When you’re out hunting (only the first shot counts), and shooting over 250m.
How accurate is your wind reading? e.g. +/-3km/h
In what wind conditions won’t you take the shot?
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When you’re out hunting (only the first shot counts), and shooting over 250m.
How accurate is your wind reading? e.g. +/-3km/h
In what wind conditions won’t you take the shot?
It's quite hard to tell. Animals move, turn, and contort. How big is the kill zone? Gusts and swirls can make a split second differences. The shooting position is sometimes less than the ideal benchrest conditions you would need to measure what the wind was after the fact and see how precise you were. Can you then confirm that you didn't just stuff up the shot? I've seen people miss and blame imaginary wind for it when their rifle was simply canted over. Were you actually holding where you thought you were holding on the animal? Will you be able to tell upon autopsy whether the shot drifted a couple inches further left or right than expected and that it was actually due to wind and wind alone? What are the ballistics like on your ammo?
I'll take a shot in moderate winds out to medium range, so long as I'm using a slippery bullet that's going to give the widest possible margin for error to help make me look good. I don't think I've ever tried to quantify how accurate my wind calls have been under field conditions.
I use an air rifle, and the pellets notice wind. So i got a cheap hand held wind meter. Went out on windy days mesured the wind and started to take notice of how it felt on my face, how much it blew the rifle,what the grass and trees were doing etc. Once i had a reasonable grasp on that I went to pellet movement in the wind taking careful well aimed shots.
Its improved my windage aimpoint shooting. Theres still a heap of variables but its got me in the ballpark to take an educated shot in wind. Ive bowled a rabbit over in 13km gusting to 20km wind at about 45m. It may have been a lucky shot but I had the confidance to take it and it worked
This could be useful for relating leaf/tree movement to wind speed.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beaufort_scale
I know it's not first shot stuff but if I am targeting a gully or hill face for rabbits and it's blowing I will quite often do a sighting shot at say a rock , take note of the wind drift and then I am generally good to go.
It is always a strange feeling actually aiming off the animal and allowing the wind to push it across to connect.
we were spotighting up in mackenzie country one night 30ish years ago @waimo might remember it?? Kerry n I were still hitting bunnies no trouble in the NW wind but the other guys gave up....when asked how I was doing it... "aim about 10" off upwind" was my reply....and agree 100% its a hard thing to get your head around.Quote:
Originally Posted by viper
Wind will destroy your shooting confidence and if your not using your cant level even worse.
It boils down to observation of conditions direction and a kestrel can take care of some of those things.
Who knows what aerodynamic jump is?
It is some thing I have seen firsthand with long windy shots having the wind direction out by 180°.
Shooting in the wind is about knowing your limits, and if shooting at animals not rocks stick to your limits as unethical animal shots are not a good look.
Sent from my SM-A226B using Tapatalk
I'd say if you're worried about wind you are too far away away and should get closer - its called "stalking" and its a very underated skill that is way easier to learn than making wind calls!
ouch, just went to web site,kestral lighten your wallet enough that youd run risk of blowing away in the wind.
Quality costs I guess.
Wind is a standard calculation in any shot. Wind can affect a shot at small distances too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tentman
Though i agree stalking is a most useful skill to have, so is knowing where your gun shoots in the wind. Exchanging the abilty to compensate for wind by stalking is not always an option.
Both are skills hunters should have and be used to best advantage.
I totally disagree that stalking is easier to learn than windage.
Stalking requires much more learning, from how to read the bush your in, observation of what animals ( birds particually) that are going to alert other animals as you move closer. Changes in wind as you pass through eddies and uplifts/ down draft( crossing thru gullies, coming over ridges To get closer to your target etc) that redistribute your scent. Moving quietly, moving slowly enough not to spook in close, restablishing where your taking your shot from that doesnt have obsticals in the way etc as oppossed to say shooting across a gully in a wind ( assuming you know how your projectile behaves in the wind)
I think as your stalking skills improve you forget how much your actually doing automaticaly and how much learned and practiced knowledge your appling.
But just my view.
