Thread: "Hunter Class" ?

Hello all - we are framing up a summer plate series and want to offer a "hunter class" I've looked at the NZDA and NRANZ definitions but Im not really liking them.

My thoughts at this stage are to keep it very very simple. Under 6.00kgs all up and all scopes set to 18x or less.

The series will be shot off mounds at 525Y and 625Y, prone. So maybe saying no F class style bipods but ??

We run our version of HC rules on our NZDA shoots. Rifle weight and scope max power is the easiest way.
We used to use a max barrel dia but with carbon wrapped barrels it's buggered that.
We don't allow shooting jackets, 3 point slings etc basic bipod no rear rest, non trigger hand must be infont of trigger and more than 75mm above the ground.


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Originally Posted by Tentman

Hello all - we are framing up a summer plate series and want to offer a "hunter class" I've looked at the NZDA and NRANZ definitions but Im not really liking them.

My thoughts at this stage are to keep it very very simple. Under 6.00kgs all up and all scopes set to 18x or less.

The series will be shot off mounds at 525Y and 625Y, prone. So maybe saying no F class style bipods but ??

I like it Tentman, keeping it simple. I talk to so many shooters/hunters that dont want to turn up to a gong shoot or a PRS match because they only have a "hunting" set up. And theyre intimidated by all the fancy rigs that we are seeing at these types of matches. I for one want to encourage as many people as possible to take up some form of shooting and this is an excellent starting point for many.

Could there be a stock style perhaps, say monte carlo hogs back style only?

Sounds like a reasonable weight and magnification limit.
I see a lot of hunter classes with overly restrictive requirements, I understand you need to draw a line somewhere but lots of people hunt with rifles that aren't just a Remingon 700 topped with a 3-9 VX1.

A basic weight limit, magnification limit and a bipod restriction is all you should need.

A minimum muzzle energy requirement will go a long way to levelling the playing field for deer hunters anyway. I think Taupo Branch used 100gr at 3000 fps which rules out most PRS rifles. Rabbit rifles and wallaby rifles can shoot another day …

I agree, some people are using bigger, higher power scopes now for regular hunting and a limit doesnt make much sense.

You dont want people reconfiguring their regular gun to meet your rules.

Instead of a weight limit why not use Jeff Cooper’s test that the shooter has to be able to hold the gun up with horizontal outstretched arm for 60 seconds ?

A problem with shooting competition in NZ is that there are so many different formats and rules its fragmented.

Another way to test “hunter shooting skills” is to carefully set each stage so there is little advantage in a semi-target set up. Announce beforehand there will be 20% of the points for standing unsupported and 20% requiring snap shooting ( < 10 sec per shot ) and that you’ll need to carry it 5 km and you’ll see “real hunting rifles“ on the day.

18x magnification seems quite a lot, is that what the average hunter is using these days? I’m not disagreeing, just curious about what is common now. Most people I know are using less than 10x but that’s not an indication of everyone else.

I have always liked the idea of taking part in a hunter class shoot, but I don’t like being up against PRS type setups with my 7x57 and 2-7x optics, and no bipod, and wouldn’t build a rifle just for the occasional shoot.

I would like to see this style of shoot happening more often though, I think it’s good for the sport in general.

Is a poll a good idea for feedback perhaps? Just my 0.02c

Originally Posted by -BW-

18x magnification seems quite a lot, is that what the average hunter is using these days? I’m not disagreeing, just curious about what is common now. Most people I know are using less than 10x but that’s not an indication of everyone else.

I have always liked the idea of taking part in a hunter class shoot, but I don’t like being up against PRS type setups with my 7x57 and 2-7x optics, and no bipod, and wouldn’t build a rifle just for the occasional shoot.

I would like to see this style of shoot happening more often though, I think it’s good for the sport in general.

Is a poll a good idea for feedback perhaps? Just my 0.02c

What sort of shoot are you talking about?
The original post is regarding a gong shoot all off a bipod, so effectively like NRA hunter class, which you could easily do with any hunting rifle.

If you are wanting to do a field shoot (more dynamic, different positions, PRS style, etc) but with a hunting rifle, then the GPRE shoots often have a hunter class, they used to always have a hunter class but they aren’t as popular for centrefire. If you wanted to do a 22lr shoot then there are lots of events with a hunter class.

Some thoughts on hunter class shoots. Firstly; over many years culling, NRA and NZDA shoots as well as clay competitions I observed that
where competitions are concerned there are always a number of persons who eant to win and will push the rules
of firearm and equipment types to
maximum specs to get maximum
advantage over others. I saw clubs
where young or less talented persons
eventually gave up attending because
of what they perceived as an uneven
playing field. Being on one such
committee I introduced a rule making
the scoring target as large as the
military spec for an open sighted smle
which was 3moa at 100 yards. A hit
inside this was worth 1 point and
outside this was 0. This rule removed
most of the advantages of flash
equipment and as a result
attendances boomed.
That was decades ago and hunting
has changed a lot since then
However I believe a similar principle could still be applied in todays world
when talking a fair "hunter class"
shoot.
Firstly, applying a weight limit: A fully wooded SMLE plus decent scope, sling and bipod could reach 12
pounds, so there is a suggested limit
for rifle. Scope power is immaterial
and for most practical hunting ranges
a large scope is no advantage bit if a
competitpr was dumb enough to use
20x mag at normal hunting ranges he
would disadvantage him her self so I
would not restrict scope size.
Where appropriate a bipod or pack can be used as a front support aid. No
rear support allowed.
Here's the key kicker:
Our game animals, goats, fallow, reds
, pigs et al generally have a vital kill
zone of about 10 inche--9 moa.
THIS WILL BE THE 1 POINT SCORE AREA AT ALL RANGES SHOT.
KICKER#2. The rules I suggest are these:
At 100m shooting is offhand only.Thrre shots inside 10" = 3 points.
Outside the 10" target = nil point.
At 200metres only position allowed is sitting. Same 10" vital zone target.
Three shots= 3 points for three hits
At 300 metres, prone with bipod or pack for front support is
allowed..Target remains at 10", which
at 300m is 3moa. Again, 1 point per
hit. Then back to 500 metres where
prone with front support is allowed.
Same 10" target, which is now
equivalent to about 1.5 moa.
This course of fire is not difficult for a decent shootrr and hunting rifle and
plenty should accomplish the course
with a good score.
The bbq and bs at days end along
with lessons learned is all that is
needed. If a prize table is desired, it
would be by drawn lots only
The objective is to simulate required accuracy and skill for clean kills at
sensible hunting ranges and to upskill
in field conditions but not so difficult
as to deter rank and file hunters.
Anyhoo, thats my suggestion for now

