With my 7mm mag I'm getting a good group at 100m but at 200m the group is 35mm to right and at 400m the group is close to 130mm to right.
I'm using a bipod off a bench rest with a sand bag at butt.
Could my problem be I'm not holding my rifle plum?
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With my 7mm mag I'm getting a good group at 100m but at 200m the group is 35mm to right and at 400m the group is close to 130mm to right.
I'm using a bipod off a bench rest with a sand bag at butt.
Could my problem be I'm not holding my rifle plum?
Is your scope level? If it's not level you'll be dialing on a angle
What wind conditions? What bullet?
What scope? Does it track straight? Are you shooting such that the reticle is plumb?
What does your zero look like at 100m?
How many shots to determine MPOI? Where is MPOI? At zero, and at 200 and 400.
In an extreme case (and lots for you to che k first), my mate had this on his rifle.
The rear holes in the reciever for the scope bases were out a touch to one side.
Bugger all I might add.
He was shooting long range way further than you.
Managed to get a carbide end mill the tapping size for the next size up screws, as I said, not by much, and it cleaned up.
He did a lot of checking and soul searching before he did it.
And yup it was it.
It was kicking the scope off in such a way that even though it was centered it threw them off further out.
You might have something similar?
Is your scope square to the reciever?
What sort of mounts, if they are the old school twist in with adjustable rear, maybe they need looked at
Dead calm.Quote:
Originally Posted by gimp
Berger 150Gr. Classic hunter.
Leupold VX 2-10 X 42CDS-ZL2 30MM Duplex
Not sure what "track straight" is, but locked down rifle/scope this morn. to check vari power POA at 140m through 2-10 power. OK.
Plumb reticle? Rain and wind got up so I could not check after shots this morn.
I only fire 2 shots as shots at 100m and 200m are 20mm apart.
My question is, if I say I am holding my rifle (right handed) with a scope lean to the left will that make my impact point go to the right and if so, further right, as the distance increases?
PS Rifle is a Tikka I bought new, well looked after but never used at more than 200m. Not interested in using CDS.
Scope is not level or not mounted aligned with the bore.
That is, if your rifle consistently shoots this way and you can discount wind or other factors.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gamehunter
When you say dead calm - what are you using to assess that? 1 m/s wind full effect would give you maybe 6cm of drift at 400. 1m/s is not very much wind.
Re: tracking straight - does the scope track in a straight line dead vertically ? is the tracking aligned with the reticle.
2 shots at 100m doesn't give you enough information to be confident in your zero. It might be good or it might not - could easily be a click or 2 off. Especially if you are basing your MPOI at longer ranges off equally small samples.
My scope rings are Sako Optilocks Tikka RM 30mm LO.Quote:
Originally Posted by 30.06king
You must have a curved barrel. :thumbsup:
As other have mentioned.
2 shot groups don't tell you anything. You need 5 shot groups.
Check scope is level with receiver with something better than mark 1 eyeball and zero it at 200m. Not 100m
In my view a 100m zero is better - easier to be precise and insignificant shift from environmental change.
https://youtu.be/OG8CchRYlDw?si=AQKrS9VgtRRkU-jR
Check out this how to mount a scope the right way from Paramount Tactical
Sent from my CPH2531 using Tapatalk
Your scope reticle needs to be level to your rifle and your rifle needs to be level when fired.
Sent from my CPH2531 using Tapatalk
True, but its a 7mm Mag, not a 303.Quote:
Originally Posted by gimp
Just zeroing at 100m would mask the issues he seems to have.
He's got a good range down the road from him, not too windy the times I've shot there.
I have my own range, more sheltered and closer to my smoko room.
Out to 400m if I choose. Kinda funny cos I can't ever recall shooting a deer over 220m.
Issues are possibly:
Poor zero
Wind
Cant
Bad scope
Or a combination of multiple
But. To have 130mm of windage from cant at 400m - you'd need 15-20 degrees of cant. You would need to be blind to accidentally have that. 1 or 2 or 3 degrees, sure. Which gives 2cm of error.
It likely isn't cant.
Maybe it is just you ? who is at fault . Shooting further out has a tendency to show up all those things that we tend to get away with when were only shooting up close and personal . One give away is that the error is not consistent , but then again the wind can be a real deceitful bitch .
