Thread: Pair of Ross Rifle projects

Would you mind putting up some close up photos of the action and bolt please.

@-BW- Good to hear there are a few around, I think the action is a brilliant design. I would rebarrel in 30/303 if you decide you want to shoot it! That said if you ever want to part with it you know where to find me, I would love to do another one up!

Sidetrack - A few more pics for you, let me know if you want to zoom on anything specific

That’s great thank you. As mentioned, these are a straight pull action so the lug end of the bolt rotates as it enters the chamber and locks. Is that how it works??

@Sidetrack Yes pretty much, I have found a picture from an old MKII manual below (which is the same principle slightly different execution), the bolt body is cut with helical grooves that align with grooves in the bolt sleeve to cause the rotation. There are 7 locking lugs which make it quite a strong action.



I know it has been mentioned on here before on an old post of mine, re the safety issue off assembling the bolt incorrectly. I have taken mine apart several times, and have failed to assemble it incorrectly in a way it will both fit into the rifle and fire. I have no doubt it could happen, especially in a hurry, and of course I am doing it with the hindsight of knowing it can be done wrong but it generally seems safe to me.

@kip13 what is the metal finish / re finish that you have used in these restorations and how were the original rifles finished ?

@akaroa1 they are refinished in cerakote - Midnight Black - Which basically gives the same final colour as bluing near enough. The original factory rifles would have been blued, but the one that is now 30/303 was basically bare metal and rust when I got it. The .280 had hardly any bluing left as well.

Greetings @kip13 and all,
Really nice to see old rifles still shooting. The Ross rifles and the .280 Ross cartridge were revolutionary at the time they were introduced as were the Newton series of cartridges. You seldom hear of them today.
Regards Grandpamac.

Originally Posted by kip13

@Sidetrack Yes pretty much, I have found a picture from an old MKII manual below (which is the same principle slightly different execution), the bolt body is cut with helical grooves that align with grooves in the bolt sleeve to cause the rotation. There are 7 locking lugs which make it quite a strong action.

Attachment 227695

I know it has been mentioned on here before on an old post of mine, re the safety issue off assembling the bolt incorrectly. I have taken mine apart several times, and have failed to assemble it incorrectly in a way it will both fit into the rifle and fire. I have no doubt it could happen, especially in a hurry, and of course I am doing it with the hindsight of knowing it can be done wrong but it generally seems safe to me.

When I first viewed the photo of the bolt design just seemed familiar to me. I think it just reminded me of maybe a naval artillery breechlock. Just looks similar. It’s an elegant piece of design work of which the principle carries over to a number of modern actions if I’m not mistaken. Not sure about the modern straight pulls though.
Thanks again for sharing. They are such a neat firearm and once again still fully operational over a hundred years later!!

Originally Posted by kip13

@-BW- Good to hear there are a few around, I think the action is a brilliant design. I would rebarrel in 30/303 if you decide you want to shoot it! That said if you ever want to part with it you know where to find me, I would love to do another one up!

Sidetrack - A few more pics for you, let me know if you want to zoom on anything specific
Attachment 227688
Attachment 227689
Attachment 227690
Attachment 227691
Attachment 227692

Would you mind deeper explanation of the feeding and ejection systems please ?
Looks to me as if it could be Controlled Round Feed with that beefy extractor on the bolt. But, the feed ramp ( difficult telling for sure from your pic ) seems to have quite a shallow angle so maybe push feed ?
From your pics I am unable to determine what eject spent brass. Could you please explain and maybe show with another pic ?

Congrats on your restoration job. You should be proud of the result.

Originally Posted by 30.06king

Would you mind deeper explanation of the feeding and ejection systems please ?
Looks to me as if it could be Controlled Round Feed with that beefy extractor on the bolt. But, the feed ramp ( difficult telling for sure from your pic ) seems to have quite a shallow angle so maybe push feed ?
From your pics I am unable to determine what eject spent brass. Could you please explain and maybe show with another pic ?

Congrats on your restoration job. You should be proud of the result.

Greetings @30.06king,
I do understand the question but have to wonder what difference it makes. The Ross action is straight pull so its ability to chamber and extract tight ammunition is limited. This was reported as a problem in 1915 in battlefield mud. None of this should be a problem in hunting or casual target shooting provided pressure are kept in normal ranges. Both the .280 Ross and .303 cartridges are quite tapered that aid extraction and Ross military rifles often have chambers cut on the large side to aid chambering.
The Ross rifles were at their best as target and sniper rifles where accuracy was King.
Regards Grandpamac.

Originally Posted by grandpamac

Greetings @30.06king,
I do understand the question but have to wonder what difference it makes. The Ross action is straight pull so its ability to chamber and extract tight ammunition is limited. This was reported as a problem in 1915 in battlefield mud. None of this should be a problem in hunting or casual target shooting provided pressure are kept in normal ranges. Both the .280 Ross and .303 cartridges are quite tapered that aid extraction and Ross military rifles often have chambers cut on the large side to aid chambering.
The Ross rifles were at their best as target and sniper rifles where accuracy was King.
Regards Grandpamac.

Hi @grandpamac ,
Appreciate the background and insight. My question was basically driven by curiosity re the mechanics of the action. The OP posted great pics but I still couldn't figure out every feature incorporated into this action and I wanted to know. I know Ross rifles ( among other older types ) remain well regarded by knowledgeable shooters right up to today so they must have something quite unique going for them.
I haven't done so but I guess I should find some reading on the topic that might fill in my knowledge gaps.
Please feel free to add more of your own wisdom if so inclined.

Hi @30.06king

I have attached a couple more pictures that should help, the first is a round in the mag which is essentially the same as any Mauser style mag of the time. The round pops up and into the extractor in the style of controlled round feed.



And for the ejection, it is just a spring loaded bit of steel, pointed out in this picture, which flicks the spent case out.



Let me know if that answers your questions! Happy to provide more pictures if needed.

Originally Posted by 30.06king

Hi @grandpamac ,
Appreciate the background and insight. My question was basically driven by curiosity re the mechanics of the action. The OP posted great pics but I still couldn't figure out every feature incorporated into this action and I wanted to know. I know Ross rifles ( among other older types ) remain well regarded by knowledgeable shooters right up to today so they must have something quite unique going for them.
I haven't done so but I guess I should find some reading on the topic that might fill in my knowledge gaps.
Please feel free to add more of your own wisdom if so inclined.

Greetings,
I found a picture of the Ross bolt face and it would probably be classed as a controlled round feed. Worshiping rifles with controlled round feed is pretty much a US thing due to their experience with the Springfield, Enfield and Pre 64 Winchester Model 70. The feature was developed by Mauser to stop jams caused by raw soldiers short stroking the bolt. Some think it is the best thing since sliced bread but it does have some problems. The most recent one of these is difficulty of feeding the short fat cartridges or those the action was not designed for. The US made actions mentioned often had a coned breech and poor gas handling meaning the action was not as safe as others if a case ruptured. This was more common in earlier times. None of this applies to the Mauser actions.
Regards Grandpamac.

And not all mauser controlled round feed actions actually do that properly.
There is a lot of bad press of cheap quick manufacturers rechambering rifles in Africa for dangerous game work.
It isn't as east as that. Mauser made something like 24 different mag boxes for different cartridges to help make them feed correctly.
There is also a Smith I have heard of in the African forum I'm on that knows how to make this happen.
Can make them feed upside down.

I know someone with an action (not sure which model sorry), with just a short stub of barrel. He wanted to fit a new barrel but struggled to find a smith happy to work with that strange action thread you mentioned.

I will ask what he wants to do with it on your behalf.