Originally Posted by Woody

Some thoughts on hunter class shoots. Firstly; over many years culling, NRA and NZDA shoots as well as clay competitions I observed that
where competitions are concerned there are always a number of persons who eant to win and will push the rules
of firearm and equipment types to
maximum specs to get maximum
advantage over others. I saw clubs
where young or less talented persons
eventually gave up attending because
of what they perceived as an uneven
playing field. Being on one such
committee I introduced a rule making
the scoring target as large as the
military spec for an open sighted smle
which was 3moa at 100 yards. A hit
inside this was worth 1 point and
outside this was 0. This rule removed
most of the advantages of flash
equipment and as a result
attendances boomed.
That was decades ago and hunting
has changed a lot since then
However I believe a similar principle could still be applied in todays world
when talking a fair "hunter class"
shoot.
Firstly, applying a weight limit: A fully wooded SMLE plus decent scope, sling and bipod could reach 12
pounds, so there is a suggested limit
for rifle. Scope power is immaterial
and for most practical hunting ranges
a large scope is no advantage bit if a
competitpr was dumb enough to use
20x mag at normal hunting ranges he
would disadvantage him her self so I
would not restrict scope size.
Where appropriate a bipod or pack can be used as a front support aid. No
rear support allowed.
Here's the key kicker:
Our game animals, goats, fallow, reds
, pigs et al generally have a vital kill
zone of about 10 inche--9 moa.
THIS WILL BE THE 1 POINT SCORE AREA AT ALL RANGES SHOT.
KICKER#2. The rules I suggest are these:
At 100m shooting is offhand only.Thrre shots inside 10" = 3 points.
Outside the 10" target = nil point.
At 200metres only position allowed is sitting. Same 10" vital zone target.
Three shots= 3 points for three hits
At 300 metres, prone with bipod or pack for front support is
allowed..Target remains at 10", which
at 300m is 3moa. Again, 1 point per
hit. Then back to 500 metres where
prone with front support is allowed.
Same 10" target, which is now
equivalent to about 1.5 moa.
This course of fire is not difficult for a decent shootrr and hunting rifle and
plenty should accomplish the course
with a good score.
The bbq and bs at days end along
with lessons learned is all that is
needed. If a prize table is desired, it
would be by drawn lots only
The objective is to simulate required accuracy and skill for clean kills at
sensible hunting ranges and to upskill
in field conditions but not so difficult
as to deter rank and file hunters.
Anyhoo, thats my suggestion for now

Shooting of your hind legs @Woody? Are you nuts?
Seriously the standing at 100, sitting at 200 and prone with a day pack rest at 300 was a shoot our NZDA branch shot 30 plus years back. I think it may have been with the Deer target but could have been with the round target. We did not use gongs and would not have known what they were at the time but we had a markers gallery on the range so we walked up to the next range with our rifles while the targets were marked. The bull on the deer targets was 200mm at that time (183mm for yards). At that time the Wilkinson was shot over 100 and 200 metres or yards with the reduced rings.
Regards Grandpamac.

Yep. Thats the reality Pops
Just btinging it up to the 21st century ay.

Out of interest I wonder how many ranges could satisfy the required range template requirements for running a shoot as Woody suggests or grandpamac remembers.

TPRA at TECT park limit the scope power to 6x power for their 300m champs shoot.

Originally Posted by woods223

Out of interest I wonder how many ranges could satisfy the required range template requirements for running a shoot as Woody suggests or grandpamac remembers.

Greetings,
Regrettably not many and none in Hawkes Bay to my knowledge. There will be ranges that have 100, 200 and 300 metres but the need for 500 metres could be a problem. The shoot could be split over two venues on separate days though. The markers gallery we had at Roy's Hill allowed us to run through the three ranges in 20 minutes or so you could fit a lot of details into an afternoon. The Wilkinson shoot was reduced to 100 metres or yards only and with smaller scoring rings about 20 years back likely due to the lack of ranges and interest.
Regards Grandpamac.

Originally Posted by grandpamac

Shooting of your hind legs @Woody? Are you nuts?
Seriously the standing at 100, sitting at 200 and prone with a day pack rest at 300 was a shoot our NZDA branch shot 30 plus years back. I think it may have been with the Deer target but could have been with the round target. We did not use gongs and would not have known what they were at the time but we had a markers gallery on the range so we walked up to the next range with our rifles while the targets were marked. The bull on the deer targets was 200mm at that time (183mm for yards). At that time the Wilkinson was shot over 100 and 200 metres or yards with the reduced rings.
Regards Grandpamac.

We run quite a few shoots along these lines shot on deer silhouette targets using a perspex scoring disc with no aim point.
Most are 4 position shoots shit at 100m but 1 is shot at 1,2 and 300m.
We have hunter class rules 4.8kg rifle weight and max 12 power.

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