Thread: Pump Action STEN MKII

Originally Posted by gundoc

If such a useless piece of equipment was made in NZ it would have to be a locked breech 10 shot repeater, either turn bolt or other form of locking. It would have to be striker or hammer fired, and be over 762mm long. In short it would not remotely resemble a Sten, apart from cheap and flimsy manufacture. Legally (at present), no problem to manufacture as an individual for their own use, or by a dealer for resale but that would all change if the current bill in parliament is passed. A 9mm carbine would be a reasonably useful short-range item for small to medium game, but something built like a Sten would be false economy. Having owned all models of Sten from the Mk I to the Mk V, plus a few other clones and adaptations, I can assure you none of them were ever anything better than 'adequate'!

Suppose in dire 1941 when fighting for survival 'adequate' made you feel really good.

The adequate design is part of a bigger picture of how the British did things. I read about the "boffin" technological warfare in WW2, suitcase radios etc. The British had a policy of "You have 3 months to develop it, and what you can come up with is what we'll produce!" On the other side, Germans took too long perfecting their designs with top brass also keeping on "improving" specifications .... so most of their otherwise brilliant developments were of zero to limited use as they did not enter mass production. An obvious example are the many Volkssturm simplified rifles made which cost a lot in R&D and tooling setup, but which all used StuGw-44 magazines. Ian 'Gun Jesus' at Forgotten Weapons pointed out that it would have been far more effective just to make more StuGw-44s.

Anyway, I digress. I'm interested in your take on the Patchett/Sterling SMG versus the Sten, they being of similar vintage.

Originally Posted by Cordite

Suppose in dire 1941 when fighting for survival 'adequate' made you feel really good.

The adequate design is part of a bigger picture of how the British did things. I read about the "boffin" technological warfare in WW2, suitcase radios etc. The British had a policy of "You have 3 months to develop it, and what you can come up with is what we'll produce!" On the other side, Germans took too long perfecting their designs with top brass also keeping on "improving" specifications .... so most of their otherwise brilliant developments were of zero to limited use as they did not enter mass production. An obvious example are the many Volkssturm simplified rifles made which cost a lot in R&D and tooling setup, but which all used StuGw-44 magazines. Ian 'Gun Jesus' at Forgotten Weapons pointed out that it would have been far more effective just to make more StuGw-44s.

Anyway, I digress. I'm interested in your take on the Patchett/Sterling SMG versus the Sten, they being of similar vintage.

Although the Sten and the Patchett/Sterling guns have the same operating principle they are as different as chalk and cheese. Whilst the stamped-out Sten was a clever product of dire emergency and quite adequate for the short-term purpose, The Patchett/Sterling guns were designed and built to last, and work a lot more reliably. The first thing is the magazine, the Sten having a troublesome single feed, double stack system in a flimsy housing that with a little use flopped around like a dick in a top hat, and the magazine side walls were susceptable to dents and dings which caused jams. The Sterling mags were designed with stepped side walls for strength and were curved to suit the slight taper on the cartridges. That coupled with the double feed, double stack system and the unique and friction-free roller follower made them the most reliable SMG magazine ever made. Other Patchett/Sterling features that led to them to being considered the 'Rolls Royce' of SMG's include the trigger mechanism machined from solid bar and properly heat-treated, a bolt that incorporated crud-scraping grooves, a sturdier body, improved stock and better ergonomics, better sights, stronger ejector, better magazine catch, etc, etc. Sterlings that were made in the 1950's are still going strong today, and they remained in production well into the 1980's.