^^ The above comments about wind are a perfect example of why misses occur. You cannot see wind, only indicators of it. Wind is 3 dimensional, just ask any experienced sailor. Its like a big swirly river. Across a gully you have zero indicators of what is happening between you and the target. There is a very good example of this effect often seen at the Section 22 shoot at Sparrowhawk. The target is acroos a gully. Plenty of bushes to give an indication at the target end (usually about 140M, so the equivalent of a 400M centerfire shot). Plenty of kestrels and instruments to read wind at the firing point. Plenty of very good shots with good rifles. BUT several times now Ive seen just about everybody miss at the generous target - there is a wind drifting above the ground in the path of the tio of the bullets trajectory. If you look further down the gully (as one maybe three of the cannier compeditors now do) you can see it moving the top of a willow tree.
Now how are you going the see that across a 400M gully with nothing to indicate it. On a target you'll be able to see splash (or someone with a spotter might) and call you in. On game its either a miss or a gutshot animal. Either way not a good outcome. Doesnt mean shooting game in the wind is bad, but it takes more experience and practise than most people think.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gh6pXPb-7Jg
This Vid was sent to me by a mate. Pretty useful in an easy to understand explanation.
I've always found the uplift more challenging to allow for than the horizontal and this simplifies it.
I use a wind meter or the more accurately named anemometer from Ali-Express ($25). So my wind correction will be based on a wind reading from the wind meter at the firing point.
However, the problem is that very often a wind’s strength and direction can be different down range than it is at the firing position. Unless it is a wind from in front (12 o'clock), I haven't been able to accurately read the wind at distance. I think this is a skill that is never fully mastered.
I’m pretty hesitant these days taking shots on animals in obvious wind. If it’s calm enough then i’ll stretch the legs but if there’s a decent breeze or ‘wind’ then I reel in my expectations. Let some good stags walk back in July at 5 - 600 where on a good day they would have been dead but it was just too windy and risky at the time for a shot. Learnt the lesson a few times, especially hunting when shots are often in random and completely new places. Different if you have experience with a certain position and target area in different conditions - IE you know what to expect. I get a lot of satisfaction pulling off a good long shot but I also get a lot of satisfaction going back to my bush stalking roots and getting close enough to confidently put the shot wherever I want.
The reason for asking is after reading The Maximum Effective Range of Small Arms. I realised how much wind affects maximum range. Let’s say you have a 0.3mil (~1moa) rifle and your deer vitals are 200mm across. I thought you’d be good out to 667m (200/0.3). But now adding wind in let’s say you’re accurate to +/-3km/h (I’ll assume that’s 0.15mil at 450m). That max range is now 450m. The target is 0.44mil, and the wind error plus the rifle is 0.45mil.
Don't use Beaufort for shooting, it is utterly useless for that.
You can get far without a Kestrel.
Shooters that sink their skill into Kestrels and calculators tend to miss out on practical application.
Start here, relevant to this thread windcalls, their resolution and practical efficiency is explained in episode 352 to 355. Plenty info to get you off to a good start.
https://youtu.be/Pi17Uvq_bXY
Gotta be a good 6inch of deflection in that scenario. Well done eh!Quote:
Originally Posted by kruza
I stuffed up the math a bit. When combining errors you: square them, add them, and then take the square root.
Now with a rifle accuracy of 0.30mil (~1moa) and a wind error of 0.32mil (±3km/h, ±0.16mil) at 450m. The combined error is √(0.30² + 0.32²) = 0.44mil. 450m x 0.44mil = 198mm.
Caliber accounts for a lot of wind deflection. 7mm is the sweet spot. Lighter caliber blow easier bigger calibers need a mountain of powder to compete at range with the ballistics of a 7mm. Long sleek heavy pills pushed fast are good at fighting the wind and gravity
My approach is to look at how many inches of defection I have at one meter per second, the kill zone devided by that defection decides if the shot is on.
With my 284 I get 2' of drift in a full value wind at 400 yards, if my kill zone is 12 inches (lungs to base of neck) then I've got 6 inches either side of point of aim, so that's 3ms of error I can live with. If dial for 3ms than I'm good from perfectly still to 6ms (which is a gale), I would always allow an extra ms, three become 4, because there is obviously some wind.
honestly I couldn't tell you.Quote:
Originally Posted by T.FOYE
As an air rifle shooter the distance I shoot is rather small.
I've just gone out to my target range in various strength winds measured the wind speed, then shot targets and remembered the mildot windage at those distances.
Not scientific but true to real world situations.