For shooting past 350M or so you're just about wasting your time with anything less than a zero based on 10 shots - either to prove the rifle will group, or to actually zero from. Having said that heaps of people can still get a deer at 350 ish because "minute of deer" at that range is at least 250x250mm which is about 0.7 5Mil or 2.5 MOA and just about all decent rifles will do that, even 303s.
Where's your 100m group poi? Dead smack centre of the bullseye? If not there could be some of your error. If it's 15mm out at 100 then that very quickly becomes 30mm at 200m and so on, which would give you 120mm at 400?
If not dialling, scope not in true line with the bore. Could be several reasons for this, barrel not correctly aligned with the receiver, receiver mounting for the scope mount not aligned, mismatched rings, internal issue somewhere where it is shooting walleyed or pigeon footed but the last isn't likely.
Or, there's an outside chance that there is an internal error in the scope in that the internals of the scope aren't in line with the external tube or the scope is physically bent...
It doesn't need to be a huge error to create this sort of issue - but there is a reason for it and if you can repeat the results with different trigger pullers and on different days it ain't the puller.
An anology to this is the first attempts at military scoped rifles where they wanted to retain the functionality of the basic rifle, iron sights and charger loading and the scope was an additional aid for the marksman. To do this, they offset the scope to the left of the receiver leaving the top of the receiver open to allow access to the charger guides and the iron sights. Mounting the scope to the left meant that it had to be aligned at a known range and at shorter ranges the POI was left, longer it was to the right. Your situation is not quite as extreme but identical, it's now a case of finding out why.
Don't joke, seen this exact issue with one slightly curved barrel. Off to the left though. Straightened by an oldskool fella and problem sorted.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gibo
Thanks a lot you guys. I'll get a real shooter to see if he repeats my results.
If scope/base is not perfectly parallel to bore,eg it's slightly off to one side.the rifle zeroed at hundy will be off at two hundy...but typing that out it can only be out by same fly shit amount. If your rifle is kinked to the side,yes it will be off to side...and in theory slightly lower than expected too. Don't overthink it.130mm at 400 is not a huge amount.5" if it is a consistent thing you can compensate. Repeat test again twice and report back with results lol
If your scope is only 2 degrees off plump with bore centre.Scope and rifle bore height 2 inch radius.At zero yards yr true bullet hole will only
be 5.728mm to the opposite side of vertical plump line.At a 200yds of yr bullet holes will be off plump to the opposit side 5.728mm if you are zeroed at a 100yds.If yr scope was 6 degrees off plump you'd see if with one eye shut.At 400 yds you are drifting to the say right 17.81 mm (2 degrees off plump)for a start,I'd be happy a 100mm.
At 400 yds it ony takes a slight breeze to drift 130mm,that includes shooter error,scope aligment,trigger pull,the list goes on.At deer at 400yds is a big target,sholder 10 inch circle broad side.
Get the hundred yards near perfect,I cant but close.
Sorry 2 degrees should be 2.25mm on circumference of a 2inch radius circle.Correct me if I'm wrong,morning maths not that good.
See if it happens a second day.
Post some photos of the targets with a grid cm scale.
If you only fired 2 shot groups you’re wasting all these peoples time speculating.
Well with a Tikka and Optilocks it is not a problem with the mounting system it is the best factory setup there is, if the scope is ok is mostly likely shooter errorQuote:
Originally Posted by Gamehunter
or the bedding has gone off, I would shoot a 5 shot group at 200 metres off sandbags; bipods are not the best to shoot off a solid bench they bounce, the torque
from the rifling can throw the shot in the direction of the twist.
Your rifle is not sighted in properly. You now find it shoots to the right, after testing it at 200 and 300. So zero the rifle properly at 100 and fire four or five shots to check zero. (Do this after considering the below*)
To answer your other question, if you are leaning into the rifle one way and then holding it back on target, then yes it probably will shoot off. You can often tell that as the rifle will also recoil away to one side.
You should find out what the Natural Point Of Aim*is, and accomodate this in your shooting, and it will solve what you are talking about. It's basic shooting technique. There will be videos on Youtube. I thought that I invented it myself, but I then found out that people have been doing it for years.