ok to do though
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Originally Posted by mudgripz
awesome good to know thank you might need to do a bit of practice on targets to work my grouping out a bit more too as well thanks heaps.
oh that's awesome thank you, yeah lots to learn about and think about, have been reading some articles trying to better my knowledge a bit too so will be needing to do more of that to get my shot placement good thanks for the tip. that's good to know about the twist thank you ill have a look and think about the ammo side once I run out of my current stuff thank youQuote:
Originally Posted by Flyblown
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Originally Posted by yeah_na_missed
awesome thanks for that ill have to check those out today! thanks for the tips they are very helpful and ill let you know how I get on
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Originally Posted by veitnamcam
oh perfect thanks for that that's sort of what I'm gathering from it but by the sounds I should be able to get the distance I need out of it still after a bit of practice and mucking around. perfect thank you for that will be needing to do a bit more target shooting for practice thank you heaps, that's good to know I don't really need to shorten it as such not doing any bush stalking was just curious.
A great book to read through is Red Deer in New Zealand by Roger Lentle and Frank Saxton. (ISBN 9781869536466)
You can often find it in the local library.
Heaps of useful information in this book including a worthwhile chapter on shot placement.
YouTube has heaps of channels that look at bullet construction, and what bullets to use for what game. Quite a lot of the information presented is tainted by opinion which varies hugely from bloke to bloke. Some of the American guys for example will insist that you need a bonded bullet or that you must use a mono metal bullet like the Barnes.
The bottom line is that New Zealand red deer hunters have been using standard softpoint hunting bullets in .22 cal since the 60s and they didn’t have YouTube or Internet forums to tell them they were doing it wrong. Episode S07E02 (Back to School) of NZ Hunter Adventures had Willie Duley using an old Sako .222 with 50gr softpoints - watch that on the TVNZ app for an example of how to drop 3 deer for 3 shots, and where specifically he shot them. It’s no different to how you’d use your .223.
Don’t use the .223 on deer if you are flustered or rushed. It’s a caliber for cool heads and steady hands. But on the other hand it can teach you to shoot well and make correct bullet placement decisions.
I see you are in Otago, I recommend shooting rabbits with your 223. You get plenty of shots in and will be putting plenty of trigger time in.
I was running a 223 for rabbits and it really gets you into the zone of trigger control, body position, breathing and ranges , they are small at 250 - 400 mtrs plus . I learnt a huge amount varmint shooting.
It won't teach you where to shoot a deer but you will learn to be accurate and form some solid techniques.
I just tried the Targex 80grn in my Howa mini.223 they seem to shoot pretty well and same POA as the 69grn so it goes to show the Howa do shoot just finehttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...32cf711dec.jpgQuote:
Originally Posted by bs762
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Hey mate, what sort of speed are you getting with the 80gr, I'm hoping to put together a similar rifle to yours, it's looking promisingQuote:
Originally Posted by 25/08IMP
2824fps from a 20" with 2206Quote:
Originally Posted by c-dog
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Is that a quite hot load? Most I could get with 75gr ELDM in same rifle is 2750fps. Realize every rifle is different, makes me tempted to try the targetx 80grn!Quote:
Originally Posted by 25/08IMP
It's .5 above book max but seems ok in my rifleQuote:
Originally Posted by Hunty1
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perfect will have a look at that thank you, seems very useful and will watch that episode too thank you!Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyblown
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Originally Posted by Tahr
awesome thank you for that will keep in mind
yup I am, that's a good idea sort of been thinking of it but havent done it yet. that's good ill give it a goQuote:
Originally Posted by viper
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Originally Posted by 25/08IMP
aw awesome thank you that's good!
I have a Howa mini action also. It is cut down so the suppressor just about touches the stock. It has taken a lot of animals perfectly fine, hundreds of goats and a fair few deer.
I personally have a self imposed limit of 250 yards on deer as a little bit of wind drift or shooter error with the .223 is not ideal.
A good 55gr factory load is definitely the Hornady soft point stuff. The hunting and fishing branded ammo is just repackaged Belmont and I do believe the last batch of Belmont were made with Speer projectiles vs the usual Hornady 55gr. These do not shoot as well in my rifle as the Hornady ones and I have found they don't kill smaller animals such as goats as well as they are a bit hard.
I too am a fan of the heavier projectiles, 75gr eld and 77gr tmks. These are limited to hand loading however.
End of the day shot placement is key and as far as shoulder shooting goes not all projectiles are created equal and a shoulder bone on a big red deer is quite an ask for a little projectile particularly if it isn't of stout construction. Personally I would sooner slip it into the lungs.
awesome thanks for that good to knowQuote:
Originally Posted by TLB
Barnes TTSX lifts a 223 to the next level. Shot a few red and fallow with that combination with no problems - but I passed on a few shots as well as deer not relaxed and calm. Limit myself to 175m on deer. Load the Sierra #1455 as well for the 223 and can take out most small things to 250m easy. Got a license this year to shoot pukekos on maize block and longest was 300m on calm spring evenings sitting on the hill - great fun.